Thermostat Gasket Problem | FerrariChat

Thermostat Gasket Problem

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by FerrariChallenged, Oct 13, 2010.

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  1. FerrariChallenged

    Jan 14, 2009
    67
    A few years ago, I had a problem finding the correct thermostat gasket for the 456/550/575/612, and 360 water pump. The problem I ran into is that the part number for the gasket, 137873 is now used for the thermostat gasket that fits the 4.2/4.3L engine in the Maseratis and 430s. Now here is where it gets interesting: The dimensions of the gasket have totally changed from the old gasket to the new gasket. The old gasket has a smaller I.D., a larger O.D., and is wider overall in between. The new gasket is thinner, has a larger I.D, and a smaller O.D. This of course causes a fitment issue. The new gasket will not seat correctly below the thermostat on the water pump housing, and usually ends up rolling underneath the thermostat when it is installed causing a leak at the thermostat housing. Ferrari of course swears that nothing has changed since the part number remains the same. Apparently the engineers in Maranello couldn't figure out how to use a totally different part number for a totally different gasket. I was able to get some of the gaskets to seat "just right" and not roll, but that usually involved several tries, several gaskets, and several drain and refills of the cooling system. Definitely not a desireable venture. Has anyone had any luck in sourcing a gasket that will fit correctly? I will try to dig up the pictures I took as well as dimensions. It has been a few years since I have needed to do this repair, but luckily I am now able to work with Ferraris again. TIA for any help.
     
  2. 166&456

    166&456 Formula 3

    Jul 13, 2010
    1,723
    Amsterdam
    Hmm, I am looking less forward to doing this on my 456 now, it might be I am facing the same issue. I have just received all of these parts and will let you know how I went on after this weekend, for which I have this job planned.
     
  3. dersark_painclinic

    dersark_painclinic Formula Junior

    Mar 8, 2005
    981
    Glendale, CA
    Full Name:
    Lazik Der Sarkissian
    #3 dersark_painclinic, Oct 13, 2010
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2010
    I went through same pain four months ago. even I took the old gasket to ferrari I can prove it to them so they can match, every single gasket they try was bigger the old gasket and reciepy for leak. I ended up using the old one and forget changing with the new one. And no leak.
     
  4. FerrariChallenged

    Jan 14, 2009
    67
    I ended up having to use the old one on a couple of occasions when the new design would not work, but unfortunately there are times when the old one is so deteriorated that it is not an option. I'm also looking for a long term solution because unfortunately all of the old gaskets will reach their point of deterioration.
     
  5. 166&456

    166&456 Formula 3

    Jul 13, 2010
    1,723
    Amsterdam
    I have just changed my thermostat on my 456. I bought the two rings to go with it, the tiny one was installed without a fitment issue, I just put it on the thermostat itself, then dropped the thermostat in and put the larger ring in the cover. Ten minutes, done. And no leaks.

    Funny enough my car was missing the larger ring. From factory? The screws still had some green paint on them, I hated that I had to break it.

    The temperature behavior is exactly the same though! Temperature is still too low at highway speeds. Anyone any good tips? Oil thermostat broken, perhaps? Or maybe is my meter off, indicating too low?
     
  6. 4redude

    4redude Formula Junior

    Jan 13, 2005
    726
    Fungus Corner
    Full Name:
    Brian Keegan
    Your profile doesn't say what year your 456GT, but I'm assuming it's an early one.
    Have your dealer check the Service Bulletins. There is one pertaining to oil & water temp senders being mis-marked when delivered to Ferrari. I don't have access to my bulletins right now, but something about a red or orange collar on the sender itself and water sender was installed for oil or vice versa.

    Hope that helps.
     
  7. 166&456

    166&456 Formula 3

    Jul 13, 2010
    1,723
    Amsterdam
    #7 166&456, Oct 24, 2010
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2010
    4redude, that's possible. Mine is an early one with 57.000km. If you could look up how to diagnose that, that'd be great.
    If that's the case then I have another problem because that would mean my car overheats when not in motion. At highway speeds the temp is too low, at stop and go it goes to the middle of the dial, and then the fan is on at full. It could mean it's too hot right there...
    It would explain why I feel the temperature and subsequently the fan come on quite quickly after a cold start.
    Mine is an early one so it could still benefit from getting a smaller waterpump pulley (166464) installed, I think I still have the larger one.

    Maybe I should rebleed the cooling system first. Can one of the small 8mm hoses being clogged cause this? I replaced the one to the radiator but as it turns out there is another one from the expansion tank to the Vee of the engine. That one is probably just as bad as the one I replaced. On the to do list.
     
  8. Doctor7474

    Doctor7474 Formula Junior

    Jun 20, 2010
    367
    Hoover Al,former Atl
    Full Name:
    Doctor
    Are we talking O rings or gaskets here? Sorry I'm not acquainted with these but if we are talking O rings (and yes I know some folks are not going to like this) why not take the parts to Napa and find the correct O ring for it? Most Napa's have a huge generic bin full of O rings, and I've never had any issues as far as longevity with them.
     
  9. Doug42

    Doug42 Rookie

    Apr 7, 2019
    2
    Full Name:
    Doug Coulter
    First post ever here.. Please forgive me if there was a previous post that I didn't see regarding the issue I'm having.

    I as well have a slow, but steady leak coming from the thermostat gasket at the water pump. I ordered the part from an online distributer which was the Ferrari 137873 GASKET (Item 15 in the parts breakout). Upon installing the gasket I realized that they were in no way similar at all.. Ive tried to install it anyhow, and it continues its leak. The new gasket is the one pictured in the plastic in the photo and has a smaller I.D, Smaller I.D and approximately 2 mm thinner.

    Does anyone know if there is a match to what I have pictured that is in rough shape or any suggestions on a viable option?
    Hoping you may have had some luck!

    I'm pretty certain that it can't be repaired, but, may have to attempt.
     

    Attached Files:

  10. Ferrari Tech

    Ferrari Tech Formula 3

    Mar 5, 2010
    1,126
    Georgia
    Full Name:
    Wade Williams
    Doug, it is a long term issue. I have had the same issue with these "o-ring" style thermostat gaskets. I just did a 348 and that one was the right size. I will see if I can find out from my parts guy where he got it and let you know. I am not sure it is the same but it may be worth a shot.
     
  11. Doug42

    Doug42 Rookie

    Apr 7, 2019
    2
    Full Name:
    Doug Coulter
    Much appreciated Merlin! That gives me a slight bit of hope, Ive been running into many road blocks along the way with this... I'm hesitant to go the "Permatex" gasket, however, without the right gasket, i'm not certain there are many choices.
    Again, I thank you for any assistance or guidance you may have!
     
  12. Ferrari Tech

    Ferrari Tech Formula 3

    Mar 5, 2010
    1,126
    Georgia
    Full Name:
    Wade Williams
    I wish I had a better answer for you. Getting part that work is becoming a real problem as these car get older. Its not just Ferrari parts, not picking on anyone, it is across the board on old car parts. Sometimes, it just won't fit.
     

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