The (one and only) '0846' Debate Thread | Page 11 | FerrariChat

The (one and only) '0846' Debate Thread

Discussion in 'Vintage (thru 365 GTC4)' started by El Wayne, Nov 1, 2003.

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  1. Texas Forever

    Texas Forever Eight Time F1 World Champ BANNED Rossa Subscribed

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    Napolis, I noticed that it looks like you need additional security in your garage, and I'd like to volunteer my services. For mere bread and water (I need to lose weight anyway), I'll be happy to provide 24/7 guard duty. The only thing that I'll need is a mop...

    Dr "Drooling" Tax
     
    Texas Forever, Feb 23, 2004
    #251
  2. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ Honorary Owner

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    Jim Glickenhaus
    As our shop abuts the local Police Force and they all seem to be car guys we seem to be covered.
    Moppers we can always use.
    Best
     
    Napolis, Feb 23, 2004
    #252
  3. zjpj

    zjpj F1 Veteran

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    haha, where can I get my bucket?
     
    zjpj, Feb 23, 2004
    #253
  4. KennyH

    KennyH F1 Veteran Owner

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    Where do I sign up :)
     
    KennyH, Feb 23, 2004
    #254
  5. P4weGo

    P4weGo Rookie

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    I know a man who rebuilt a BMW motorcycle from a panier, does that make it a BMW motorcycle? Maybe.

    If Jims car has some genuine parts on it then is it genuine?

    Please no shouting, I was enjoying watching this chat develop, but it seems to have stopped.

    Has the car got genuine:

    uprights?
    brakes?
    a door?
    an engine?
    a gearbox?
    chassis?

    whatever, it would be nice to see it all on one page.

    PS some of you people are downright rude. Is there any chance that we can continue this discussion without being offensive.
     
    P4weGo, Feb 25, 2004
    #255
  6. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ Honorary Owner

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    Jim Glickenhaus
    No matter how many times, over no matter how many years, people continue to ask the same questions, instead of reading the answers which have already been posted many, many times the answers remain the same.
     
    Napolis, Feb 25, 2004
    #256
  7. Bryanp

    Bryanp F1 Rookie

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    Amen, Jim - I, for one, have always appreciated the openness you have displayed both in the restoration and in your sleuthing on your car.

    I'll buy the book (if you autograph it), but who will play you in the movie???

    Bryan P
     
    Bryanp, Feb 25, 2004
    #257
  8. Miltonian

    Miltonian F1 Veteran

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    Jim: In your own opinion, as someone who obviously knows more about the subject than the average person, is there one particular book or other source that contains ACCURATE information about the story of the various P3 and P4 variations, including specific chassis number histories? I would love to have the best book on the subject.

    I have been looking at the Salon story on P4 #0856 in Road & Track, January 1981. This article has a sidebar by Doug Nye (who is ordinarily pretty accurate and well-informed) which states that Daytona 1967 was won by Amon and Bandini, "apparently in 0856", which is apparently incorrect. I'd like to read the TRUE story in detail.

    I'm greatly enjoying seeing the details of your restoration, thank you for sharing!!
     
    Miltonian, Feb 25, 2004
    #258
  9. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ Honorary Owner

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    There are a number and I'll list some after I check them out again. The problem as you pointed out is that over time error becomes truth. Remember my MK-IV J6. A very nice P4 book, which has a lot of things correct features a car on the cover with a body that was fitted after it was reconverted back to a P4 from a 350 Can Am and that body has IMHO a few issues. Some of which I've already mentioned. (Shape of rear cut out)
     
    Napolis, Feb 25, 2004
    #259
  10. zjpj

    zjpj F1 Veteran

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    I think after time passes, enough of any car gets rebuilt that a lot of it won't be "original." As long as chasis numbers and engine numbers all match, wouldn't that make it "genuine?" I don't know - you're question really is at what point is it just an all new car? I think the chasis is probably most important.
     
    zjpj, Feb 25, 2004
    #260
  11. P4weGo

    P4weGo Rookie

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    Im sorry. Mr G, there seem to be so many avenues of discussion, I have tried locating all that I can. It is probably all documented I just can't find it so basically laid out.

    Bryanp would you do the kindness of telling me?

    I think the designation for a P4 gearbox is 603? whatever, is the gearbox in the pictures a P4 gearbox?
     
    P4weGo, Feb 25, 2004
    #261
  12. PSk

    PSk F1 World Champ

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    I believe it is all about continuous history, not about what part is genuine or not.

    Pete
     
    PSk, Feb 25, 2004
    #262
  13. adesalos

    adesalos Formula Junior

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    Enough controversy!

    Let's make sure Jim doesn't waste his time answer our questions (I don't care if it is more or less orginial or certified or verified, or... Jim isn't going to sell it, and I don't have the money to buy it), and that he can spend time on his car and taking pictures for us.

