testarossa bad running on cold start | FerrariChat

testarossa bad running on cold start

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by ross lillywhite, Oct 4, 2009.

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  1. ross lillywhite

    Mar 19, 2008
    41
    Reading Uk
    Full Name:
    Ross Lillywhite
    got a euro 89 testarossa, had the , fires up for a second, then runs for 10 secs and third start runs at 500 rpm running rough till it warms up, then runs great traced to a bad c relay got one from ricambi and car ran great for 4 days and now back to the same rough starting as before. but with voltage at the red wire at the temp switch...
    cold i have 12.3v at battery, at solenoid and to c relay t30
    cranking, rough running 11.5 v to c relay on t15
    out i have 12.3 v on t87, and 12.3 on red wire and good ground on t31
    but as the bad cold running goes to good running i get 14.5 volts at red wire at c relay and at temp switch.
    cant understand why problem came back and i have good voltage at red wire [ 12.3 v on rough running ]
    also i only get 8.8 v at starter injectors for i second, should be 12 + ? have done many searches which got me to the c relay diagnosis, any help please
     
  2. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Jan 11, 2001
    26,932
    30°30'40" N 97°35'41" W (Texas)
    Full Name:
    Steve Magnusson
    #2 Steve Magnusson, Oct 4, 2009
    Last edited: Oct 4, 2009
    Does the transistion from bad running to good running always occur at the same indicated temperature on the water temperature gauge, or is it more random?

    Because the voltage coming from the alternator would be different values under different conditions, there are voltage regulators inside the injection ECUs that produce a steady 8V to run the injection system. Since 12.3V is still much above 8V, I wouldn't think that should cause the injection system grief, but having this bimodal condition of 12.3V DC or 14.5V DC doesn't seem like a good sign for the alternator. You might also try measuring the AC voltage between the battery terminals when it is showing 12.3V DC or 14.5 V DC -- a high AC value (anything over like ~0.5 VAC) would be another bad sign for the alternator.

    Not great, but, if you are getting a quick initial first light-off during cold cranking, it must be enough to open the cold start injectors. The +12V signal does pass thru many relays and connections, so if you'd like to try tracing it backwards to see if it's a little higher somewhere upstream, the path is:

    cold start injectors - t87 on relay E (...113 in the black box) - t30 on relay E - t30 on relay D (...101 in the black box) - t87a on relay D - the CN (orange/black) wire on the water thermoswitch - the R (red) wire on the water thermoswitch (where you are already getting +12.3V or 14.5V).
     
  3. ross lillywhite

    Mar 19, 2008
    41
    Reading Uk
    Full Name:
    Ross Lillywhite
    bad cold running doesnt last long enough to register on the temp gauge. maybe 2 to 5 mins, it seems depending on outside air temperature, was really chuffed when i put a new c relay in and fixed the fault. couldnt believe it when it started playing up again and thought a dodgy relay had been supplied. but getting battery voltage up to red wire.
    but if ecu,s only require 8v then could it be temp switch [ red wire going to ] aux air valves not bringing fast idle up, must have used 3 cans of electrical cleaner the last 3 weeks.
    tacho in car doesnt move until car 3rd start up when running at 500 rpm, normal ?
    thanks for this ,its driving me mad.
     
  4. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Jan 11, 2001
    26,932
    30°30'40" N 97°35'41" W (Texas)
    Full Name:
    Steve Magnusson
    Definitely not normal -- and indicates that you have an ignition problem. Verify if you do, or do not, have spark on both banks during the initial starting attempts. If the 7-12 bank is not working, this will definitely give the symptom of "cranks, fires, runs for 10 seconds, stalls" (because the tachometric relay will turn off the fuel pump relays if it isn't receiving the proper signal from the 7-12 coil+power module when you release the key to Pos II).
     
  5. ross lillywhite

    Mar 19, 2008
    41
    Reading Uk
    Full Name:
    Ross Lillywhite
    just went and tried it and it started perfect, as it had been running 2 hours ago, and it seems to need to be really cold to run rough. will try when i come home from work tomorrow if both banks spark on initial start up. but tacho works and still runs rough at 500 rpm when cold start up.
     

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