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Tracked vs. non-tracked F40's - Opinions...

Discussion in '288GTO/F40/F50/Enzo/LaFerrari' started by SteveB, Jan 23, 2004.

  1. SteveB

    SteveB Karting

    Oct 5, 2003
    62
    Puyallup, WA
    Full Name:
    Steve Barker
    Since I am in the market for an F40, I would like to know if anyone has any opinions on tracked vs. non-tracked.

    Thanks,

    Steve
     
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  3. zjpj

    zjpj F1 Veteran

    Nov 4, 2003
    5,938
    USA
    Tracked cars will obviously have a bit more wear, probably need to have certain parts replaced a few miles sooner. But is there any real way to tell other than just taking the seller's word for it?
     
  4. judge4re

    judge4re F1 World Champ

    Apr 26, 2003
    13,234
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    Dr. Dumb Ass
    There is a big difference between a car that has been tracked, and a track-whore. As with any used Ferrari purchase, maintenance, maintenance, maintenace.

    Buy the best you can afford, otherwise, you're buying a cat in a bag.
     
  5. Brian C. Stradale

    Brian C. Stradale F1 Rookie
    Lifetime Rossa

    Mar 17, 2002
    3,603
    Dallas, TX, USA
    I'd much prefer a well-maintained track F40 than a neglected F40.

    Most who take their cars to the track regularly are fast enough that they need to be careful... they won't go out with a poorly maintained car... they also want it in top condition to enhance their speed... so they take good care of it.

    Those who track occasionally will generally have some preventative maintenance done before they take it out... thus, the fact that it gets tracked occasionally means it gets a good maintenance check occasionally.

    Those who let their cars sit for a long time often do not maintain it for a long time.

    Yes, track time means that things like brakes and tires may need replacement sooner... and that it has gotten more revs/mile than other cars... but warm/hot revs is what Ferraris are built for... its those people that rev them when the engine is still cold that you need to watch out for!!
     
  6. SteveB

    SteveB Karting

    Oct 5, 2003
    62
    Puyallup, WA
    Full Name:
    Steve Barker
    Thanks for the feedback.
     
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  8. FLATOUTRACING

    FLATOUTRACING F1 Rookie

    Aug 20, 2001
    2,684
    East Coast
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    Jon K.
    Steve,

    I am no expert with the F40, but as far as track time, it's all dependent on maintenance and replacement of worn parts.

    An F40 that is taken to the track 4 times per year but isn't well maintained can be just as bad or worse than someone who does 2000 miles per year at the track but has an extensive maintenance done after every event.

    My F355 Challenge had a few thousand hard driven track miles but I maintained it religiously replacing anything of concern showing wear.

    I had 15K engine services done each year (instead of every 5 years or 15K), I had most suspension parts regularly replaced, I replaced all fluids after every event and so on and so on.

    Right before I sold the car this month we had a leakdown and compression test performed and even after 5000 track miles and another 8000 street miles the mechanics at Ferrari of Washington were in amazement that my numbers were as good as 355's with less than 2000 miles on them.

    So I don't agree with the "trackwhore" statement.

    Get the service records and read them page for page.

    Obviously an F40 is ten times more expensive to repair than my car and much more complex but I wouldn't discount a car that an enthusiast took to the track often.


    Jon P. Kofod
    www.flatoutracing.net
     
  9. SteveB

    SteveB Karting

    Oct 5, 2003
    62
    Puyallup, WA
    Full Name:
    Steve Barker
    Jon, your comments are appreciated.
     
  10. FLATOUTRACING

    FLATOUTRACING F1 Rookie

    Aug 20, 2001
    2,684
    East Coast
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    Jon K.
    Steve,

    One thing I should have added. While I wouldn't discount or steer clear of a tracked F40 with good service records I do think that unlike a 355, 360, 550 and such the F40 is a collectible and must also be looked at from an investment standpoint so therefore I would expect to discount the price of an F40 by some amount to reflect track time.

    I guess it all depends on your budget and why you are buying the car. If you aren't very concerned with investment potentional (or it's low on your list) or are planning to track the car yourself then you may be able to save a few bucks!

    However, the majority of people that buy these (not all) buy them soley as street cars and consider their investment potential and exclusivity an important part of the car, and wouldn't touch one that has been tracked.

    It's a stigma that's hard to shake.

    Regards,

    Jon
     
  11. zjpj

    zjpj F1 Veteran

    Nov 4, 2003
    5,938
    USA

    But, at the same time, if the investment is long term, then it won't be a problem. Once a few more decades roll by, they will all need to have major restorations. After a certain amount of time elapses, track time won't matter for these F40s, which will then be "classic cars." What 250GTO, 250 SWB, etc. hasn't been tracked?
     
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  13. FLATOUTRACING

    FLATOUTRACING F1 Rookie

    Aug 20, 2001
    2,684
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    Jon K.
    Yes! That is completely true. It all depends on what and why you are buying the car.

    In my case, I have huge amount of respect for people like Chris Parr who bought his F40 for one reason.....

    ....to drive it like Enzo intended !!!!!

