TR engine out by do-it-yourselfer... | FerrariChat

TR engine out by do-it-yourselfer...

Discussion in 'Boxers/TR/M' started by carguy, Apr 3, 2006.

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  1. carguy

    carguy F1 Rookie

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    #1 carguy, Apr 3, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Hello Gang....well it's my 3rd time at dropping a motor out of a TR. Getting pretty good at it, but it's still not fun since I have no hoist or power tools. But it can be done if your a mechanically inclined enthusiast. Normally I leave the rear wheels/tires on, jack the car up with two floor jacks, one on each side, and roll the whole drivetrain out the back. But one of my floorjacks wouldn't go high enough. So I had to remove the wheels/tires and use a dolly to set the motor on to get it low enough to clear the rear frame cross member. I did also manage to remove the AC compressor once the car was raised up a bit. Attached are a few pics of the big "event".
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  2. lm2504me

    lm2504me Formula 3
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    #2 lm2504me, Apr 3, 2006
    Wow! The third time!
    I have been thinking of going from a Dino 246GT to a Testarossa. I haven't owned a Ferrari with over 350hp before or one with ECU's. I almost bought one before I bought my Dino, but was steered away from the "negative press".

    I have been reading all the "negative press" on Ferrari chat about TR maintenance and their costs. The Dino has been very easy to maintain and work on. I finished the motor rebuild last September and have put 4k miles on it so far.

    Do you find the maintenance on the TR to be straightforward?

    Any insights appreciated. I will perform more searches on Ferrari chat on the maintenance aspects. I am a DIY'er for all my Ferrari maintenance.

    Thanks and look forward to more photos and details,
    Richard
     
  3. Myhorse

    Myhorse Formula Junior

    Oct 31, 2003
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    #3 Myhorse, Apr 3, 2006
    On behalf of all TR owners, I would like to nominate CARGUY as an honourary Fchat member!!!
    Way to go
     
  4. Llenroc

    Llenroc F1 Rookie
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    #4 Llenroc, Apr 3, 2006
    Way to go Jeff, I just finished my engine out on my 355, except I did it the easy way I have hoist in the garage, very commendable for doing it without one. Regards, Vern
     
  5. carguy

    carguy F1 Rookie

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    #5 carguy, Apr 4, 2006
    Thank You Im2504me , Myhorse , and Vern for being so supportive. The first time I did a service I was scared to death of making a mistake, but if you use common sense, be patient, and stay organized things will work out fine. I'm doing a lot more disassembly than a shop would because I'm gonna detail everything....carshow season is coming up. I would say the biggest pains of doing this job are: #1: Water hoses at front of engine are very very hard to get to and loosen/tighten. #2: Shock tower nuts are difficult to access. #3: It's a messy job no matter how careful you try to be. #4: Routing the throttle cable back into place during reassembly can be a problem.

    Last night I sealed off all electrical connections in the engine bay, and today I will degrease and clean everything up. I'll do the engine also. And then I have to disassemble the motor down to the block & heads, and start detailing and assembling. I'm also going to use stainless fasteners where I can. It's a big job but it will be worth it when I pop the hood.
     
  6. ferrarifixer

    ferrarifixer F1 Veteran
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    #6 ferrarifixer, Apr 4, 2006
    Keep a log of your time... accuratley. It's always enlightening!!

    It also helps us shops/mechanics be more easily understood when it comes to invoice time.

    I reckon a really experienced tech can work at 85-90% efficiency on a TRossa job like this. ie spend ~40 hours, charge ~35-36.

    My guess is you'll spend 100 hours on it, from drive in to sign off.

    Just some tips...

    You can leave the AC connected and hanging in the engine bay.
    There's no need to remove the gravel guards at all.
    Or the expansion tank.
    Or the exhaust.
    I leave the two main water pipes connected, just loosen the hose clamps, then let 'em slide off on the way out, and take them right off once out and then fight them on the way back in.

