Upsides and Downsides to rge 456

Let’s try and start a thread to see what the plus and minus are to owning the 456, they are floundering around on eBay and DuPont and I was curious to see what other chat members thought are with regards to this great car.

What the upsides? 12 Cyl, 200K plus car for under $100K, F Badge and bragging rights...

What are the downsides? Repair cost, 4 seats, most US cars have automatic transmissions, bad press?

 

I think they are great value right now, GTAs excepted..

And the GTA probably gets a bad rap as most are still rolling with proper care, the few that have been abused have ruined the market, without question they are difficult/impossible to repair without great cost..

I say they are a sleeper value but will continue to depreciate...local dealer's words not mine!

I'd say the GTA being "American" is an overgeneralization, I'd have nothing BUT a 6 speed!

 

Post some EBay links we'll check them out!

I'm sure that's become a dumping ground for troublesome GTAs.........

 

*checking your profile*

Have you had any trouble with yours?

I understand timely fluid amd filter maintenance is all it takes to avoid trouble..

I'd love a 456GTM 6 speed, maybe that one in two tone grey! LOL!

 

Bad press? Take a look at the period reports.

For example, in Road & Track, Paul Frere called it a "masterpiece" and wrote "This is a car Enzo Ferrari would be proud of." And Paul would know.

 

I love my 456m GTA and I have found a great shop to keep it maintained at. I plan to keep properly serviced and buy a 612 or 599 within 24 months. Downsides are the obvious, the depreciation and the auto transmission repair cost. If you bought right and maintain your car I don't see why you can't enjoy it for years to come . Who knows years from now it may actually be a sought after cars. I think hey made 650 of them total. They are highly regarded in the UK (see previous thread on 456's) Enjoy your car.

 

It is my understanding that many of the parts for the automatic tranny in the 456 can be bought at a Cadillac store. GM used many of the same components.

The Bobert

 

The 456 is a beautiful car. It has a great body design for a 2+2.

However, I suspect it will age in a similar fashion to the 365 GTC/4. That is, I suspect the 456 and 465M cars will continue to slowly depreciate while the 550s and 575s will hold their values better.

There tends to be a pair of similar 12-cylinder cars being produced by Ferrari every 10 years or so (one a 2-seater sports car and one a 2+2).
Specifically, you have the following pairs:
- 365 GTC/4 and the 365 GTB/4 Daytona
- 465 and the 550 Maranello
- 612 Scaglietti and the 599 GTB

Each of the 2+2 cars typically shares a lot of common technology and components with its 2-seater cousin. Unfortunately, the 2+2 doesn't share the same retention in price, even though it typically cost more than its 2-seater cousin originally. Look at the price difference between the GTC/4 and a Daytona. Daytona coupes are around $345k now! With GTC/4 prices still typically under $100k.

So, the 2+2 cars, of each generation, represent a tremendous value for the buyer. And, if you happen to be able to occassionally use the small back seats, even better.

Here's a pic of the 365 GTC/4:
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Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

Being 550 owner myself, I think mechanically, we have very similar car, so I think I can say this.

I think the repair cost is generally low compared to any other Ferraries due to the engine being "serviceable" without taking the engine out of the car.

Isn't it a plus to have 4 seats if you are looking for a such a car? I honestly wouldn't mind having a 4seater sometimes. I love Maranello, but 456GT is definitely a very cool Gentleman's car indeed.

You get respect no matter where you go I think.

 

I am not very up on all the engine differences, but have come to learn that the 550 vs 456 while very similar are not the same: I always thought so but not.
the 550 later technology, having better HP and hydrolic lifts, while 456 has mechanical lifts.
456 vs 456M has the latter @ 6 mph more due to a firing order change.

 

I was just curious because I have just bought a 2001 456 Auto out of California it is TDF Blue with Tan leather and even though the car has BIG miles for a 456 (40,000) I had the car checked out by Specialty Mercedes in Riverside and they actually said the car was in great shape and only recommended motor mounts and rear pads. They felt that I should have no trouble for years. I have been looking for a 550 for a while, but this car was just so cheap that I figured that I would buy it now and tool around for a year or two and see how things go.

I am getting rid of a 911 Twin Turbo and what a great car, I will miss it sorley….

 

congrats, lets see some pics!

 

I am a recent owner and feel that it is the best F-car value out there (minus a 348), mine is a 01 w/ 6sp, it's practical, fast, discreet and comfortable. I can put my two little girls in the back which allows me to use it as a daily driver. It is a GT so I don't plan to blast around the track with it - I have the 348s for that - but I am quite amazed by the road holding capabilities of such a large/ heavy car.

Can't speak to maintenance yet, but most of the negative comments about the 456 has been around windows which could be an expensive problem if you let the dealer handle it. Mine showed a gap, I pulled the door panel off, did some minor adjustment and after 20 mins it was perfect. Considering the the F-dealer had just adjusted them at the tune of $600 (as per bill) it tells me that Ferrari never solved the problem and that the windows will need some regular adjustments as the seals age but I can live with that! Since that mechanicals are less stressed than the Maranello, I think we can expect good reliability.


Price wise it will probably continue to crater and with maintenance and parts being way high many are going to have a rough future because someone buying a "cheap" $50K 456 won't be able to pay for the proper maintenance, that's exactly why the 348s are so cheap - who wants to buy a $35K car and get stuck with a $12K bill for a major... I think the 456 will have the same fate as the 400 with manual tranny been a little bit more sought after but prices being extremely low for a $225K car - who cares I'll buy a spare when the price is right!

 

were the panels fairly straight fwd, or involve some magic...my windows were 'reparied' by Ferrari, but still a gap on drivers side.

want to adjust it, pass. side = great.

