Ticking noise coming from F512M engine bay

Hi all, after 3 years i found this discussion... i have a same problem with a disturbed kind of screaming loud cracking noise out of my F512M engine bay which scares me a bit today.... and didn't even drive the car except just starting it! This morning at a cold start, haven't driven in the last 2 weeks (weather is around 15 degree C so not cold not warm), and once the car is started i hear to really weird ticking and cranking/cracking noise! I switch it off and restart in a few minutes and it's the same! (i also see some small/little white smoke coming out of the exhaust) and i'm really worry now... Can anyone shed some light on what is the possibility of the cracking noise came from? Is it really the A/C compressor? I didn't even turn on the A/C at all?! The difficulties during covid is that many places aren't open as usual and it's best not to bring cars in if it is not an absolute must (i did not move the car at all and am thinking maybe it needs to be tow to the garage after the holiday)...

 

why you post your problem twice?

 

Sorry guys, i was desperate so i posted twice as i found two different threads here...

@Romano, as per my reply message to your PM, i found out last night that the bad/ weird sound on the M was noise came from the starter! The started kept starting the car even after it's been fired up... My friend told me that happens to TRs, 512s on cold start and that it might be the solenoid for the starter failed on me... Apparently there's a "piston" that moves by the solenoid for the starter? It didn't roll back as i understand and it makes the starter keep on trying to start the car even after it has successfully started? I haven't search if there's such topic/ thread shared here on FChat yet but so far that's what i got. Anyone can shed lights on what may have gone wrong? Thanks a lot in advance.

 

you may use a stethoscope to hear if the starter will get turned by the engine. if so then may be you only dismantle the starter, clean all, lube a little and try again.
but also could be that the ignition key lock is not working right and when you go with the key from starting to normal igniton on that there is still power on the wire for the solenoid of the starter.

 

The starter staying engaged after releasing the key to "run" can certainly be caused by the piston in the starter solenoid not freely returning to its rest position, but it can also be caused if someone has added a relay upstream of the starter solenoid and that added relay has failed. Do you have any obvious wiring changes/additions near the starter solenoid connections?

 

I had that happen to me on my 88 tr. It kept going even when I turned off the key. Scared the crap out of me! Thought to run around and turn the kill switch and shut off the power. If it stays engaged and the engine starts you could damage the fly wheel. I had it happen on a big truck one time and the starter overrevved and melted catching fire.

 

You are are truly experts in here... i did see some added wiring though it may not be related to the starter (but i am not a good mechanic), so may i ask, if there were an additional relay added, is it going to be on top of the starter solenoid or inside the fuse box?

 

Thanks Romano again. I don't have a stethoscope but i will try to look further into whether it's sound that came out of the starter again. I know it's not the ignition key lock as i used my hand to help pop back the key into the normal position already and tested it... so it shouldn't be the key lock. One thing i did notice was the potential added wiring around the are (starter) so when Steve mentioned above i thought it might be possible from an added relay. But your suggestion about dismantling the starter, clean, lube, and try is also an excellent idea. I will first to try take a picture and post here as well as your suggested recording... thanks a million.

 

Dennis, that was exactly what it was going through my mind.... scared all craps out of me that day.

 

Typically, the added relay would be sitting on top of the engine just behind the starter solenoid, but could be wrapped in a bunch of black electrical tape -- so look for a "lump". (Not in the fusebox -- although there is another wiring modification at the fusebox to interconnect some white wires that will improve solenoid operation reliability).

 

Many thanks for both Romano and Steve's help.. attached pictures of the engine bay... i realized that it looks like someone has added a relay or something as there is an unknown wire near the starter solenoid? Is it considered an obvious wiring changes/ additions near the starter solenoid connections? Thanks a million guys.

 

Sorry forgot to attach the pictures... here you go!
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Looks like it to me. I don't have the 512M wiring schematics, so can't be 100% sure, but the wire going to your starter solenoid and the female terminal don't look stock to me:

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Also, the cable that looks like it is spirally-wrapped with black insulation tape looks added/non-stock to me. Is there a "lump" (relay) at the other end of that added cable?:

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PS Even if you have an added relay there, it might not be what's causing the trouble. You've only reported having a horrible noise at start-up. Plenty of other things to suspect...

PPS Do you need to add F512M to your Profile?

 

Hi thanks guys for your kind help and sharing particularly to Steve and Romano. These are all good info for me and others that may have such question/ problem in the future...

The problem / bad sound doesn't always comes on so sometimes it starts without much bad sounds... Right now the initial diagnosis from my garage is there was an extra relay (blue wire) added on top of the old one (that was done by my dad's past mechanic from years before) and it's probably the problem. We still don't know yet but it's possible that the old one was not working well back then and the guy added the new one without cutting off the old relay and so i heard? Upon ignition it gives power to the solenoid to the starter but either one kept providing power to the starter hence the starter kept the solenoid up and made bad sound... this could potentially heard the flywheel as well which no one wants and got to be fixed asap! This car was pass down to me by my old man and he's helping me to check with his past mechanics right now though i am sure it'll be difficult to find that guy after so many years (or he would even remember)... Right now, my guys here is going to explore fixing the starter for me with a solenoid repair kit they found online (don't understand what they mean) and i shall know the next few days. Will keep you guys updated on the situation. I have also taken Romano's suggestion to spray silicone gel on the AC compressor belt too just to be safe... Thanks guys again!

 

Aaaack! Having one added relay is cheesy enough, but having 2 added relays is a new low in cheesy

No harm in having your mechanic rebuild the starter solenoid and confirm that it is working well, but, IMO for improving the starting reliability, what you should do is:

1. Remove all of the added relays and added wiring at the starter area,
2. Reconnect the stock white wire at the starter area to terminal 50 on the starter solenoid (i.e., the stock arrangement), and
3. Add a jumper wire at the fuse-relay panel to eliminate the voltage drops that can occur in the I and F connectors (I believe your F512M uses the same fuse-relay panel as a 512TR so this should apply to it, too):

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Good Hunting!