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Upgrading from a 308...TR or 348?

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by Shamile, Dec 25, 2003.

  1. Shamile

    Shamile F1 Veteran

    Dec 31, 2002
    6,168
    Lakeland FL
    Full Name:
    Shamile
    Dear Ferraristi,

    I now have an 80 308 I want to upgrade to a Testarossa as I love the outrageous body style. But I was wondering, does the $ 10,000 engine out service also apply to the 348-355 series.

    Since the engine faces forward in the 348-355 like the TR, does the engine have to come out for the cam belt service?

    Can anyone give me some advice on maintainance in general for a TR compared to the 348 or other " living with " tips.

    As always, your help is appreciated.
     
  2. colo348

    colo348 Karting

    Nov 1, 2003
    141
    Colorado
    Full Name:
    Jim
    Merry Christmas!
    Here's a few thoughts on the 348, since I have one. I just had the 30K done and the engine came out for the timing belt change. The cost was around $3,500. The clutch in the 348 was dual plate, which is replaced with a single plate,since most fail. Mine was repplaced for around $3000. The interior vents (the ones that direct air and heat) get gummy if you put certain cleaners on them? I replaced the vents in my car for $900. Check out the AC/Heat climate control unit installed in the console these units are prone to strange behavior. I had to replace mine (ebay $400 replacement). Check out the AC unit and make sure it works. I replaced my compressor (used $450) and filter (new $270). I had the local F dealer check out my work and load it with Freon ($70/lb) cost $500. Prebuy inspection is a must at a local dealer cost $600 to 700. However, I should add my car has been very reliable and is great to drive. You'll notice a marked difference over a 308.

    On the TR I have a thread on the current Tech page "Prebuy TR questions...". Check out the replies in this thread there are some good comments.

    I'm in the process of looking at buying a TR '90, so my car is for sale ( see the chat want adds for 1990 348ts), if you want to get an idea on prices.

    Good luck,
    Jim
     
  3. BeachBum

    BeachBum Formula 3

    colo348, im curious, did replacing the a/c controll panel fix the climate controll gremlins?

    Shamile, IMHO 348's are very under rated, most ferrari for the money you can buy, call me wierd but i love the cheese graters, you can get an older 355B for not to much more than a 348ts but the top doesnt come off, once you take the top youll never put it on again
     
  4. parkerfe

    parkerfe F1 World Champ

    Sep 4, 2001
    12,887
    Cumming, Georgia
    Full Name:
    Franklin E. Parker
    Having owned both a TR and a 348 Spider, I say go with the TR. The TR is much more car and has a wonderful 12 cylinder engine. I did not note that the TR cost anymore to service either. I had a major service done on the TR for around $5500.00 . $10k for a major is way too much money. Shop around and negotiate, you can get a better deal. The dealer perfomed major on my Boxer earlier this year was only a little over $6k. I negotiated with them and they agreed to do it for a flat $3k for labor plus parts. It would have been less on parts but I needed some extras as the car had sit for almost a decade prior to my purchase.
     
  5. WILLIAM H

    WILLIAM H Three Time F1 World Champ

    Nov 1, 2003
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    HUBBSTER
    On the TR you should be able to do the engine for $6-8k, $10k is over the top. Besides its a whole lot better looking than the 348 & 355
     
  6. Dave

    Dave F1 Rookie

    Apr 15, 2001
    2,722
    Little Rock
    Full Name:
    David Jones
    When it comes to Ferraris, I don't consider going from a 308 to a Testarossa an upgrade, but rather a side-grade.
    The 308 and the TR are way different types of cars.
    The 308 and the 348 are much better in town cars, and negotiate slower moving much better than the TR.
    The TR is a much better GT car, and excels in freeway or longer trips.
    Its just about picking the right tool for the job at hand.
     
  7. parkerfe

    parkerfe F1 World Champ

    Sep 4, 2001
    12,887
    Cumming, Georgia
    Full Name:
    Franklin E. Parker
    The TR is a substantial UPGRADE from a 308/328 series car . There is more of an upgrade between a 308/328 and a TR than between a Vega and a Corvette. And I have owned all 4 !
     
  8. Shamile

    Shamile F1 Veteran

    Dec 31, 2002
    6,168
    Lakeland FL
    Full Name:
    Shamile
    #8 Shamile, Dec 25, 2003
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Dear Ferraristi,

    Thanks for the great advice.