 

Easier than my other cars, here is the basic procedure that I used - going from memory so it might not be 100% correct

Remove the two screw that hold the top section of armrest - that gives you access to one of the bolts that holds the panel and the bar linkages for lock. Remove bolt

Pop door linkage off (no need to pop the lock linkage) - that allows you to lift the lever all the way up and give access to the philips screw that holds the lever mechanism and another bolt that holds the panel - remove screw first then bolt. You should now be able to remove the door pull handle.

Pull on the middle section of the panel which is an overlay held on by push plugs - that will give you access to the nuts that keep the upper section onthe panel in place - remove all the nuts

Remove the 3 screws that are on the underside of the panel (in carpet section).

Pull the rubber panel in the door jam (held on by 3 plugs) - it is part of the window lip seal

Pull panel up and towards the back - hold in place and unplug speaker and door level micro switch connectors

Gently remove the plastic cover - now you have access to the door mechanism. In my case it was just a case of moving the window back a tad (loosen the two bolts holding the wnidow) and in (removing a washer on the top guide).

Hope this helps.

I would also recommend the following if the door seal in the c-pillar has collapsed with time - I pulled it off the main door frame cut a 12" section of 3/8" (I think) rubber vacuum hose and worked it in for to back of the seal using tire shine gave the seal an additional "spring" and made everything nice and air tight.

 

THANKS. just got the parts manual with expanded drawings and taking time to familiarize myself, but like your explaination.

can't wait to try it out this weekend.

thanks

also

do you mean B or C, I am thinking B pillar

 

Rik:
Can you tell me where to get the parts manual for this vehicle?
Thanks!

 

Yes, my bad - B-pillar

 

I am on the verge of buying a 1995 456 with 27,500 miles. The car has had the following mechanical items done over its life, all of which the local Ferrari dealer stated "were all known issues" and did not bat an eye about them having been done to the car (actually indicated that it was a good thing that all of these were taken care of):

* Alternator rebuilt
* Steering rack rebuilt
* Rear shock replaced
* Multiple check engine lights - manifold gasket replaced (apparently it is common for these cars to have vacuum leaks from their manifold gaskets due to the gasket material used; the records show the dealer chasing this problem around a bit as there have been multiple lights over the years)
* Replaced catalytic converter + muffler
* Window seal issue
* Frozen clutch bearing (he indicated that the upgraded parts are from the 550, and that the 550 parts are a significant improvement over the original 456 parts in terms of robustness)

Not so common:
* Pin hole leak in the radiator (an independent tols me this is somewhat common, but the F dealer said it was not so in his experience).

Current PPI came back with a leak in the distributor. I did not ask if this was common.

Alberto

 

sorry for late reply:

Got it off ebay, this guy stocks a lot of Ferrair manuals etc.

Most are right up to date, but you should contact him.

He also sells periodic updates:

http://stores.ebay.com/miura-parts69_Ferrari-Parts-All-Cars_456-GT-456-GT-A_W0QQcolZ4QQdirZ1QQfsubZ9127938QQftidZ2QQtZkm


bit pricy, but considered it worth it...email him for samples

 

That sounds pretty normal-- mine has had many of those things. My alternator has never been a problem, nor the catalytic converters (I wonder if they replaced those unneccesarily while chasing the check engine light? I wouldn't be surprised), nor the clutch.

I did have to do the steering rack last time around. The dealer tried to convince me to replace it, which was ridiculous since they can be rebuilt by a place who specializes in rebuilding 456 and 550 racks-- so I guess it's a pretty common problem.

Has it had a major service? And were the windows just adjusted, or was the actual factory window fix applied?

Certainly one other consideration, as these cars get to be 10-12 years old, is the condition of rubber parts and hoses. I replaced many of my hoses last year, just as a preventative measure.

 

i have a 97 456gt and covered 105000km (about 66000miles)
rear chocks will leak (im on my 4th set...) window-gaps appear again and again (had mine redone at least 5-6 times, and strangely enough since ca 3 years they are perfect, touch wood) . the spoiler mechanism (on gt) and it's electronics can fail. i didnt have any stearing-rack problem, neither any valve
guides issue. other little issues i had: front-lights dont come up, radio stopped
working (it's so bad, it didn't really matter...), seat-electrics had a little issue,
fly-wheel broke (at 28000km) and i was told they had a fabrication issue and had to be changed anyway.
all these problems dont make my love for this car fade, nor the fact that with that mileage it's value is down on the floor... (even though it never run as good as now!!).
i drive it in all conditions and anywhere. sometimes several thousand kms in 2 or 3 days. and each km is such a joy!!

 

i have a 97 456gt and covered 105000km (about 66000miles)
rear chocks will leak (im on my 4th set...) window-gaps appear again and again (had mine redone at least 5-6 times, and strangely enough since ca 3 years they are perfect, touch wood) . the spoiler mechanism (on gt) and it's electronics can fail. i didnt have any stearing-rack problem, neither any valve
guides issue. other little issues i had: front-lights dont come up, radio stopped
working (it's so bad, it didn't really matter...), seat-electrics had a little issue,
fly-wheel broke (at 28000km) and i was told they had a fabrication issue and had to be changed anyway.
all these problems dont make my love for this car fade, nor the fact that with that mileage it's value is down on the floor... (even though it never run as good as now!!).
i drive it in all conditions and anywhere. sometimes several thousand kms in 2 or 3 days. and each km is such a joy!!

 

Thanks for that ethan, drive on!

the radio, LOL! did you put in a better one???

 

no, couldn't be bothered. repair took about 8 months....