    Jim, more pictures please, your project is facinating!
     
    adesalos, Feb 25, 2004
    #263
  14. Erich

    Erich Formula 3

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    P4 we go.

    Go back to the first post in this thread by wax.
    Click on every one of those links and READ, READ, READ. THEN read all 4 pages of this thread from start to finish.
    There will be a test when you get back.

    Erich
     
    Erich, Feb 25, 2004
    #264
  15. thecarreaper

    thecarreaper F1 World Champ Silver Subscribed

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    i have done just that. thank you Napolis , for all your time, your patience, for sharing your passion. the hunt is sometimes better than the kill. the quest for the truth, the facts and history would make a hell of a movie. i will buy whatever you publish, whenever that is. i cannot imagine the fun and frustration in seeing this come to fruition . its a ferrari, its beautiful, like sex embodied in metal. it is history. the car is real to ME , i dont know where this P4 guy is coming from with these inflamitory questions. i love the car. what it represents of passion, of ferrari and its racing heritage. my stomach was churning reading these posts about numbers and papers ect. i wont focus on the negative, or lower myself by typing what i really feel about this guy picking on Napolis and his car.
    WAX thanks to you also for all your work on this thread. i dunno how i missed so much, so fast. having it all in one place is like settling down with an old favorite book, but this one is still bieng written and i cant wait to witness the finished car, as it starts new life. this is a great community. i am glad to be here . michael
     
    thecarreaper, Feb 28, 2004
    #265
  16. Restoration Man

    Restoration Man Rookie

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    And what the devil is the green red and ally car? P4racer can you let us know what you have there?
     
    Restoration Man, Feb 29, 2004
    #266
  17. PSk

    PSk F1 World Champ

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    P4Racer has discussed that car a few times on this forum. Try searching for the "Poor Man's P4 Replica thread ..." in the General Section.

    Pete
     
    PSk, Feb 29, 2004
    #267
  18. P4Racer

    P4Racer Rookie

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    Thanks for the interst Restoration Man. I didn't mean to bring my car into this forum of chat. I got excersized by a couple of comments about my knowledge of these cars. In the heat of the moment I showed a picture that is frankly pretty insignificant. Other than I suppose it shows that I have some understanding of "our" pet subject.

    Therefore I am going to keep the car off discussion. As I have always said I think JG's doing a really good job. Theres a wealth of different feelings about these cars and their legitamcy. The bottom line is, if you are lucky enough to have a car like this, as I do, then it really doesn't matter what "nose picking armchair expert" thinks. What matters is that one has achieved ones own Everest. What others think of these achievements is their buissiness.

    If a car is made of all genuine parts, stamped or not, then the only man who will deny them a compliment is someone who is condumed by jelousy. Which is easily achieved when I see the excellent work that JG ahs done.


    However, anyone who wants to chat about making a very fast racecar that looks like a P4, I am up for anything.

    Max
     
    P4Racer, Mar 1, 2004
    #268
  19. tomgt

    tomgt F1 Veteran Rossa Subscribed

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    Anyone interested in old pics (P4, some 0846 I think, all gathered from the internet)
     
    tomgt, Mar 4, 2004
    #269
  20. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ Honorary Owner

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    Yes.
     
    Napolis, Mar 4, 2004
    #270
  21. tomgt

    tomgt F1 Veteran Rossa Subscribed

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    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    tomgt, Mar 5, 2004
    #271
  22. tomgt

    tomgt F1 Veteran Rossa Subscribed

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    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    tomgt, Mar 5, 2004
    #272
  23. tomgt

    tomgt F1 Veteran Rossa Subscribed

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    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    tomgt, Mar 5, 2004
    #273
  24. trkevin

    trkevin Formula Junior

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    I have the following:
    - #21 = 0858 at '67 Le Mans (Ludovico Scarfiotti / Mike Parkes) 2nd
    - #22 = 0848 at '67 Le Mans (Jean Guichet / Herbert Müller) DNF
    - #23 = 0846 at '67 Daytona (Lorenzo Bandini / Chris Amon) 1st
    & #26 = s/n 0844 at '67 Daytona (Pedro Rodriguez / Jean Guichet) 3th
    - #23 = 0846 at '67 Daytona (Lorenzo Bandini / Chris Amon) 1st
    - #224 = 0846 at '67 Targa Florio (Nino Vaccarella / Ludovico Scarfiotti) DNF
    - #20 = 0846 at '67 Le Mans (Chris Amon / Nino Vaccarella) DNF
    - #23 = 0846 at '67 Daytona (Lorenzo Bandini / Chris Amon) 1st
    - #6 = ?
     
    trkevin, Mar 5, 2004
    #274
  25. macca

    macca Formula Junior

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    In the first lot

    #10 is 0854 at Brands Hatch 1967
    #220 is 0848 at Targa Florio 1967

    Most of the second lot are P3s. The berlinetta #23 is P3/4 0854 at Le Mans 1967.


    PWM
     
    macca, Mar 5, 2004
    #275
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