Owner says:SOLD to Shaughnessey today!
Cliff. I'm hot on the trail for you. Pix tomorrow of the Dino in question. Very nice car that I saw today. Original color with a nice re-spray about 10yrs ago. all books, tools, pouch, top cover, etc. Nice leather interior, stock but refreshed at some point, not daytona seats. A/C. Needs carpet. Has new clutch and freshly rebuilt tranny. Engine runs very strong. Good wheels, with correct XWX radials. No leaks to speak of, and no visible rust. Car is on consignment, we'll talk about what they say will sell the car. Good records, and original bill of sale, etc. I have copies of some of the stuff for you, I'll turn the whole mess into a pdf, along with pix, and send it tomorrow. Has crane elec. ignition, bad CD changer in the dash and trunk and big speakers in the doors that I'd replace with original panels and speakers. Dash is very nice, recently redone in correct mousehair. All in all a very nice car, well taken care of, would need nothing to drive away. (which means probably $5k at some point to make you happy. Although I'd do the carpet ASAP, cost about $1K, you can do it yourself. Paint needs a buff and polish to get the swirl marks out, and a couple of good coats of Best of Show wax, and you'll be very happy with it. Probably a good detailing is all the paint needs, nothing more. DM.
This 330 GTC must have been priced fairly if Shaughnessy scooped it up. While the car clearly has some needs, (some which could be rather expensive to fix), Tom is a very smart buyer and must believe that some money is left in the car. At around $70K, (if that is the figure that the car indeed sold for), the car seems to be priced around wholesale. Anyone else have any thoughts?
$70k gives you alot of room, especially if you can do the work yourself. $10k for paint at the worst as long as you are not doing a color change, if a dealer just wanted to flip the car you could spot repair the bubble areas for under $5000. The engine has good compression but may need some top end work $10k, more than likely has sitting issues and needs some tuning and adjustments. Trans rebuild new syncros $2500-$4000 if needed, may just have wrong oil or could need shift fork adjustments or clutch adjustment. Thats about $95k in the car, if nice 330s are selling quickly for $130k thats a nice easy $35k profit at least.
Absolutely below wholesale. Well below. I already have one, and I would not have hesitated to buy that one for $70k. Just another example of 'miuraman' knowing the market a lot better than us retail buyers. james
FYI One can not paint a 330/365GTC in the state California utilizing the proper materials, personnel, with an upper quality level result for $10,000, Just can not do it. I know, I've tried. Then the chrome plating dilemna is the next to address, Pandora's box. Where does one stop??? While you are at it ......... Tom Shaughnessy San Clemente CA
Uro, A vintage Ferrari is not an easy choice as a first time Ferrari. I think it would be better to ease in with a more modern car, get to know what it means to have and keep such a car, which way you want it (show/driver) and at a later date, with a better understanding, get into the Vintage stuff.
I second this emotion. I really do think that you need to understand why you want a vintage Ferrari before diving into this end of the pool. If you like tinkering and fussing around with old cars (and have the time to do so), go for it. But if you like being able to drive without having a contingency plan, a more modern car might be the better choice. Dale
I think it depends on what your expectations are, you'd think for $70000 which is a lot for a car it would be something you could just hop into and drive, but what will happen is parts will fail and be hard or impossible to find along with other hidden problems that come up, unless you have patience and a understanding for the car it would be a frustrating experience. Old Ferraris are not any different than any other vintage car,with the exception of sticker shock on parts prices and the occasional needle in the haystack hunt for a part, actually they are typically much better because they will have at least had attempts to keep them up with lots of money put into them, working on them you realize their is no such thing as a 5 minuter repair job as even some of the most normal typical auto repairs can take a full day such as a starter replacement with everything that needs to be removed.
Ahh, but this is where FerrariChat.com comes to the rescue. There are lots of us here who have already searched for the elusive part, or spent a day tearing a door apart, and are more than willing to share that wisdom with our Fchat Brothers and Sisters. I have a list of about 25 websites that can provide just about any part you want. I would caution however, that you do need a knowledgeable Ferrari Mechanic. I would not trust some every day wrench turner to work on my Dino. Fortunately, I live about a mile from Algar, and am also close to several other talented Ferrari mechanics. Cliff - do you have a good Ferrari guy nearby? You rally don't want to ship the carr 200 miles every time it needs fixing.
VERY VERY TRUE. Not only do you need a good mechanic you need one that's not on a $105 per hour clock. IMO you also have to be a bit handy yourself.
FYI One can not paint a 330/365GTC in the state California utilizing the proper materials, personnel, with an upper quality level result for $10,000, Just can not do it. I know, I've tried. Then the chrome plating dilemna is the next to address, Pandora's box. Where does one stop??? While you are at it ......... Tom Shaughnessy Can you elaborate a little further Tom? I have had my 328 and 930 both almost completely repainted for under $5000 each, my 512BB is having a complete repaint as well and had cracking in the body filler along with refinishing of alumium work on the rear decklid which needed extensive labor to correct. aluminum work is more expensive than the steel body 330s granted unless you run into rust, also included is re-expoxing all of the black trim for under $10000, If you are talking refinishing in laquer maybe so, but that would be a waste of money as laquer will look great for a few years before it has problems, modern 2 stage finishes are much more durable with flex additives in the clear for rock chip protection and give a nicer finish.
