The end of Ferrari, as we know it

Discussion in 'Ferrari Discussion (not model specific)' started by johnk..., Jun 16, 2022.

  1. paulchua

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    Great post and I generally agree with this. Many vintage Ferrari, take the vaunted F355 - can be outrun by many plebeian models today. Yet, it will always be special and I argue preferred!

    However, I argue the 'top' of the pyramid will always have differentiation even if the margins are ever so small. That's why I keep mentioning the watch market. A Richard Mille tells time WORSE than a $10 Casio - yet here it is.
     
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  3. paulchua

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    Yeah, Ferrari is dead. Sell all your stock.
     
  4. mwr4440

    mwr4440 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Why pay $5x for the SAME Tech?

    Other than the coach-work, an EV Trabant and EV Ferrari will be the SAME Car.


    EV anything is just TRANSPORTATION:

    FROM: Point A,

    TO: Point B.
     
  5. paulchua

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    I sympathize, truly on the concept of 'forcing' anything on the market. It reeks of anti-capitalism, I will say no more since that's a P&R subject.

    However, I simply point out that's a very different argument from the merits or demerits of an EV. There is social commentary, then there is technical. I just find it illuminating that when discussing the former, most folks keep relying on the latter to dissuade the transition. This is beyond irony.
     
  6. paulchua

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    What I don't understand though is why are we now talking about the energy efficiency of a Ferrari?

    When did that ever become something top of mind?
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    Some of us know when it becomes top of mind, the detractors least of all.

    Cognitive dissonance is truly an interesting thing when witnessed.
     
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  8. JTSE30

    JTSE30 F1 Rookie

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    #256 JTSE30, Jun 23, 2022
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2022
    You mean the average distance to the sun being 25% closer than the earth and the day length being 2802 hours has nothing to do with it?

    Not only that, if you look here you will plainly see that increases in CO2 have nothing to do with oil usage (note the CO2 is steadily rising despite large pullbacks in oil consumption)

    And, on the second chart below you will plainly notice that we are simply coming out of a series of little ice ages, we are no where near any exceptional situation at all...

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    and, by the way, Mars has about the same concentration of CO2 in its atmosphere as Venus and is about 43% further away from the sun as the Earth...Mars is quite cold...
     
  9. paulchua

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    I personally believe that you're sort of right, that we won't ever run out of oil - the earth is just too vast. "running out of something" though is different than "having less of something." Just check prices on Beluga Caviar.

    That said, even countries like Saudi Arabia that have every interest to reject "Peak Oil" subscribes to the notion.
     
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  10. paulchua

    paulchua Cat Herder
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    I've long been convinced two folks in good faith can have legitimate disagreements. In terms of "Global Warming," I'm willing to bet that nothing anybody can say, show, would change your mind - that's totally fine! That's the beauty of these forums - folks in good spirit can disagree.

    What I'm having a hard time understanding though, is what does Global Warming have to do with the speed, utility, handling, reliability, safety, and price, say of a Tesla 3?
     
  11. Russell Babb

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    Didn't hear much complaining about the La Ferrari! While I have NO interest in an EV, I'm not opposed to some electric assist. After all these don't function to "save the Earth", or help increase gas mileage. It adds to performance while checking the box for the Leftist agenda. There will never be a replacement for the true heart of a sports car...an internal combustion engine!
     
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  13. paulchua

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    Well said, though I don't think anybody here is advocating the shutdown of the oil industry tomorrow.
     
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  14. Dewinator

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    Why pay more for a Land Rover, Porsche, or BMW with a garbage 4 cylinder when you can get one much cheaper from Toyota or Ford? Whether or not you or I want one, people buy them and like them every day. Ferrari’s market cap assumes it will become a major carmaker and all major carmakers produce a raft of relatively cheap and disposable models at the bottom of their lineup. It’s a market segment they must cater to or the current valuation is not sustainable.
     
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  15. paulchua

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    Careful Russell, some here would consider your tolerance for electric assist/hybrid - albeit I see purely on pragmatic grounds exactly part of a " _____ agenda"

    Purity and all.

    I know the folks at Car and Driver / MotorTrend / Road and Track certainly agree with us - but what do they know?
     
  16. JTSE30

    JTSE30 F1 Rookie

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    Just nevermind the $300,000 repair bills for replacing battery pack and inverter...
     
  17. Marcel Massini

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    Lunch money anyway.

    Marcel Massini
     
  18. Hawkeye

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    they (Saudis) subscribe to the notion the in the same manner Diamond merchants control price, by keeping these clear rocks in a safe and dripping them out one by one so you part with three months salary for one of them.

    A perfect 1 karat Diamond has a real cash value of $250 bucks.

    oil is not a finite resource. As you deplete any resource the price increases accordingly. You would never be able to extract the last barrel of oil in a free market, it would be too expensive.
     
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  19. Hawkeye

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    a Tesla is an External Combustion Engine. Batteries don’t generate power, they store power. A Tesla is much more damaging to the planet than any V12 Ferrari.

    a Tesla just makes you think you’re doing something helpful, you’re not.

    Are we going to see self-driving Ferraris next? That will be icing on cake.
     
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  20. paulchua

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    Diamonds, probably more like $2.50. As for price of oil, yup, you must have missed my Beluga comment. For Saudis, I recommend you read the cables leaked and agreed Bipartisanly as authentic (that’s a rare thing huh?)
     
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  21. paulchua

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    Thanks! You just said the perfect thing at the perfect time, so much so folks might wonder if your my sock puppet. You may want to read this thread from the start.
     
  22. paulchua

    paulchua Cat Herder
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    Yeah, Buying a hyper car is for the frugal.
     
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  23. paulchua

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    Exactly, it’s all relative. A LaF went for auction last month for 5.4
    For the sake of argument, let agree with what was quoted, then the replacement is 5% total cost.


    Put another way what is the % cost of an engine out of a F355 vs total price?

    :)

    Sigh…
     
  24. Hawkeye

    Hawkeye F1 Veteran
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    the cars are not getting more valuable, the currency is just worth less. I do wonder what % of these rare 250 type Ferraris appearing at auction are financed?
     
  25. wildrnesxperienc

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    Looks like you completely missed my point. I’m sure this will make them a ton of money. But it’s disappointing nonetheless.
     
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  26. paulchua

    paulchua Cat Herder
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    Yeah, *I* missed the point.

    Look, either Ferrari is dead or it ain't.

    My position is clear.

    Seems like yours ain't.


    Make up your mind.
     
  27. paulchua

    paulchua Cat Herder
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    Now, this thread is about inflation?

    ROFL.
     
  28. paulchua

    paulchua Cat Herder
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    It's been around a long time; folks have declared Ferrari's obsolescence since time immemorial. I didn't expect to see it so much on a Ferrari enthusiast site.

    I reckon part of it is the "I have the best" mindset.
     
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