The end of Ferrari, as we know it

Discussion in 'Ferrari Discussion (not model specific)' started by johnk..., Jun 16, 2022.

  1. bitzman

    bitzman F1 Rookie

    Feb 15, 2008
    3,027
    Ontario, CA
    Full Name:
    wallace wyss
    I am glad to hear from DeLorenzo. I think he should be admiring Ferrari's spunk as they retreat in the face of the Electric onslaught. Ferrari tried with hybrids but the Greenies won't be happy until the ICE is dead. But Ferrari is still going to field V12s until countries began banning them one country at a time (or maybe the entire EU) When the Purosange comes out with V12 it will sell like hotcake because it could be their last new V12.. Mercedes shamefully is already caving in, canceling some V8 sport cars in favor of a turbo four.
     
  2. To remove this ad click here.

  3. JTSE30

    JTSE30 F1 Rookie

    Oct 1, 2004
    2,536
    Austin TX
    Not likely, for one, annual production is tiny and in no hurry to 'scale'...and, I believe, within 10 years the whole "EV only" charade will collapse...
     
  4. INTMD8

    INTMD8 F1 Veteran
    Owner

    Jun 10, 2007
    6,004
    Lake Villa IL
    #203 INTMD8, Jun 22, 2022
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2022
    So everyone will buy one but not everyone can charge one?
     
  5. sinistermist

    sinistermist Karting

    Mar 23, 2016
    76

    I think Lotus using a turbo 4 in the esprit for years hurt its sales. The engine was used in cheaper models. It competed with the v8 Ferraris for a good bit. By the time the V8 rolled out the esprit was very long in the tooth. Price wise it was no longer in pace with Ferrari. It became more of a budget exotic.

    In the elise/exige, given its price point the 2jz was a good choice. Much of their alure was their price point. Another was weight savings. For the Evora? I think the v6 hurt it. Most buyers are not track rats. It was not a hard core car. It was more a 911 fighter. It is a good engine. It is reliable. It is cheap to maintain. It is also, nothing special. It has no heritage. It does not have a unique sound. It does not have any character. So when you are dropping that kind of money on a car and you can get a 911 with a bespoke engine or a Lotus with the engine out of a 20k camry a lot of buyers are going to wonder where their money went.
     
    paulchua and ddrewesusa like this.
  6. paulchua

    paulchua Cat Herder
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jul 1, 2013
    14,408
    Menlo Park, CA
    Full Name:
    Paul Chua
    Good points and I think the fact that Lotus is a Chinese company now vindicates your view. A shame, as I've always admired the house of Chapman and would have loved it to stay fully British.
     
  7. To remove this ad click here.

  8. Texas Forever

    Texas Forever Five Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 28, 2003
    58,678
    Texas!
    Knocking on the door of 70, it is highly unlikely I will ever buy a new Ferrari again. (My only new Ferrari was a Challenge Stradale.) So, yes, the end of Ferrari as I know it has already happened.
     
    Gh21631 and jm2 like this.
  9. carnutdallas

    carnutdallas Formula 3
    Rossa Subscribed

    Nov 11, 2010
    1,414
    Dallas Burbs
    Full Name:
    Rob
    Gawd I love you :)


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
    JTSE30 likes this.
  10. 695

    695 Formula Junior

    Mar 19, 2021
    286
    Denmark
    Full Name:
    Chris
    To be fair - It is still a lot easier to get electricity than petrol most places in the world. I almost can't count the number of outlets in my house and I'm fairly certain I don't have a petrol pump, and even though I only have 1 mile and change to the nearest petrol station, I'm going to pass thousands of electrical outlets on my way to the petrol station ;-)

    Sure, it may take longer to charge at some of them, but they are there and they do not pollute the ground they are at.
     
  11. carnutdallas

    carnutdallas Formula 3
    Rossa Subscribed

    Nov 11, 2010
    1,414
    Dallas Burbs
    Full Name:
    Rob
    Love you too :)


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  12. To remove this ad click here.

  13. Texas Forever

    Texas Forever Five Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 28, 2003
    58,678
    Texas!
    If you want a laugh ask a Millennial how a light switch works. Some will know it is a switch that sends electricity to a light. But when you ask them how the juice gets to the switch, the fun begins.
     