    When I say " upgrade " , I mean an upgrade in monetary and year terms. I don't want to go to a 328 ( love the front grill ) because it is too simular to my 308. I really wanted to know if the service cost horror stories that apply to the TR is the same for the 348 - 355. I guess from your responces that 10,000 is too much but the average cost does apply to the 348 - 355 as well.

    I want to go to something that I will keep for a few years and not worry about putting mileage on the car ( resale value issues, not reliability) . I almost had a heart attack when the 308 hit 50K. I could almost feel the price of the car drop. :) I only mention this as I always had in the back of my mind that I wouldn't keep the car. Dont' get me wrong, the 308 is the most exciting car I've ever had, even though my Porsches were faster. It's just that I love that over-the-top TR styling. I want to just make sure I'm not being seduced by the great looks.
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  9. goyal99

    goyal99 Karting

    Mar 5, 2002
    185
    Upstate NY - USA
    Full Name:
    V K
    Nice looking car bud!

    It seems like you've made up your mind about getting a TR...I can only hope that you've driven a TR already and not making your purchasing choice based on looks alone.

    I personally don't like the looks or feel on the TR. It's a heavy, bulging car especially in traffic. I find the styling outdated and so it seems a lot of other buyers, as their prices are falling as we speak. This of course can be a good thing if you're a TR buyer-to-be. And although it has a V12 it doesn't "feel" powefull or as quick as a 348.

    My advise to you is to test drive both cars, if you can, and make your decision based on how you like the feel of the car, not just the looks. I did just that before my purchase. You might be pleasantly surprised after test driving a 348....and then again maybe not.

    Enjoy the Holidays

    VK
     
  10. Shamile

    Shamile F1 Veteran

    Dec 31, 2002
    6,168
    Lakeland FL
    Full Name:
    Shamile
    Dear Ferraristi,

    Dear Goyall,

    Actually I haven't made up my mind yet. I do agree on what you're saying. It just seems the maintenance cost above the 308-328 series is at a different level. Thats fine, I just like to have information.

    FREEZE... MIAMI VICE ! What do you mean dated? :)

    Since you have a 348, what's it like to live with? I hear they have crazy electrical problems. Specific to all or just one year?...or just bad hype.

    Inquiring minds want to know.
     
  11. GaryReed

    GaryReed F1 Rookie

    Feb 9, 2002
    3,053
    Seattle
    Full Name:
    Gary
    Have you considered a "Boxer", instead of a TR or a 348?? I just bought one last month and I just love it. Previously I have owned a '81 308GTSi and a '83 308GTS QV.

    The Boxer totally rocks compared to my others... Tons of torque, better handling, quicker,higher top end, classic styling....

    I'm hooked!
     
  12. WILLIAM H

    WILLIAM H Three Time F1 World Champ

    Nov 1, 2003
    34,891
    Victory Circle
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    HUBBSTER
    the 308/328 will definately outhandle even a 512TR but in power its no competition. The 308/328/348/355 just vanishes in your mirros in a straight line :)
    I'm always learning how to drive my 512TR better on the track & now I can toss it around, no mean feat in a 3700# car w 460hp :) Still the 308 is much more fun in the twisties
     
  13. atheyg

    atheyg Guest

    TRs are totally different than the 3xx series cars, the 3xx series cars are lightweight nimble sports cars the 1st gen TRs are GT cruisers and are very heavy and feel it, you can't compare the 512 TR to the original TR, the 512 is lighter and much more HP and has a tube frame vs the TRs which have a sub frame that flex's.

    It depends on your driving style and what you prefer, I personally like fast nimble cars my 328 has a few mods that put out close to 300hp and is a blast, if I really want to go fast I'll take my 2600 lb 77 930 with 370hp out


    Frank,
    With your mentality why are you driving a Fiat Boxer? Don't you know they stopped making real Ferrari's in the late 60s before the Fiat takeover?
     