    Regards,

    Jon
     
  14. Roland E Linder

    Roland E Linder Formula 3

    Nov 3, 2003
    1,791
    COLORADO
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    Roland E Linder
    I would not hesitate to buy a F40 that was driven on the track. Being an F instructor, I saw a few f40 at track events and generaly speaking
    they were well maintained. Like it was said in other post, the owners are smart enough to have the car check out. It might not be the case with one occasionaly driven on the street.
    Anyway, a car driven on the track is in better mechanical shape.
    LOL
    Roland
    F40LM
     
  15. WILLIAM H

    WILLIAM H Three Time F1 World Champ

    Nov 1, 2003
    34,891
    Victory Circle
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    HUBBSTER
    I'm thinking about getting an F40 in 05 perhaps. I would definatley go with a car that has seen the track & is sorted out rather than some 25 mile garage queen.

    A track driver has fixed the stuff that was sub par & will probably tell you what the cars weaknesses are from experience + you get the owners wealth of experience on the track. A garage queen owner has no idea what his car is about, Obviously
     
  16. judge4re

    judge4re F1 World Champ

    Apr 26, 2003
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    A track whore is a used and abused car, one that's driven into the ground and then dumped. This is a far cry from a car that has been properly looked after. There are good and bad cars at every price level.

    Either stay away from the garage queens (if you intend to use it), or discount them heavily. If you are going to get one, make sure that you can afford to keep it. If you can't budget $25k in service the first year (just in case), you can't afford one.
     
  17. Suneal

    Suneal Rookie

    Dec 7, 2003
    20
    FL
    I a very close friend of mine owns an F40 (first one in the US) with ~5,500 miles. I'd say 4,500-5,000 of those miles are related to the track (driving on track, to the track, to his mechanic 3 hours away, etc.). He maintains his car very well, as he drives it on track very often. Track driving is basically the only kind of driving he does in it (he also has given rides to family members and me).
    If I were you, I wouldn't look at a tracked F40 as a negative when buying- I'd look at it as a positive. As stated before, tracked F40
     
  18. Suneal

    Suneal Rookie

    Dec 7, 2003
    20
    FL
    I a very close friend of mine owns an F40 (first one in the US) with ~5,500 miles. I'd say 4,500-5,000 of those miles are related to the track (driving on track, to the track, to his mechanic 3 hours away, etc.). He maintains his car very well, as he drives it on track very often. Track driving is basically the only kind of driving he does in it (he also has given rides to family members and me).
    If I were you, I wouldn't look at a tracked F40 as a negative when buying- I'd look at it as a positive. As stated before, tracked F40s get checkups very often.
    And his car isn't for sale :)
     
  19. zsnnf

    zsnnf Formula 3

    Sep 11, 2003
    1,877
    Funny,
    Two of the cars I looked at when I was buying, the owners swore the cars were never tracked. Both of them had track rubber stuck between the tread on the rear tires.......
    A track is the only place you will be able to fully appreciate the F40. I don't think it makes a great GT car. It likes to accelerate, decelerate and turn. It may also like to cruise on the freeway, but it is VERY tough to keep it in double digit speeds.

    Like a thoroughbred race horse, Born to run.......

    What difference does it make if the tires are worn out or hard from age? Either way I think a performance tire should be replaced every three years. I prefere to wear them out. :) The same goes with most of the services on these cars. Maximum three years. Used or not used.

    I agree with most of the statements about track cars being better maintained. I am getting ready to track my car. But before I do I am going to do a full 30K service. I will then change all the fluids again afterwards.

    Good luck on your search,
    Drive a lot of cars before you buy one, feel and listen to the cars, they will all tell different stories. You will know which one is right for you.

    Rick
    P.S. I drove my F40 in the rain yesterday. It was awesume watching the way the water flows out of the vents and off of the car. Something a garage queen will never know.

    Rick
     
  20. SteveB

    SteveB Karting

    Oct 5, 2003
    62
    Puyallup, WA
    Full Name:
    Steve Barker
    Thanks again for all the comments. Based on what I am reading here, I will not be turned off by a tracked F40.

    Steve
     
  21. KennyH

    KennyH F1 Veteran
    Owner

    Aug 13, 2001
    5,225
    NYC
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    Kenny

    "Shotgun" :)
     
  22. FLATOUTRACING

    FLATOUTRACING F1 Rookie

    Aug 20, 2001
    2,684
    East Coast
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    Jon K.
    Thanks for the clarification. I thought possibly the term was simply meant to conotate a car that spends a lot of time at the track.

    Regards,

    Jon
     
  23. TestShoot

    TestShoot F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Sep 1, 2003
    10,398
    Beverly Hills
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    King Koopa
    As a former track 40 owner and currently getting back in the market, the things you can expect in a track 40:

    Lower ground clearance, and cracked, scraped, bruised ground effects, lips and the like.

    in the wheel wells look for 'kitty-litter' pockmarks, the sign of a bad driver or passive weenie getting bullied around the track, either way lots of chips=damage. Offroading in the gravel can fracture suspension parts and even the chassis. (damned carbon fibre)

    If the car is pristine, it probably has had all the rubber settle, meaning, dried into place. Some wear in the suspension will mean the rubber has flexed/contracted, therefore a good sign.

    If it is too clean, you will need to replace parts right away before heading off to the track. Worn is better than dried because you would hate to crak something and have a catastrophic failure in a chicane.
     
  24. SteveB

    SteveB Karting

    Oct 5, 2003
    62
    Puyallup, WA
    Full Name:
    Steve Barker
    TestShootCom, great info. Thanks.

    Steve
     

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