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The F12 Needs More Power

Discussion in 'F12/812' started by 575joe, Sep 19, 2013.

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  1. 575joe

    575joe Formula Junior

    Aug 27, 2006
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    #1 575joe, Sep 19, 2013
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2013
    Contrary to what has been said by Chris Harris, and Jeremy Clarkson of Top Gear, after driving my F12 for a couple of nice summer months, I feel that more, not less power is in order.

    Not that it is underpowered, by any means, BUT the car has such excellent traction (the F1 Trac works brilliantly), such stability and composure, and great driveability, that it could easily handle another (say) 100 hp, and still be very driveable and exploitable on the street.

    I have driven my car on the track once, and on the street nearly daily, (admittedly in pretty nice dry, summer weather), and have never found that it has excessive, unusable power. Of course, one can only fully exploit the top end of the range on select occasions, when conditions permit, but it is perfectly tractable, safe, “special” and enjoyable at “normal” pace.

    I would say that the only shortcoming, which somewhat inhibits maximum enjoyment at a normal pace, and mid-range RPMs, is that from the inside, the car is excessively quiet, and the exhaust flaps open too late in the RPM range (over 4000 rpm). I have partly solved that problem by unplugging the vacuum lines to the exhaust flaps, so that they are always open, (of course I plugged the vacuum hoses), and have removed all the covers and insulation from the well in the trunk area, so that much more of the sound gets into the cabin. That makes is far more interactive at lower to mid rpm ranges, and now, rather than having to “boot it” at every occasion, I tend to “roll” on the accelerator, allow the revs to build progressively and relatively (by F12 standards) slowly, and shift at 6-7000 rpm so that I can enjoy the great sound for a few seconds at a time. (I have used this technique on my 458 for years, and it makes for better enjoyment for the driver, without completely alienating all the neighbouring cars with full throttle, jack-rabbit starts).

    (By the way, even with the flaps always open, and the covers removed in the trunk, it is perfectly acceptable in terms of noise at highway cruising speeds. The only time it sounds a bit irritating is just as you depress the accelerator to engage the clutch from a stop, at which point it makes some unpleasant exhaust noises for a fraction of a second, and of course at cold start-up, when the exhaust noise for the first 30 seconds or so is fabulous-sounding, but neighbour-unfriendly).
     
  2. crinoid

    crinoid F1 Veteran
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    #2 crinoid, Sep 19, 2013
    Thanks for the feedback. I am fascinated by the F12.
     
  3. Sld7

    Sld7 Formula Junior
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    #3 Sld7, Sep 19, 2013
    I love the start up sound! Wish it would stay like that for longer. Ironically it does go away quiker than the other F-cars for some reason.

    I agree that the exhaust should be louder and the flaps should open at 3,000 RPM.

    This is the only adjustment I would make at this point to the car.
     
  4. Sld7

    Sld7 Formula Junior
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    #4 Sld7, Sep 19, 2013
    But I know more power will be coming down the line......;)
     
  5. Traveller

    Traveller F1 Veteran

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    #5 Traveller, Sep 19, 2013
    Stop teasing - give us a clue....
     
  6. atomicskiracer

    atomicskiracer Formula 3

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    #6 atomicskiracer, Sep 19, 2013
    GTO?
     
  7. furmano

    furmano Three Time F1 World Champ

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    #7 furmano, Sep 19, 2013
    Wow, never thought I would hear that. Maybe instead of more power, it just needs a tweak to how its delivered. Do you say the same thing when the traction control is dialed down?

    -F
     
  8. Bas

    Bas Four Time F1 World Champ

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    #8 Bas, Sep 19, 2013
    turn the traction control of and fit low budget tires on the rear. I don't think more power will be needed then :D
     
  9. Sld7

    Sld7 Formula Junior
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    #9 Sld7, Sep 19, 2013
    In year 3 it will have a "refresh"...
     