Yup. Knowing which end of the socket wrench to hold does help. Fortunately, lots of minor items can be attended to by a relatively untalented amateur. I'm no grease monkey, but I've fixed lots of little stuff on my car, saving several trips to the dealer. Although I have to admit, I've never owned a car before that required 3 hours to remove and replace the thermostat before.
thats where I am, but I'm pretty handy, I put a clutch and a timing chain in a BMW 2002 in my college days.
I am in Las Vegas, but I've heard you can get better quality and cheaper in Cali concerning paint. I looked hard to find a decent shop here to do my cars, the 328 was painted or actually touched up by a well known exotic specialist and he is expensive and the end result was very good but to an expert painter such as the guy thats doing my Boxer he could have done better, the thing was the guy doing my Boxer doesn't specialize in exotics and does typical production work (crash repair) but he has painted Ferraris before including Boxers for a Dealership owner here that had a Boxer and a few other Ferraris when they were new including a Dino 246 which he said was one of the hardest cars to paint or repair as they have so many curves and you need to hand sand them for days trying to make perfect curves vs blocking them out on more flat planed cars to get all the ripples out, the thing is he doesn't like dealing with Ferraris because of his past experiences with Ferrari owners, mostly that owned the newer models, he said they are cheap and doesn't like their superior attitudes and they also don't understand the process and time it takes to properly paint one, I can understand that, they have had my car over 2 months and its sat most of the time, I could see someone going off on them and losing patience. So to answer your question how to find a good painter thats reasonable, go to local classic muscle car or hot rod shows and look for exceptional work and ask who painted it, their is a lot of really great painters and painting a Ferrari is not any different than a classic car, usually its easier as classic American cars have major rust issues and need serious repair. With these types of painters you will get not only a better deal as they are not charging the Ferrari tax the shops that specialize in them do but you will get a far superior paint job. Repainting a car is no big deal once you have seen the process, stripping a car to bare metal is a big ordeal though especially with Ferraris as they have so much filler on them thats very thick, I asked what it would be to repaint my Boxer the original color which was Grey and it would have been $20000 and months of work so it was not worth it clearly to me as Rosso Corsa is very nice anyway which is what the car was repainted in the 90s and stripped to metal, but as long as you are keeping the same color and the filler underneath is solid and good their is no reason to strip a car as you could be creating more problems down the road.
I would have bought the silver (this car) as it is honest and cheap. Use as driver for as long as practical ... rebuild mechanicals ... drive again, even harder ... rebuild body (if really necessary). It is the miles you put on an old car that are important ... not how well they come through a PPI. This car is a honest driver, and there is no such thing as a perfect old car. Even 100 point concours cars will give drama ... gosh these cars had issues when they were brand new!, they are not Toyota Corollas Pete
Having been through a tough time buying my Daytona last year (engine work costing lots more than expected, several months delay etc), I nevertheless take the view that, hey, I now have a Daytona in the garage (or, more importantly, out on the road every week).... Would be a great shame if I'd missed out on that. My life is unquestionably better as a result of having it. A 330 GTC for $70k...? I suspect that - quite apart from the pleasure of driving it - in two years time we'll all be going misty-eyed about these cars like we do now about Lussos & 275s. Check out www.250swb.com Within the last few weeks, the two or three 330/365 GTCs for sale there have all sold... John
Pete, the basis for my comment is that owning any vintage car, including a Ferrari requires a major commitment. Kinda like the old saying about eggs and ham. You know, in making your breakfast, the chicken was involved, but the pig got committed. For a white collar professional, owning a vintage car can be a big mistake. Simply put, time is at a premium. Work and family tend to take up quite a bit of time. I can't tell you the number of times that I have snuck out of the house at daybreak on Sunday morning for a run. Needless to say, having a car that starts right up and is ready to go is very important. Don't get me wrong. I love vintage cars and motorcycles. I love to drive them. I love the way you can smell the burned oil and gas. I love the way you can hear the values ticking after a run. But I don't care for the SOB to have an annoying short that, no matter how I try, I can't figure out. So maybe when I'm really retired a vintage Ferrari will be the thing, eh? Dale
Hahaha, never heard that chicken and pig saying Yes regarding time I am fully understanding. My Alfa Romeo restoration is processing painfully slow due to lack of free time ... but regarding the old car that starts right up, er, that is why I have 2+ cars . One is the modern cr@p mobile Toyota thats only positive attribute is that it always starts, the other(s) are the fun mobiles. Not sure of the answer here. You have options though: 1. Find the best you can restored car. This is a large risk IMO, as you were not the owner of the car during restoration and thus had no hand in the quality of the restoration. Most old car restorations are still skin deep ... you want a reliable driver. 2. Find the cheapest restorable car you can. This is a LOWER risk IMO, as the only risk is a budget blowout. You will be in control of any restoration, repairs made and thus can work towards the reliable driver you are after. Regarding the budget blowout ... the car you bought in option 1 will still cause a budget blow out anyway, you just won't have the funds to fix her (because all your money went in the purchase price ) ... thus this beautiful looking Ferrari just sits in the garage devaluing and is eventually sold at its true worth and new owner now has a viable budget to complete the restoration. 3. Buy a much younger Ferrari. Thus unless you can buy a restored Ferrari from a place with a perfect reputation (then IMO you need to be in Napolis's position in life), I'd forget buying a vintage Ferrari. Call me a pessimist but I do not believe in the buy the best you can afford advice ... ie. unless you are Jim, the best you (I) can afford in vintage Ferraris is close to a skin deep piece of **** anyway. Thus buy the piece of **** at the piece of **** price and slowly turn it into the best you can afford. Pete