    Good onya for doing it on the ground. *SHUDDER*
     
  7. BT

    BT F1 World Champ
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    #7 BT, Apr 4, 2006
    You are a braver soul than I am. Bravo!
    BT
     
  8. carguy

    carguy F1 Rookie

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    #8 carguy, Apr 4, 2006
    Thanks ferrarifixer....I remove as many items as I can because I'm going to restore and detail the engine bay.

    I must also give credit where it is due: ferrarifixer Phil Hughes...YOU are the one who gave me the tip on leaving the AC pump hooked up when I was doing this job a few years ago, it's advice and I followed it! So I must Thank You for that :)

    Another tip from Tom Bukowski: Before rolling the engine back into the car, run a small wire through the pathway that the throttle cable goes...and use it to pull the throttle cable back through once the engine is in the car.

    As for doing this job "on the ground" yeah it is a lot of physical work. But hey I'm not that young anymore and this stuff keeps rigormortis from setting in.
     
  9. ferrarifixer

    ferrarifixer F1 Veteran
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    #9 ferrarifixer, Apr 4, 2006
    Ha ha, no worries mate!

    Of course, you "should" change the receiver dryer periodically anyway. And always check and top up the gas.

    Dumping the gas to atmosphere is a serious offence here, so unless you have a recovery/recycling station, you MUST leave it connected, or call a mobile AC guy to suck it out.
     
  10. bpu699

    bpu699 F1 World Champ
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    #10 bpu699, Apr 4, 2006
    Any chance you could do a step by step photo documentation on how to do this??? That would be extremely helpful!!! :)
     
  11. Chiaro_Slag

    Chiaro_Slag F1 Veteran

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    #11 Chiaro_Slag, Apr 4, 2006
    Do you adjust the valves while you are in there?

    Awesome, keep the pics coming!
     
  12. carguy

    carguy F1 Rookie

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    #12 carguy, Apr 4, 2006
    Yes I will be installing new cam belts, and new tensioner bearings. I will also check valve clearances....but the car had a major about 2 years ago so I suspect they will be okay.

    ferrarifixer Phil: I'm sorry but I haven't kept a log of times/tasks. I'm spending lots of time with cleaners and tooth brushes, scrubbing everything. Very tedious work I must say. Is there something specific you want me to time?
     
  13. Llenroc

    Llenroc F1 Rookie
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    #13 Llenroc, Apr 4, 2006
    Jeff, Just a minor comment on using stainless nuts and bolts, which I love by the way, I ran into a problem after changing a bunch on my 348 years ago. After I did the change some time later I had to go back in to do something and droped a nut down into a spot that I could use a magnet to retreve but, since it was stainless I had a tough time getting to it. Just a thought, Regards, Vern
     
  14. Llenroc

    Llenroc F1 Rookie
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    #14 Llenroc, Apr 4, 2006
    Come on Bill you can do this too. Beleive me if I can do it you can. If a man/human built it you should be able to do it too, why was the original assembler any smarter the you? Patients and focus is all it takes. Regards, Vern
     
  15. ferrarifixer

    ferrarifixer F1 Veteran
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    #15 ferrarifixer, Apr 4, 2006
    Just time the whole job at least, but of course... imagine you had an inquisitive customer to justify your time to.....
     
  16. carguy

    carguy F1 Rookie

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    #16 carguy, Apr 4, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Here's the latest. This motor was washed with something corrosive, as you can see any parts originally plated or plain steel are all rusty and nasty. While taking out a bolt from the upper left intake plenum, the allen wrench just rounded the inside of the head. It felt very "gooey" and needless to say I was not happy. But I did manage to drill out the bolt head and extract the threaded portion. I took a pic of the bolt head in my hand. Also attached are pics showing corrosion around the fuel injectors, and a lot of filth around the right side fuel distributor. New injectors will be going in as soon as I get everything ready. I'll work through the evening taking more stuff off. Stay tuned.....
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  17. bpu699

    bpu699 F1 World Champ
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    #17 bpu699, Apr 4, 2006
    Awe, come on...pretty please. Can't you put together a manual on taking the motor out and doing a major. Nothing dramatic, just a step-by-step with hundreds of pics ;)! This could be your legacy! Your claim to fame!!!

