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Telling The Difference...

Discussion in '288GTO/F40/F50/Enzo/LaFerrari' started by 134282, Nov 20, 2004.

  1. 134282

    134282 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Carbon McCoy
    i've learned a lot on here in the last two years... So now, if i come across something i haven't learned here, i think it'd only be right that i share it with all of you... Not sure how trivial this is; it may not matter to some of you and some of you may even know this already... But it matters to me and i'm hoping other folks will find it useful, too...

    Telling the difference between a US spec & Euro Spec NNO...

    If you're in the US and you see an NNO, chances are, it's a US spec NNO; if you're in Europe and see an NNO, chances are, it's a Euro spec NNO (if you're in Canada, you need to look at the gauges. :D)...

    However, sometimes Euro spec cars make it over to the states and US cars definitely make it over the Europe from time to time... So it's not to be able to tell the difference... Now, the first clue would be to look for a VIN plate at the bottom of the windshield, on the driver's side... If you see the 17 VIN, then you know it's a US or Canadian car... If there's no VIN plate present, then you know it's a Euro... However, maybe you can't get to the front of the car or can't get that close to the car (VIN plates, ironically, are usually tucked away)... So the next best thing to do is look at the rear lights...

    Picture A
    In Picture A, you'll see that i've circled the two outer rear lights of the NNO... The centers of these lights, like the centers of the two inner rear lights, are white or clear. This tells you that the car is US spec...

    Picture B
    In Picture B, you'll see that the centers of the two outer rear lights are orange, not white or clear like the centers of the two inner rear lights; this tells you that the car is Euro spec...

    If, for some reason, you can't see the back of the car, thus you're unable to decipher the spec of the car by it's rear lights, you can tell by the side marker lights in the rear, only... All front side marker lights on NNOs are orange... However, the rear side marker lights are different...

    Picture C
    In Picture C, you'll see that the rear, side marker lights are red; this tells you that the car is US spec...

    Picture D
    In Picture D, you'll see that the rear, side marker lights are orange - not red like US cars - orange rear side marker lights tell us that this car is Euro spec...


    Picture A in this demonstration is 134282; Picture B features 136739 (a picture i found on the internet - probably hear); Picture C features 134282 again; Picture D features 128783, a portion of a photograph taken by Sebastien Morliere...

    Please note that i'm not sure of the spec differences for Australian/Middle Eastern/Asian countries; i only know the spec differences between US/Canadian NNOs and European NNOs... Should i learn something different about other countries' specs and the differences on the cars, i'll certainly post them... If you know anything you'd like to share regarding these differences, please don't hesitate... Thanks.
     
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  3. 285ferrari

    285ferrari F1 World Champ
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    NNO, THanks for the info--when it's explained like you did with the pictures it is very easy to understand and learn things like this. Thanks for the info. Maybe once a week you can pick a car or another detail of the Enzo and do this. Very informative.
     
  4. 134282

    134282 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Thanks, Robbie... i didn't realize i'd explained it in such a simplistic fashion; i probably did that unconsciously because i, myself, have trouble learning and grasping things...

    i wish i knew enough about Ferraris to do something new each week; that's a good idea, though; maybe someone else, like Sfumato or ZJPJ or, of course, LWA, can do something like that...
     
  5. Titanboy_24

    Titanboy_24 Formula 3

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    Lucas Scarfone
    I noticed they are all black NNO's ;)!
     
  6. Sfumato

    Sfumato F1 Veteran
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    Thanks, and nicely done. Lots of guys newer to game don't know useless trivia like some of us do. This would be a good bi-weekly sticky. Obscure car game should be a sticky too. Zach knows his cars. And Kare, Boudewijn, Old Guy, Jim, Miltonian, Writerguy, Bill Sawyer...
     
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  8. judge4re

    judge4re F1 World Champ

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    Dr. Dumb Ass

    Cool, NNO's becoming one of "us". We need young blood to carry the traditions...
     
  9. Sfumato

    Sfumato F1 Veteran
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    No lie Erik. Zach and NNO, MarkPDX all have the force in them...How are ya?
     
  10. judge4re

    judge4re F1 World Champ

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    Doing well my friend. Meet in "live chat"?
     
  11. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Jim Glickenhaus
    You can learn new things all the time. For example last weekend I learned the Terminal velocity of a 355 with a Police light bar is 174. I also learned why they blocked off the nose inlet of the MK-IV's at Le Mans with cardboard. After cruising at about that speed for 20 minutes the water temp got too low. (Ambient air was about 50 deg. F).

    I also learned that if you pull into the track in a 166s as my son did you'll probably be driving around on a red Vespa with a Babe on the back within 4 minutes.
     
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  13. bludevil12

    bludevil12 Formula 3
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    Awesome!! I was wondering about that..kinda disturbed when I got my Enzo model and the inner lights were orange..WTF..did they make a mistake or what? Thanks for clearing that up, and I agree the pictures really did help!
     
  14. 134282

    134282 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Hey, i didn't even realize that - it certainly wasn't intentional... :D


    Thanks, Sfumato & Erik; i wish i knew enough useful, relevant information about the NNO to post something every week... In time, i guess...


