The (one and only) '0846' Debate Thread

Napolis isn't the only P4 owner to be putting a Berlinetta back to Spyder configuration:

http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/4083/p4spydermetal7am.jpg

;-)


Paul M

 

I saw the painted nose last night. It is really something. I'll have a few photo's on Sat.

Best To You and Yours!

 

Our Friend Wolfgang took some very interesting photo's of 0844's chassis engine mounts mating to 0844's P3 (412) engine and P3/412 2412mm wheel base that when compared with 0846's chassis (Pages 63-79) once again prove beyond the shadow of any doubt that my chassis is P3 NOT "Built to P4 plans".

http://ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=103845&page=4

 

We're moving along.

0846 is just about back in her Spyder configuration with proper P3/P4 nose.
002C is coming along.

Both will be ready to head to the 100th Anniversary of the Targa Florio soon.
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

If beauty is in the eye of the beholder, then my eyes behold beauty. I could work around that every day and never get jaded.

 

"Controversy around chassis no. 0846
One of the original cars, 0846, which was built as a P3 by Ferrari in 1966 and modified by Ferrari in December 1966 to accept a P4 engine while retaining it's P3 chassis and nose, was said to be totaled in a racing accident and discarded afterwards. Another is in a French automobile museum, while yet another is held by a Canadian collector, and the fourth (owned by American Walter Medlin) was set to be auctioned off in March 2005 to pay for back taxes before the owner came up with US$3 million to protect it.

Recently the P3/4 that was thought to be destroyed resurfaced in the possession of exotic car collector and enthusiast James Glickenhaus, the former movie director and stock exchange magnate. When he bought it, both he and the person he bought it from thought it was a replica chassis. After removing 1000 rivets, dissembling everything, stripping the chassis, researching the Ferrari build sheets and comparing the frame with 412P 0844, 412P 0850, 412P 0854, P4 0856, and P4 replica chassis 0900, 0900a, and 0900c he discovered that the car he had bought contained approximately 80+% of the original chassis of 0846.

"After Le Mans 1967 0846 was returned to the Ferrari factory where it was deconstructed, investigated and scrapped. Years later, James Glickenhaus acquired remains of 0846, and with help from Ferrari S.p.A. who recast suspension uprights, commissioned Sal Barone, Alberto Pedretti, Bob Wallace and John Hadduk Jr. to restore 0846 to original specifications." - XVII Giro di Sicilia Official Program
In an email dated 6/10/2005 Joanne Marshall of Ferrari S.p.A. wrote: "We confirm that, as far as our factory records are concerned, the chassis in question (0846) was totally written off in 1967 after the Le Mans incident."

Glickenhaus has never disputed this but believes that the remains of 0846, including 80+% of it's original chassis survived and that those and other remains of 0846 are currently in the car that he owns.

The following link [1] explains the basis for Glickenhaus' beliefs. This debate [2] has raged throughout 2004 among various Ferrari enthusiasts.

A letter from Ferrari S.p.A., dated September 29th, 2004, Subject: P3/4 Chassis no. 0846:

Dear Mr. Glickenhaus,
We wish to thank you for the extensive dossier you have sent regarding the above mentioned vehicle that as confirmed on our letter dated October 5th, we have examined in detail. The car was built on February 1966 as a P3 version and during its racing period, officially managed by the Factory, it went though several modifications in order to race the 24 hours of Daytona in 1967 as a P3/4. We also confirm that, as reported in your dossier, the car caught fire during the 24 hours of Le Mans. It was then totally dismantled and because of the extended damages detected, the factory decided not to perform any repair and to write off the chassis no. 0846. If some of the remaining components such as engine and gearbox were considered as possible spare parts, the chassis, because of its racing history and the fire damages suffered, was definitively scrapped. Therefore eventual pieces retrieved from the trash container should not have been used to rebuild or to revival a car which was written off, if this is the case. We all would like to see forever these glorious pieces but unfortunately the chassis no. 0846 had a sad conclusion.
Yours faithfully, Ferrari Classiche, Umberto Masoni"
This letter confirms that 0846's chassis was written off and scrapped, not melted into oblivion. For many years this is ALL and EXCATLY what Glickenhaus posited happened: That his car contains 80+% of the chassis remains of P 3/4 0846 among other original parts. He's never disputed that as far a Ferrari is concerned 0846 was written off/scrapped and under Ferrari's authentication definitions his car could not be authenticated by them. Glickenhaus is not the one who retrieved the chassis remains of 0846 "from the trash container" and used them to "to rebuild or to revival a car which was written off..." but he was the one who discovered exactly where the chassis remains of 0846 wound up and to insure that Umberto's wish: "We all would like to see forever these glorious pieces..." remains possible. "








I found it at wikpedia. Is it 100% true. Does anyone want to add something ?
I remember Jim post this letter before , but what about the rest of text ?

Jim ?

 

the cars are looking awesome, Jim . I saw Albert yesterday. He's very much looking fwd to meeting you, Dan and Kev @ The Florio

 

Thanks.

Hope you're enjoying your CS! I'm looking forward to meeting him as well.

Best

 

Here she is traveling back from the paint shop. Note that for authenticity we use open trailers like they did on the day...
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

Jim what was the condition of your P4 when you bought it ? How come that David Piper thought it was replica ? What about engine in your car , is it rebuilt model from 0846 back from the '60 ?

Tad

P.S.
What about this post #1406 ?

 

Start here:

http://www.glickenhaus.com/jim/project.pdf

After studying that carefully you tell me if you think #1406 is accurate.

There will soon be a final addition to the 0846 papers that I think many of you will find interesting.

Stay tuned...

 

Not much to paint there. Could have used a brush.

 

This appears to be a fine publication:

http://www.libreriadellautomobile.it/English/ViewBook.asp?IDBook=8422

 

I does. Thanks.

 

Damn, one more must have Ferrari book...

 

Moving along.

Note Le Mans ACO stamp on water neck.
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

Looking fabulous Jim. I cant wait to see the assembled finale.
The aluminium floor work looks top notch. Are you using modern silicone hoses or keeping to traditional Italian made pipes?

Good luck Jim

 

We use modern plumbing esp. for the high PSI FI lines which are indy car lines which Sal covers in rubber heat shrink.

Best

 

continuing on...
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

Jim, what happened to that application I sent in for "Best Boy," "Water Boy," Security Guard, or Sweeper that I sent you. Don't tell me that you lost it!

Dale

 

While putting mine at the top of the stack, I accidently put all the other apps in the shredder, sorry.

 

Looks beautiful both of them, coming along nicely.

Does anyone know if this is a pic of P4 hood wooden buck on top of a 365BB in the Boxer thread?

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=104530&page=2

 

No it isn't ... discussed way earlier in this thread.

BTW: Jim looks great.

Pete

 

It does not have the appearance of being THICK like a wooden buck would have to be. It does have the appearance of a fiberglass panel. So how has anybody difinitively proven that it is NOT a P4 front end? (photographic comparison???)