  14. Texas Forever

    Texas Forever Five Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 28, 2003
    58,678
    Texas!
    Back in the late '90s, I picked up a client who was a new PhD in geology hire for Exxon. She was the first person who told me the theory oil didn't come from Dino the Dinosaur. It was instead naturally occurring. There might even be a belt of hydrocarbons all around the world. It was deep, really deep, but she assured me we would NEVER run out of oil.
     
  15. 695

    695 Formula Junior

    Mar 19, 2021
    286
    Denmark
    Full Name:
    Chris
    It is that seat belt alarm that makes you say that, right? I feel the same way, it drives me crazy ... ;-)

     
    paulchua likes this.
  16. INTMD8

    INTMD8 F1 Veteran
    Owner

    Jun 10, 2007
    6,004
    Lake Villa IL
    May take longer is a nice way of saying it, I don't think you would be going anywhere for a few days charging on 110v.

    No you may not have a gas station at your house but I find they are conveniently located along the roadways you may travel :)

    I'm more thinking about people who live in the city and apartments/etc.

    I can't imagine a Chicago winter with thousands of extension cords pouring out of buildings and into the street.

    Or, every street parking spot with a fast charger getting blasted by plowed snow.
     
    3POINT8, Gh21631 and JTSE30 like this.
  17. Jaguar36

    Jaguar36 Formula Junior

    Nov 8, 2010
    705
    Cherry Hill, NJ
    I know a couple of people who manage just fine with just a 110v outlet with an EV.
     
    Boomhauer and 695 like this.
  18. Gh21631

    Gh21631 F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Feb 24, 2011
    7,443
    East
    None of those outlets can charge your car. Nonsensical comparison.
     
    Thecadster, INTMD8 and 3POINT8 like this.
  19. Gh21631

    Gh21631 F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Feb 24, 2011
    7,443
    East
    Impossible speaking from experience with my Taycan which lasted about 3 weeks with me.
     
    Texas Forever, Thecadster and INTMD8 like this.
  20. 695

    695 Formula Junior

    Mar 19, 2021
    286
    Denmark
    Full Name:
    Chris
    We are going on 8 years with an EV in our little fleet of cars, we never ever had a problem with charging and in all eight years the car has had at least one several thousand kilometers road trip around Europe - range anxiety was an issue the first week of ownership back in 2014. Your whole three weeks experience ... well
     
    paulchua likes this.
  21. JTSE30

    JTSE30 F1 Rookie

    Oct 1, 2004
    2,536
    Austin TX
    Now, scale that to millions of EVs, I would imaging your experience would radically change...including all cars in your fleet being EV...
     
    Texas Forever and Gh21631 like this.
  22. INTMD8

    INTMD8 F1 Veteran
    Owner

    Jun 10, 2007
    6,004
    Lake Villa IL
    Yes, I know people that don't drive often as well.
     
  23. carnutdallas

    carnutdallas Formula 3
    Rossa Subscribed

    Nov 11, 2010
    1,414
    Dallas Burbs
    Full Name:
    Rob
    Oil is a gift from GOD. I will wait for those laughing……

    Will we discover a better product someday - yep! OUR physical world that we all observe together at this very moment is very young. Our knowledge and experience very short. Our science very infant if we compare it to the universe. I heard an example recently by someone, that if we measured the world in 1 year, our knowledge is like the last week or even 8 hours of Dec 31. Paraphrasing, but I am sure you can find what I speak of if you look.

    The biblical calendars and events are all verifiable in some fashion. We know dinosaurs existed - we have remains. We know weird stuff has been left as monuments and idols all around the globe. Oil is the current product that powers our entire world. It has huge benefits - cheap, multi uses, globally available - lots of it right here in USA. Solar, hydrogen, wind all valid sources of electricity, but many, many limitations. Nuclear is fantastic, but has some serious draw backs too. Does big oil wield a big stick and provide lots political might to suppress ideas? Nikolai Tesla would agree. Hell Mr. Musk can’t build cars without oil and coal, so really people??? Come on man….

    I love my electric car. I have 12 oil burners and love to drive the Enviromental killer - what I call my electric vehicle - more than the others. But I do it cause I can and want that thrill. I drive the Ferrari and my diesel for different thrills. I like the FREEDOM OF CHOICE. Will we get new tech and better tech? Maybe GOD has already given it to us and we just have not found it yet. Fighting, hating and demonizing each other seems to be blinding all of us. Oil not evil. Technology not bad, let’s make it all work together. Keep burning oil until the next magic pill happens. We have plenty of time. We all are going to be dead before it happens. Let’s let our world succeed without ogre’ish intervention. Stop lecturing us about pollution and environment when they - leaders - fly to summits on private jets and have multiple vehicle motorcades. How about we stop guarding world leaders with guns and fences and place all of that at schools and churches. Protect what really matters. Not daily talking points by blowhard leaders.