    I honestly think that would be a huge asset to the community. Heck, if you could videotape the removal, installation...I would love a copy. Pretttyyy puh-lezz!!!

    I will probably be doing this in a year or so...can you tell?! I just want to detail the hell out of the motor and replace all the tubing,etc..
     
  18. carguy

    carguy F1 Rookie

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    #18 carguy, Apr 4, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  19. tbakowsky

    tbakowsky F1 World Champ
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    #19 tbakowsky, Apr 4, 2006
    Good job!

    I've got one on the go aswell at the momment. Full major with everything, and to top it all off, I gotta rebuild the trans aswell! layshaft which holds 4 and 5th gears, front bearing went south, and drove some nastie peices of bearing through the gearbox. I'll post some pic's of my findings tomorrow.
     
  20. sparky p-51

    sparky p-51 Formula 3

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    #20 sparky p-51, Apr 5, 2006
    Great stuff Jeff....Keep it comming.
     
  21. carguy

    carguy F1 Rookie

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    #21 carguy, Apr 7, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Yesterday I finally finished up cleaning the engine block. I must say I don't know how some you get your engine all bright and shiney and new looking. I busted a gut with cleaners, solvents, and wire brushes.....some areas look great but there are recessed areas where I just couldn't get satisfactory results. The cam covers were a real mess, a good friend of mine has a large glass beading cabinet so I popped over to his shop and after about an hour of work the cam covers are stripped bare. I then washed them in solvent and hosed them out really really good to be sure all the media was flushed out. I ordered the red crinkle paint from VHT and it will arrive today. It is a bit darker than the Ferrari red, so I'm going to lightly "fog" on a coat of the appropriate red after the crinkle sets up. I also started cleaning up the fuel injection system....but I'm gonna have to take everything apart to get it right. I did this once before and it's more work than it's worth....but I'm anal and just can't help it. Attached are a couple pics, one of the entire engine wire harness (nervous system) and one of the blasted and cleaned cam covers. Fun....fun....fun....
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  22. carguy

    carguy F1 Rookie

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    #22 carguy, Apr 7, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    So far so good on refinishing the cam covers. I applied about a ton of crinkle paint, in 3 very heavy, near running, coats about 8 or 10 minutes apart. I then waited for about 5 minutes and then set them over the top of my little shop furnace, and in about 6 or 7 minutes the crinkle finish started appearing. The shade of red is a bit dark but they look pretty good I'd say. While they were suspended over the furnace I carefully peeled off all the masking tape from the mounting surfaces, etc. After a few days of drying time, I will apply a fog coat of the proper shade of red and hope for the best. Applying this paint and getting good results is almost an art form!
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  23. Chiaro_Slag

    Chiaro_Slag F1 Veteran

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    #23 Chiaro_Slag, Apr 7, 2006
    Looking good! I love the way parts look after getting a good bead blasting. :)
     
  24. curtisc63

    curtisc63 Formula 3
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    #24 curtisc63, Apr 7, 2006
    Carguy - thanks for keeping us all up to date on your project and progress. I check back often to see the updates. Anxious to see the mechanical work documented and any special techniques you use. I hope you can push me over the edge to do this service on my own once the time comes. 3rd time! I am impressed and second your nomination for Honorary Membership.

    CC
     
  25. carguy

    carguy F1 Rookie

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    #25 carguy, Apr 8, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Thanks for the positive comments everyone. Last night I finished up the cam covers by scraping and lightly sanding the paint off the raised ridges, it took a lot more time than I thought it would. Then I checked valve clearances and all were withing specification thank goodness. And lastly I installed new timing belts and tensioner bearings. I cranked the motor to top dead center, and verified this with the builder's marks on the cams and cam retainer caps. Everything lined up perfectly. Then I marked the cam sprockets and belts, and then transfer the marks from the old belts to the new ones. When installing the new belts the marks must line up to the ones on the sprockets or else I've done something wrong. Many say this isn't necessary but I say you can't be too careful during this operation. I had to destroy one tensioner bearing to get if off, the other one just slid off nicely. Pics attached. Oooops....sorry I've exceeded my quota for uploading pics. So only 2 of them show up. Sorry guys....
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