  14. goyal99

    goyal99 Karting

    Mar 5, 2002
    185
    Upstate NY - USA
    Full Name:
    V K
    Okay, getting back to your questions on the 348 gremlins :-

    There have been some early 348 cars with electical issues (89-92) but those issues are easy to solve by cleaning the electrical connectors and grounds...Yes, Ferraris are known for having bad electrical connectors. Other issues include slow window motors, center console controls not working properly (flimzy plastic controls, sticky timer, and cheap interior pieces). Also "slow-down lights" on the dash come up form time to time for no good reason. Those problems can be traced to bad exhaust ECUs and bad O2 sensors...Also add problems with batteries, alternators and starters (mostly from having the car sit idle for a long time)...

    Again it's important to emphasize that most of the above problems are NOT expensive to correct and can be diagnosed fairly easy. Mecahanically the 348 engine and trany are as bulletproof as any Ferrari drivetrain. The engine loves to rev and it's very streetable in traffic and around town. The shifter is a bit notchy going into 2nd gear until warmed up....The one thing I wish the car had would be power steering.

    You can do a SEARCH in the forum archieves on specific 348 issues..Most problems have been adressed in here before plus there are plenty of experenced folks to help you, if you need them...

    As far as me calling the TR design "dated" (no flaming please) it's a matter of personal preference....Obviously you like their styling, I don't. I also find the design of the Lambo Countach 5000 dated as compared to the later Diablo design...Something that looked great 15-20 years ago, looks a bit old and tired today...My personal opinion of course...

    Do you homework before you buy...Best of luck in your selection.

    VK
     
  15. MS250

    MS250 Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Dec 10, 2003
    23,071
    Full Name:
    Avvocato
    WOW !!! First off lets start with every Ferrari is excellent regardless of model. I have two and they couldn't be further apart. I consider them like my children, love them both for their different characteristics. The horror stories of skipping the 348, and buying a 328 or 355 I think is very hurtful, as I think and 85, or 86 with the single mirror is the older testa.

    The 348 is a super car.The Testa(any yr) is a super car. You need to drive both examples and drive them. You will find that both are comparable in the service side as well. Belts need to be done every 6/7 yrs on both and the engine comes out of both anyway.

    My 86 testa is great in city and going in traffic, the clutch is fine and so is the streeing. The only drawback is when backing up. But then again, a ferrari was made to go forward. You will love the sound of the 12cyl over the 348 and the build quailty is also better.

    The 348 is easier to drive and park, and much more comfortable in the twisties....and of course looks more modern on the inside.

    Good luck with what you get...but they both will cost you more than the 308.
    Cheers
    R
     
  16. Prugna 328

    Prugna 328 Formula 3

    Sep 10, 2003
    1,233
    L.I.N.Y.
    Full Name:
    Gregory
    Check the old Ferrari Chat, there is a huge thread on 348 V. TR (Which I started) It got tons of replies.
     
  17. miked

    miked Formula Junior

    Feb 7, 2001
    618
    Cincinnati, Ohio
    Full Name:
    Mike Dawson
    Shamile, I can see in your picture that the grass is a bit tall and the plants are overgrown. Been out driving your car instead of doing yardwork have ya? EXCELLANT!
     
  18. ExoticRobert

    ExoticRobert Formula Junior

    Nov 5, 2003
    355
    Mukilteo, Washington
    Full Name:
    Robert
    "My 86 testa is great in city and going in traffic, the clutch is fine and so is the streeing. The only drawback is when backing up. But then again, a ferrari was made to go forward. You will love the sound of the 12cyl over the 348 and the build quailty is also better" :)

    Big Red hit the nail on the head!!!
    I have been driving my 88TR for over a year now, once you get use to it it does not seem that big!! It is fine in traffic, and it goes like a bat out of HELL!!! Throw a Tubi on it, and you will be done!! 308 are great car's, but night and day when you have been in both!! And I heard on a eariler post that the look's are outdated, the reaction you will get with this car is unbeliveable, how can you look at that ass end, and not smile!! That is the first red head lady that I loved, that has a WIDE ASS!!!! Anyway Let us know what you get, but you will be happy with the redhead!!
    Robert
     
  19. Darolls

    Darolls F1 Veteran
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    Jul 2, 2003
    6,799
    Full Name:
    Sparky
     
