The (one and only) '0846' Debate Thread

Who wouldn't enjoy driving his car. Whatever it may be, it's as close to an original experience as you're likely to get without having an all out original. He can say whatever makes him feel good. Other will say what they believe. I think enough has been written and told about this car that no rube with millions to burn will ever buy it as an original. Even if Jim would sell it.

 

That's the whole point of this thread! If it weren't for some posters on here, a potential buyer would have bought the BS, quite literally. And the difference between a true 'real' car vs a frankencar at this level must be astounding.

 

Self Delusion, ahhh, it is the best feeling in the world

Rergards, Alberto

 

Not only that, but if purported 0846 ain't it, then imagine how dilutive it is to the value of the true cars.

Like, INSANELY dilutive.

 

I agree with this. It does not matter if a chassis is written off. The question is did the physical elements survive to this day whether the manufacturer acknowledges they did or did not.

For the record, this is just your opinion. Not an actual factual statement.

 

I'm always amazed when this thread about the bitsa pops to the top again. Folks, it's been 20 years since this topic first showed up on Fchat.

 

NSS.

 

Indeed, Holmes.....

 

Back at you: For the record, this is just your opinion. Not an actual factual statement.

 

Actually, it's not my opinion... But rather a fact.

Currently, it is an opinion that the chassis in question is not the remains of #0846.

just as

Currently, it is an opinion that the chassis in question is the remains of #0846.

Due to currently either side has yet to prove conclusively that what they claim is true.

Playing "Where's Waldo" with twenty year old pictures and comparing them to pictures as an object sits today, leads to nothing conclusive as that object can change over time. This is not an actual investigation into the origins of an object. It only shows that the pictures of #0846 BITD and Glick's chassis, whether it is or isn't #0846, are not exactly the same in every aspect. Which is feasible as cars are crashed and modified over time and repairs/modifications to remedy those changes may not be the same as the original construction. The only way to prove that the object is or isn't what is claimed, it to find if any of the original construction still exists.

 

I cannot believe someone, with a quasi famous 'name', has been hooking one way or the other, for OVER 20 YEARS?????,
all the kind f-chatters, almost into fisticuffs situations, and into an operatic
show, worthy of a 'C rated ' Bollywood movie.

Napolis, even the name is wrong, no meaning, or just a mis-spelling? Dialectic, or he believes he is the siren Parthenope ? Whatever.

2 zillion posts, and for what? You are right I am wrong, so? Well then, I am right and you are wrong.
At the end, you and only you, with your head on your pillow, will believe it is / or not, a real car, or a reasonable 'bitsa'. Hey, more power to you.
Even babies get switched at hospitals, so is mine really #0864?

This, is Barnum and Bailey at its best.

Keep on truckin' #0864 .

Regards, Alberto

 

Rampant dilution!

It is known where the chassis came from.

At least you are not claiming that because a single bolt that might be traced to the real car makes the car real.

 

Dillusion.

 

Self Delusion, ahhh, it is the best feeling in the world

Rergards, Alberto

 

Ahh, thank you so much Mr. Jeff Kennedy. I did not realize you knew so much.

I take it then, you also know the where, when, and how the obvious damage to the frame occurred as well as the how, where, and why the chassis was modified? I take it you know the specifics with some actual documentation, versus just random unsubstantiated guesses, seeing that you attest to knowing so much.

So very excited to learn from you about these exciting parts of the David Piper #0003 P4 recreation chassis history.

Your insight will be so very much appreciated by not only me, but I am sure some of the other forum members as well.

Again, thank you so much for your unparalleled insight.

Regards...

Vinny Vangool

 

Did Jim ever post documentation (period photos) proving the “damage” on DP003 was from Targa? Did he ever post an explanation as to why Ferrari wouldn’t have repaired that supposed damage even though he claimed they repaired other post crash damage (in feeble attempt to explain why some damage wasn’t apparent but the bit he pointed to was original)?

It’s rhetorical of course. We know Jim never proved any damaged bits on his replica chassis came from 0846, nor did he explain why Ferrari wouldn’t have repaired crash damage. It’s ridiculous anyone would still point to such red herring claims as even the fainted possibility of being true, but Jim said it so here we are.

 

Again, for those in the nose bleeds, I have never stated that Jim has proven his case either. IMO, neither side has put forth the proper analysis or documentation to prove their case definitively thus far.

Speaking of documentation. Where is Mr. Jeff Kennedys documentation and supporting evidence that this chassis was built completely from scratch from raw steel stock by Piper versus repaired? All I've seen so far is that they believe they know the manufacturer of the Piper chassis. But again, at one point they shouted from the rooftops that it was a different manufacturer than the current belief.

In other words, do we know it to be true just cause Mr. Jeff Kennedy says so? Or does he have actual specific documentation that the chassis in question was indeed scratch built vs. repaired by whichever chassis shop they decide did the work at this time.

Regards

Vinny Vangool.

 

It isn’t incumbent on anyone to prove Jim’s car is not 0846 because he hasn’t began to prove it is. The idea the door is still open for consideration because naysayers haven’t proven the negative with “proper analysis or documentation” is absurd. Nobody has provided analysis or documentation I don’t own 0846 either, so does that mean there’s a chance I do? What about you Vince… has anyone proven conclusively you don’t own 0846? On the basis of who’s proven what it appears there’s just as much a chance you or I own 0846 or a car assembled from its remnants as Glick…

 

Well then, if that's the case.... why are they trying so hard to prove it isn't......

Can't have it both ways, either you are trying to do something, or you are not.

And some of the posters here are desperately trying to prove it isn't.

Can you tell me they are not?

Mr. Jeff Kennedy made the claim that he knows where and how the chassis was built. Not that he thinks, or it could be, he knows. So where is the proof that supports that opinion?

If anyone makes a claim, that they know something, not think they know, but know something, yet can't actually back it up with definitive evidence, then I'd have to say, the legitimacy of that claim is seriously.... diluted.

And this applies to Mr. James Glickenhaus as well as it does to Mr. Jeff Kennedy.

Regards

Vinny Vangool

 

^
I own Babe Ruth’s favorite baseball bat.

So what it could have been a toothpick from a bar he frequented? I have it. It’s mine.

Prove me wrong

 

There will always be people who believe the earth is flat no matter how much evidence you show them.

 

And those people that think you should believe them even though they've shown no actual evidence to back up their claims. If Mr. Jeff Kennedy knows this chassis was built from scratch by Piper, I'm sure he has the actual physical evidence, not just words, to back up that claim.

Or maybe he doesn't, and he's just making claims his actual evidence can't back up.

Once again, I don't believe either side has shown any concrete proof that they are indeed correct.

I am not claiming the Earth is flat. I am claiming that the procedures currently employed by both sides to prove their opinion is lacking, on both sides. Neither has proven that the world is flat or round. Neither has taken the proper steps needed to actually determine that in a definitive way.

Regards

Vinny Vangool

 

is the earth not flat?

 

Maybe you'll find someone that cares to? Is MiuraSVU currently on a case? It seems proving people wrong is his jam.

Regards

Vinny Vangool

 

Is the Earth flat?
Is the Earth Round?
Can Mr. Jeff Kennedy back up his claim with actual concrete evidence?
Can Mr. Jeff Kennedy not back up his claim with actual concrete evidence?
Would you want someone judging your car at a Ferrari concourse that can't back up his beliefs with actual verified evidence?
Would you not want someone judging your car at a Ferrari concourse that can't back up his beliefs with actual verified evidence?

So many unanswered questions...

Regards

Vinny Vangool