  10. Flo400

    Flo400 Formula Junior

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    #10 Flo400, Sep 19, 2013
    Cool. That means more depreciation on the early ones. Guess if I'll wait a little more and instead of a 599 I could go all the way...
     
  11. Gran Drewismo

    Gran Drewismo F1 Rookie

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    #11 Gran Drewismo, Sep 19, 2013
    Mansory can help with this:

    [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pOOfpsyEmcI]1200bhp Mansory F12 and Aventador: Frankfurt 2013 | evo MOTOR SHOWS - YouTube[/ame]
     
  12. crinoid

    crinoid F1 Veteran
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    #12 crinoid, Sep 19, 2013
  13. Sld7

    Sld7 Formula Junior
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    #13 Sld7, Sep 19, 2013
    Who buys their stuff? It's not like it's inexpensive....
     
  14. Caeruleus11

    Caeruleus11 F1 World Champ
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    #14 Caeruleus11, Sep 19, 2013
    Fantastic information. Thank you.
     
  15. SSR

    SSR Formula 3

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    #15 SSR, Sep 19, 2013
    NR SC
     
  16. M-individual

    M-individual F1 Rookie

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    #16 M-individual, Sep 20, 2013
    Sure ... followed by an Aperta shortly after ...
     
  17. PSk

    PSk F1 World Champ

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    #17 PSk, Sep 20, 2013
    Needs less interfering computers not more power ...
    Pete
     
  18. dcmetro

    dcmetro F1 Veteran

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    #18 dcmetro, Sep 20, 2013
    Very interesting to read....

    What do you think about the suspension ? that's the only criticism I have read about the F12.

    Do you find them too soft ?
     
  19. 575joe

    575joe Formula Junior

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    #19 575joe, Sep 20, 2013
    I find it very liveable in the "soft" setting, but with very good body control.
    I did not push hard at the track because I did not want to ruin my tires, but the car felt very stable and controllable, had very good front-end bite (ie. did not understeer), and had good traction coming out of the corners. Felt very different than a 458 (felt bigger/heavier), but comparably “in control”.
    I see nothing wrong with the suspension as designed for a more “mature/liveable” approach to supercars.
     
  20. Sld7

    Sld7 Formula Junior
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    #20 Sld7, Sep 20, 2013
    I think the suspension is fascinating. My preference is RACE mode with the suspension button activated for normal driving and then RACE mode for hard driving.

    Ironically the F12 weights the same as my 911 Turbo, which is a smaller car but with four wheel drive.

    The F12 handles a lot better than the 599 and although different than tthe 458, I sttill feel around a track it would at least equal the 458 performance.

    I believe the 458 has a better stance to the road and is lower and is naturally mid engine, so from a physics stand point it has advantages, but I feel that they engineered the F12 so well, that it is able to make up for these.

    Overall driving I would say is an improvement over the 458 and track work I would say is at least equal.
     
  21. plastique999

    plastique999 F1 Veteran
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    #21 plastique999, Sep 20, 2013
    How much torque is there?
    Perhaps it's the torque you feel that should be improved to power out of corners?
     
  22. REALZEUS

    REALZEUS F1 Veteran

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    #22 REALZEUS, Sep 20, 2013
    I believe that he meant that the traction is so good that it doesn't feel overpowered as many commentators have suggested. Not that it actually needs more power. That said, in the ESC OFF position it must be downight scary with all that power.
     
  23. Caeruleus11

    Caeruleus11 F1 World Champ
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    #23 Caeruleus11, Sep 20, 2013
    With everything off is the e-diff still working (I believe yes). I think the tires, e-diff programming, traction systems all work so well together. Im glad thats the case.
     
  24. jvecchi

    jvecchi Formula Junior

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    #24 jvecchi, Sep 20, 2013
    I realize that I'm speaking sacrilege, but I wonder what the F12 would be like with the FF's awd...
     
  25. Sld7

    Sld7 Formula Junior
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    #25 Sld7, Sep 20, 2013
    Answer: Too heavy.......
     
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