  20. khayes

    khayes Formula Junior

    Nov 1, 2003
    591
    Austin, TX
    Full Name:
    Kelly Hayes
    I couldn't be happier with my 86 TR. I drove it tonight and I must say it is one heck of a ride. Wow! The 12 cylinder flat twelve engine with a Tubi on it is awsome and just what the doctor ordered after a week with the inlaws during Christmas. I did the engine out major service earlier this month and replaced everything made out out of rubber along with a few other goodies and spent about $7k. This is the second major service on the car in two years. It is very expensive to maintain so think twice about buying one. But, once you do everything right and get the car in good shape it is a blast to drive. I'm thinking about upgrading to a 355 next year. I think the TR is a great step up car but it's not the ultimate Ferrari. Flaws are the weight, outdated tires and wheels and expensive maintenance. Delights are the sweet engine, outrageous looks, and unbeleivable acceleration and noise. The car is very roomy and comfortable on long rides and the AC works great in Texas. I highly recommend the car and am very happy with mine.
    Kelly
     
  21. pig4bill

    pig4bill Karting

    Dec 24, 2003
    59
    The thing that struck me about the TR is how tiny the interior is. Maybe it was my imagination but it seems more cramped than a 348. If you're bigger than the 50th percentile male, a TR can be a tight fit. Maybe a cost/looks compromise would be the early 348 with the "side-saddle" engine.
     
  22. Cavallino Motors

    Cavallino Motors F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    May 31, 2001
    14,143
    Florida or Argentina
    Full Name:
    Martin W.
    There is not much one can add to all your comments.

    My opinion:

    348s are great cars. Very reliable and very much fun. Have a bad rep for electrical probelms which in 3 years and 21,000 Miles of ownership I have seen Zero. Most others I know have not had them either.
    The melting plastic is typical for 348s, 355s, 512TRs and 456s of the 90s. No need to trash the 348 for that alone.

    TRs are great power cars. The torque you get is unbelievable. Much different than a V8. Once you hit the accellerator it just wants to go and take off till you are airborne. Thus not an ideal car for short trips to the store, then you get used to that as well. Tough parking backwards into parking spaces. They also have some electrial problems with the fuse panels. There are easy fixes for that though and you will find them in the archives.

    I have to agree though it is not an upgrade but a side grade. It is like comparing a fighterjet with the space shuttle. Both are very fast but truly can not be compared to each other.

    As far as the TR being outdated...to me the design is classic. It will never be outdated. People young and old recognize the car for what it is. You see it, you fear it. That is like saying the 250GTO is outdated.
     
  23. ExoticRobert

    ExoticRobert Formula Junior

    Nov 5, 2003
    355
    Mukilteo, Washington
    Full Name:
    Robert
    "As far as the TR being outdated...to me the design is classic. It will never be outdated. People young and old recognize the car for what it is. You see it, you fear it. That is like saying the 250GTO is outdated." :)

    Well put Martin,
    I have been in quite a few Ferrari's before buying my TR, It is hard to compair the TR with other V8's...the power band seem's endless, and it just want's to do 160+!! All Ferrari's are not cheap to maintain, you just deal with it and enjoy the ride!! Okay I'm done now....:)
    Robert..
     
  24. sunburn

    sunburn Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 2, 2003
    693
    Dawsonville, GA
    Full Name:
    Rick R.
    I've had my '94 348 Spider for about a year now with abosolutely no problems, electrical or otherwise. I did the 52k major right after I bought it (46,000 miles) and now have a little over 48K on her. The service ran about $6k but I replaced everything on the front of the engine (belts, tentioners, cam belt covers, water pump) plus wires and 2 injectors that had a bad spray pattern. Besides the normal "can't use 2nd gear until warm" the car has been flawless.
    My brother has an 86 Testarossa and the other responses offered hit it on the head. If you're going to do some real road trips the TR is the answer, but if some real twisties and some city driving is in you future the '93/'94 348s are a real kick in the pants . . . and reliable!
    I just bought a 456 GT and I really to hate to let the 348 go because it's such great fun to drive.

    Good Luck in your search
     
  25. parkerfe

    parkerfe F1 World Champ

    Sep 4, 2001
    12,887
    Cumming, Georgia
    Full Name:
    Franklin E. Parker
    As I recall, when it was being produced the TR was Ferrari's flagship production car. A v8 car has never been Ferrari's flagship production car as the F40 was a limited production model. Regardless, having owned a 328GTS, 348 Spider and TR, I say go for the TR. There's no comparison in the ownership and driving experience between the v8s and the 12s !
     

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