    Energy is not going to kill the planet. People will do that to each other first. History has proven for centuries! Cheers!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
    vonbeeler, swc5150, wiley355 and 2 others like this.
  24. Texas Forever

    Texas Forever Five Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 28, 2003
    58,678
    Texas!
    Everything you see. Everything you touch. Everything you eat is due to cheap energy. The premise of expensive energy is beyond stupid.
     
    swc5150, Gh21631 and carnutdallas like this.
  25. carnutdallas

    carnutdallas Formula 3
    Rossa Subscribed

    Nov 11, 2010
    1,414
    Dallas Burbs
    Full Name:
    Rob
    Exactly. Short simple and true!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
    Texas Forever likes this.
  26. 695

    695 Formula Junior

    Mar 19, 2021
    286
    Denmark
    Full Name:
    Chris
    So your thinking is that the power infrastructure will not develop from where it is now? And that in the beginning of the ICE there were gas stations readily available on every corner everywhere in the world?

    Maybe you are right - I don't think so, but maybe you are.
     
  27. JTSE30

    JTSE30 F1 Rookie

    Oct 1, 2004
    2,536
    Austin TX
    Seems Denmark is going backwards and is not increasing their electric power generation in any meaningful manner. In fact, Denmark has a huge problem...

    https://www.energate-messenger.com/news/223377/netherlands-and-denmark-activate-gas-contingency-plans

    https://www.pipeline-journal.net/news/gazprom-cuts-gas-supplies-denmarks-orsted-and-shell-energy

    https://cleanenergynews.ihsmarkit.com/research-analysis/rsted-aims-to-decarbonize-biomass-chp-plants-with-ccs-hubs.html
    Oops:
    But Denmark's government in 2020 voiced concerns over the use of forests for biomass sourcing, and last year a proposed revision to the EU's Renewable Energy Directive would also place new limits on wood as a source of renewable energy.

    Oops again:
    https://www.iea.org/countries/denmark

    Image Unavailable, Please Login

    Not looking so good for Denmark to transition to 100% EV...
     
    Gh21631 and Texas Forever like this.
  28. 695

    695 Formula Junior

    Mar 19, 2021
    286
    Denmark
    Full Name:
    Chris
    #225 695, Jun 22, 2022
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2022
    :) Well, there is a difference between electricity and energy supply. Natural Gas is primarily used in the production industry, where companies like Novo Nordisk then enters into partnerships to generate biogas from sludge/residues from their production http://www.symbiosis.dk/en/2022/01/11/gron-energi/.

    Then there is the natural gas used for heating houses. Denmark has a large natural gas field that is under renovation https://en.energinet.dk/Gas/Tyra

    So yes, natural gas is an issue in Europe due to Russia cutting 60% of their supply, but that is a short term blip https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/denmark-resumes-construction-norway-poland-gas-link-2022-03-01/

    So back to the generation of electricity. In the whole year of 2020 more than 50% of the electricity used in Denmark came from wind and solar power. https://stateofgreen.com/en/news/a-record-year-wind-and-solar-supplied-more-than-half-of-denmarks-electricity-in-2020/ and https://denmark.dk/innovation-and-design/clean-energy

    Since then there has been added more wind and solar parks. In addition to this there is a lot of interesting clean energy initiatives going on, like: https://stateofgreen.com/en/news/green-energy-islands-renovated-buildings-and-climate-neutral-waste-danish-government-has-a-new-climate-action-plan/ and more here: https://www.windisland.dk/

    If it is really windy (and we do not talk windy as in hurricanes or storms) the cost of electricity comes as low as 0 - as in free. Furthermore if you are very environmentally oriented and only want to charge as green as possible, you can actually see the current electricity production mix and the CO2 emitted pr. kWh produced - https://energinet.dk/

    So there is actually a lot going on and the number of public charging points for EVs are up 70% compared to last year and it is just ramping up - supply and demand
     
    Radu likes this.

Share This Page