    LOL, Jim; these wasn't a single girl there that wasn't all over him... it was amazing...


    Looking back on my initial post, i should apologize for some of the grammar; i don't know what the hell was wrong with me when i wrote it... Sorry.
     
  15. 134282

    134282 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    LOL, i wondered about that; mostly though, about why ALL models seem to be built by European spec... The 1:18 Hot Wheels NNOs are lacking some detail... The Redline Racer 1:43 NNO models are unbelievably detailed... At three figures, though, they're out of my reach... i just saw some today, though; They've got black, white, yellow, red & silver - they really look awesome... They're only making 500 apparently... If you can, get yourselves one, immediately... :)
     
  16. Sfumato

    Sfumato F1 Veteran
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    You raised him well, Jim, truly.
     
  17. Greg G

    Greg G F1 Rookie

    thats great Carb, but how about something alittle harder... I've noticed some Enzos have a shroud over the suspension pumps, and some do not (see photo). I assume the covers were introduced later in the production run, as Emenasce's car is an early car, and does not have them.

    Any thoughts?
     
  18. ferrarifixer

    ferrarifixer F1 Veteran
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    That's a shock absorber canister. Gas pressure is stored there and can be mechanic (or driver) adjusted to affect the stiffness of the car. It's not a pump.

    And, as many times as I've seen it now, I still read NNO as "nunno". ENZO is only one more letter...is it really that hard to write it out.?!
     
  19. 134282

    134282 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Greg... Good question... To be perfectly honest, i have no idea... However, in the first picture below, you'll see that 128799 - an NNO made before EMenasce's NNO - has one of those things...

    In the second picture, you'll also see those thingies; the second picture is an official Ferrari photo, so i would assume that all NNOs come with those thingies and maybe EM's were replaced or taken off or whatever... If you'll notice, there are these metal wires that go from them to bigger, cylindrical-type things; those things are connected to the shock absorbers... i looked through some pictures of various Euro & US NNOs, both before and after EM's and all of the pictures i have, have those things you point out... Do you have a picture of EM's that you can post that shows these things are missing...? i would like to see it... Thanks...
     
  20. 134282

    134282 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Awesome...! Thanks for the explanation...! :)
     
  21. Sfumato

    Sfumato F1 Veteran
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    Those gold finned things are oil reservoirs for the shocks. Those are lines, not wires going to the shock bodies. All NNO's should have these. The reservoir is finned for cooling, as the oil gets hot when shock moves. The muffler can is directly below the crossmember they are mounted on, so a non-metal shroud here would not live very long. The second pic wasn't a photo, but a cutaway, and I can't tell if that's what you guys are referring to or not. Circle/outline it or something. Thingies and dealies???
     
  22. 134282

    134282 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Dude, how do you know all this...?
     
  23. Sfumato

    Sfumato F1 Veteran
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    Once a racer/restorer, ALWAYS a racer/restorer. Fox shocks were the first IIRC to have separate oil reservoirs for shocks. Common now. I don't know who OEM supplier is for NNO. Sachs, Koni both have these out there, best guess is Sachs.
     
  24. VROOM!!!

    VROOM!!! Formula 3

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    I just read every post in this thread and i learned SO much i didn't know.... Please keep it going. Just throw out any random facts about ENZO's.... Awesome!

    Thanks Carbon!
     
  25. Sfumato

    Sfumato F1 Veteran
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    BTW, on the outside ends of the shocks, you can see the wires going to the valve bodies of the shocks near the outboard spring seats. These are cockpit adjustable and change the way the oil flows in the shock, thus changing the damping. It also is adjusted by a computer as well during launch control and severe braking, etc.
     
  26. ferrarifixer

    ferrarifixer F1 Veteran
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    To help clarify further, the wires power the servo's which twist the shaft. This affects MAINLY the rebound, which has the biggest impact on performance. The canister has adjustment on it which affects MAINLY the BUMP, and is useful for trimming the balance of the car.

    Over time, the gas pressure inside can leak out, and pressure should be checked once in a while.

    If anyone has the specs though, it'd be interesting to see.

    The gas is almost definitely Nitrogen (and pressure may be something like 7-12 Bar, maybe more or less, but that kind of range), or it is in all race shocks I've used. But I suppose there may be something else in there.

    If you should find yourself running out of adjustment either way, you can raise or lower the pressure and start all over!
     
  27. Korr

    Korr F1 World Champ
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    Correct me if I am wrong, but those canisters contain gas (usually nitrogen), and not oil. You can see the recharging nipple in that post. The gas reduces oil cavitation, therefore making the action action of the oil flowing through the valve more consistent.
     
  28. Sfumato

    Sfumato F1 Veteran
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    Enzo uses electro-hydraulic shocks, I believe. There should be gas in there too, but I believe it has a magneto-rhealogic fluid which actually does the damping. Electrical charges then change the viscosity of the valves and fluid(like silly putty, which is soft until high shear forces make it hard and it bounces. Corvette uses a Bilstein variant).

    I can't get to my NNO lit right now, but I googled a quick summary from Audi :

    Or, I'm full of crap ;)

    PS, the gas needed would be under very high pressure, which is why they're usually sealed. Those little lines would go BOOM.
     

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