The hidden water hose that few people change on an early 308.

There is a hidden water hose on the top of the engine that most people never change without pulling the engine, and mine just started leaking, after 47 years of hot water and heat completely rusted through one hose clamp and the hose itself. If you are someone who does an engine-out major service every three years, then you can stop reading here. I have owned my own very original 308 GT4 for 31 years, and take pride in doing as much as I can myself, or at least in understanding how the thing works. I took my time and found everything that I needed at Mid-County Napa Auto Parts in town and Ace Hardware for a small Weber Carb spacer that was missing, and the perfect air box foam seal. I read on this site that every water hose on the car is standard size straight tubing except the simple 90 degree hose into the radiator. I can go back to church now without fear of saying something bad, because I used all of my foul words fighting that one hose. My arms also look like I lost a cat fight from the tight work quarters, but I heal well. I use Ferrari Chat to research things, and now post my own experience, to hopefully help someone else.

Remove the air cleaner to access the top of the engine, but there are small sleeve spacers between the lower air box and the top of the Weber carbs that would just love to jump into the throttle body throats, and there is no way to cover the carbs (except maybe perfect size pieces of cloth) until the air cleaner is off, which is when you would lose the spacers. But the butterfly valves are closed when the engine is cold and not running, and the spacers could be retrieved with the right magnet tool, if you lose one. I used a small probe in one hand to to poke the spacers out of the rubber gaskets in the air box, while lifting with my other hand. The one in the right front is the most likely to be pulled loose because of the interefrence with the air cleaner intake hose, and I could see that it was missing before I started. Upon reassembly, I applied a small dab of clear silicone to the top of the carbs where the sleeve fits, hoping to minimize movement during the next air box removal. I had three different magnets-on-a-stick, but none of them would fit insite the carb throats, and I added a new tool to the collection at this time.

My goal was to change the two big hoses at and under the thermostat without removing any of the castings. Ferrari uses metric hoses, but local stores have inch sizes. The thin alloy tube is also of smaller diameter than the alloy engine casting to which it connects, but Ferrari uses a single diameter hose. 1-1/2" is a perfect fit into the thin alloy tube, but a tight fit onto the casting. The bottom one is in a really tight space. I used the 1-1/2" on the bottom. Start on the left side of the car and remove the breather box and all hoses attached to it. It would be a lot easier without the oil filter, but I just recently changed the oil and did not want to disturb the filter, and there is enough room. With the thin alloy tube out, you may have to cut out the lower hose under the thermostat housing with a razor blade, if the clamps are badly rusted. With all hoses removed, take time to clean the alloy castings with long strips of emery cloth and you might as well clean the top of the engine, too. Reinstall the problematic lower hose first. I tried various installation angles for the bottom hose, but ended up pulling the bare hose onto the alloy flange from the right side of the car, with my large hands in the small space between the bottom of the carbs and the top of the engine. Pushing from the left side of the car, the smaller diameter thin alloy tube did find the other end of the rubber hose, even tough you cannot see that connection from above, and the alloy tube rotates until you find the perfect original postion to reconnect to the hose on the left side of the car, not forgetting the positioning rubber insulated clamp near the oil filter. For the top hose, without moving any of the castings, the gap between the top two castings is tight. I chose the same larger 1-3/4" for the top that someone else had already replaced, prior to 31 years ago. That bigger opening size allows you to bend it in the middle to install on the inside first, and then work it around the thermostat flange. Grease on the castings helps everywhere. The top hose wasn't too bad to install.

Take time to check positions of hose clamps to make sure that they will not rub through something nearby. I replaced old fuel hoses, while I was there, and tightened or replaced clamps that were not directly involved with the hose project. The water bleed valves found on the BirdMan site are extremely useful, and note that my early 308 (BUILD # 5) did not come with a bleed valve location on the thermostat cover casting, which had to be added. Check the coolant level and bleed out the air in the system a couple of times before taking a long drive.

I hope that this helps someone else, and thanks to the others for posting their own helpful hints.
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Rifleman - How many of your 27,395 posts are not hateful personal attacks? You started in on me before I even finished the post! The second line of my post implies that my information is not going to be of interest to experienced mechanics, but to other owners who are trying to understand their own cars. Stop following EVERYTHING that I choose to write, and I will not respond to your "contributions". Fair enough?

 

For your benefit, I am posting photos of new water hoses typical of ones that you will find in an automotive store. You can also search the internet for more photos of new generic water hoses. What some people, with a different perspective on cars and life in general, might find interesting, is that a water hose so completely destroyed was actually still functioning in a car that is frequently used, and that is why I posted a photo of the old hose. Stop following my posts, because you only discourage otherwise helpful people from participating.

At the risk of offending more people like you, I will now add that there are threads on Ferrari Chat about how best cut water hoses to the proper length. The two suggestions that I found were a razor type knife for silicone hose, and "sawing" for rubber hose. At the automotive store, they used a crude saw to cut a one foot length at a crude angle. I used an electric "chop saw" saw with a blade for wooden moldings to make very nice cuts in exactly the right place, after looking at a cross section of the hose to make sure that there was not a metal reinforcing wire inside.

If this information is not helpful to some of the advanced engineers and mechanics who appear to live and die by their posts on this forum, please just move on without crappy responses.

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Officially, the little spacers are just supposed to float loose on their own, which creates anxiety for non-professional mechanics like me, that one or more would drop into the carburetor(s). There may be a future service function where the top of the carburetors must remain perfectly smooth (i don't know) and so I did not want to permanently glue them in place with a stronger adhesive. I only used a tiny dab. I am just hoping to slow down their movement when I next remove the air cleaner, and that tube of silicone seemed like a safe experiment. If it works, I will post a follow up in the future, while watching for meaningful alternatives here on FerrariChat.

 

I try to keep an eye on parts that may wear out on all of my vehicles, but that hidden hose (not easy to see under the top hose and thermostat housing) was not on my radar, until I started searching for the water leak. Maybe my experience will help other owners to remember to check that hose during the next time that their air cleaner assembly is removed.

 

Yes, a dab at the base of the carb stud, and then I lowered the clean spacer onto the silicone dab with a twirling motion to spread the silicone evenly. With the spacer in place, I wiped away any visible excess, and I will see how it held in the future. No damage to the parts, and it can't be worse than having them move freely on the studs, was my thought.