Totally stumped with headlight lifters | FerrariChat
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Totally stumped with headlight lifters

Discussion in '348/355' started by Harry348, Feb 2, 2013.

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  1. Harry348

    Harry348 Karting

    Nov 20, 2012
    64
    Middle of France
    Full Name:
    Harry V
    #1 Harry348, Feb 2, 2013
    Hi, I am normally quite good at figuring things out but this one has me totally stumped. Neither headlights will lift on my 348. (The headlights and main beam work OK)

    I have changed all fuses - no difference
    I have tested all the relays and changed them - no difference
    I have changed the fuse box - no difference
    I have changed all the diodes on the lifter motors - no difference
    I have opened the lifter motors and cleaned the contacts - no difference

    I have not touched the column switch because the main lifter relay clicks when I turn on the headlights.
    Having said that the relay for the flasher lights does not click when I pull the flasher stalk.

    What I really need is a wiring diagram for the 348 but cannot find one anywhere.

    Can anyone help me out with the lifter problem or a wiring diagram ?

    Many thanks
    Harry
     
  2. bosshog8

    bosshog8 Formula Junior

    Mar 13, 2011
    448
    Pinelands NJ
    Full Name:
    Demetrius
    #2 bosshog8, Feb 2, 2013
    The workshop manual has the schematics in it and can be downloaded here: All Ferraris

    I'm not completely sure but I believe there is a relay hidden or something in the front area. A search should turn up some more info.
     
  3. Harry348

    Harry348 Karting

    Nov 20, 2012
    64
    Middle of France
    Full Name:
    Harry V
    #3 Harry348, Feb 2, 2013
    Thanks for the advice.

    I have the download from the website mentioned and although it has an electrical section there are no circuit diagrams. So i'm still searching for electrical layouts.

    I'll go and jump in the boot and hunt around a bit for the hidden relays.

    Harry
     
  4. 2NA

    2NA F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner Professional Ferrari Technician

    Dec 29, 2006
    18,221
    Twin Cities
    Full Name:
    Tim Keseluk
    #4 2NA, Feb 2, 2013
    The wiring diagrams are there, keep looking.

    Very confusing though.
     
  5. Samy

    Samy Formula Junior

    Dec 2, 2005
    603
    #5 Samy, Feb 2, 2013
    Look at Page 433 , Relais a & h & i , Fuse 3 & 15 , Earth Connectors of the fuses and lifter motors. Maybe more relais and fuses i had only a quick look..
    Also both sides must be checked if one is damaged both lifters can be deactivated.
     
  6. Harry348

    Harry348 Karting

    Nov 20, 2012
    64
    Middle of France
    Full Name:
    Harry V
    #6 Harry348, Feb 2, 2013
    Well there are six relays under the front trunk cover, they all seem to test Ok and functioning as per their diagrams. So still no closer.
     
  7. Samy

    Samy Formula Junior

    Dec 2, 2005
    603
    #7 Samy, Feb 2, 2013
    Did you also check all the fuses? And ground points? And messure the wires? And Both headlight lifters contacts and diodes? Checked the voltage the light stick sends out? Somewhere in the chain it must be stopping. If you go from the lightswitch to the first relais then to the next one and messure voltage you should find where it stopps. Or maybe a ground failure from the motor to the chassis ground point.

    Samy
     
  8. Harry348

    Harry348 Karting

    Nov 20, 2012
    64
    Middle of France
    Full Name:
    Harry V
    #8 Harry348, Feb 2, 2013
    Thanks for the help but all those relays and fuses have been tested OK, and I have also changed them all for different ones. No difference though. Still no lifting action.
     
  9. Harry348

    Harry348 Karting

    Nov 20, 2012
    64
    Middle of France
    Full Name:
    Harry V
    #9 Harry348, Feb 2, 2013
    Thanks Samy

    I havent investigated the switch stalk because when I turn the headlights the main headlight lifter activates with a click.

    I have changed all the fuses and I have soldered new diodes into the lifter motors.

    I will try and investigate the steering column switch tomorrow but I figured that if the lifter relay clicked then the switch should be OK.
     
  10. Samy

    Samy Formula Junior

    Dec 2, 2005
    603
    #10 Samy, Feb 2, 2013
    Yes if it clicks it should be ok, but then did you follow the shematic to the next "step" and check if the voltage arrives there? Only way to find the problem is to look step by step.


    Shortcuts maybe the ground connection i mentioned befor, and did you also put the diodes in the right direction? Did you tested to put 12V directly to the lifters motor connection and see if it turns? If that all is ok you have to messure step by step through the shematic from relais to relais to connector until you got the problem.

    Samy
     
  11. Miltonian

    Miltonian F1 Veteran

    Dec 11, 2002
    5,966
    Milton, Wash.
    Full Name:
    Jeff B.
    #11 Miltonian, Feb 2, 2013
    Harry; I just took a quick look at the wiring diagram and at the illustration in the parts book. I see that besides the main wiring connector at each headlight motor, there is also a separate single black wire that provides the ground. Are you sure that these wires are plugged in? They are supposed to go to a common ground point. Even if the wire is plugged in at the motor, is it possible that the other end of this wire is not plugged into the common ground, and it's just hanging somewhere? It would be easy to check with an ohm meter, or you could just run a jumper wire from the ground wire on the motor to a known good ground point on the frame.
     
  12. Harry348

    Harry348 Karting

    Nov 20, 2012
    64
    Middle of France
    Full Name:
    Harry V
    #12 Harry348, Feb 2, 2013
    Hi Everyone.

    I finally found the wiring diagrams on the Ferrari website so that should help, I can now follow the wires by colour codes.

    Yes the black earthing wire is connected.
    Yes the motors operate if you apply negative to the small black wire and positive to the solid green wire. I also tested that the pick ups were turning on and off with each revolution of the motors pick up wheel.

    I will have another go tomorrow...........but for now......off to the pub
     
  13. Harry348

    Harry348 Karting

    Nov 20, 2012
    64
    Middle of France
    Full Name:
    Harry V
    #13 Harry348, Feb 9, 2013
    Thank you everyone for your helpful advice on my faulty headlight lifters.
    I changed the diodes, changed the fuses, changed the relays, changed the fuse board, took the motors apart and cleaned the contacts. Then I finally found a wiring diagram so I could follow the cables and test them all. All of them connected fine. Then I discovered the problem.

    With the fuse box open I tested that the relay was delivering power to the black/green lifter cables which it was, but then no power reached the motor. So I took off the connecter from the back of the fuse board and found that the female connector was so wide open it was impossible to make contact with the male from the fuse board. So I went through every connector squeezing the female connectors and that has solved the problem.

    I cannot believe that such a prestigious marque can be produced with such sloppy electronics.

    So the lesson here is, if anyone has any electrical problems, first check all the plug in connectors on the back of the fuse board.

    Best wishes from a Happy Harry
     
  14. WATSON

    WATSON Two Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Sep 9, 2010
    23,700
    WI
    #14 WATSON, Feb 9, 2013
    Yay! Glad you have it fixed!

    For the record, these are words to live by:
    I have had similar issues everywhere in my car. I wonder how many perfectly good parts have been tossed in the garbage bin becuase of simple wiring problems.....
     

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