USA vs Euro F40 Delivered HP

The European version started with the two vertical rows of rear window louvres.

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However for the production cars the rear window was redesigned with larger slots to provide greater rear visibility. Shorter drivers were a further consideration with this new design that included an extra two slots in the middle at the base of the rear window.

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yea....well you can just about make out whether the cop lights are on or off through that rear window....but not much else

 

here is a good article which gives a lot of data about the differences between the Euro and USA versions.
What are the differences between Euro-Spec and US-spec Ferrari F40? | FlatOut!

 

from the article:

"Engine timing is also different. Intake valves open 12º before TDC and close 52º after BDC on American cars. On Euro-spec cars everything happens 4º earlier. Exhaust valves have the same timing on both cars, opening 54º before BDC and closing 10º after TDC.

The reason for the different timing are the catalytic converters, mandatory on US cars. These changes on intake timing is a way to overcome their back pressure. Oddly, power output is higher on American spec cars. The manual data sheet says the V8 F120D equipped cars – like the American ones – have 356 kW/477 hp, while European cars (F120A engine) have 352kW/471 hp. On the other hand, US-specs have lower torque: 424 lb ft at 4.500 rpm vs. 426 lb ft. at 4.000 rpm.

American cars also have higher gear ratios to keep the pace up with its Italian sibling, but the extra weight doesn’t help. The 0-62 mph run takes 4.8 seconds on US cars, while Euro cars do the same in 4.1 seconds. Top speed is also a bit lower in America, with 194.5 mph and 201.3 mph on Italian F40s."

 

As mentioned before my understanding is there is no US spec engine/gearbox, its simply either non cat or cat, with the ones that went to the US being the latter version.

This is confirmed in all the online parts catalogue numbers

Euro 1 became mandatory in 1993 which could only be met with the use of catalytic convertors, so that spec will have been developed for both markets at the time, many manufacturers engines met Euro 1 a couple of years before though.

 

well read the article and you will see that they claim it is in fact a different engine....

 

#148450 Is a US only F40 engine. There are numbers for base F40 no cats, base F40 non US with cats and US only F40.

I personally know the retired Ferrari employee who was liaison for Ferrari who worked with a lab in Detroit that did the compliance tuning on the F40. It was a big part of the reason for the time lag between the release of F40 in Europe and the US. During compliance tuning which was done at a much later time than the original ( and set in stone) tuning of the base model, more power was developed. He was present during dyno runs that slightly exceeded 500 hp on the final version US tuned F40. I also know a former Ferrari engineer who personally witnessed F40 engine dyno runs exceeding 500 on the factory dynos during the QA process in the production department.

 

They are correct, John Amette (who's still around and is in fact the West Coast Classiche Certification Director based out of Ferrari Newport Beach) who was personally involved in the development of the USA F40 for Ferrari SpA in the late '80s confirmed this to me some 25 years ago, he also was kind enough to give me his factory recorded data of the differences between the USA F40 and the Eu/ROW cars, a summary of which I published on the 1st page of this thread.

Speaking of USA-only engines, I recall the USA spec F40 87200 required an engine replacement under factory warranty (perhaps Marcel can confirm this), the unit supplied by Ferrari SpA was the USA only engine.

 

USA only engine is clearly shown not only in the old original paper parts books but if you enter 148450 in the search box at Maranello Classic website it comes up clearly identified as same. There is simply no doubt here.

 

When you go to rebuild that "US only" engine (or gearbox) you will find it is made from all the same parts, using all the same part numbers as the ROW Cat spec engine and box!

Here you go, try and find a US specific engine part listed:-

https://www.eurospares.co.uk/Ferrari/F40/F40/PartDiagrams

The only US specific part is the ecu, which again is identical to the ROW cat version, just with a recalibrated chip, take that "US" chip out of the ECU and fit it into a ROW cat ecu and it will work just fine in a US F40

 

Reading this makes me appreciate my Euro non cat/non adjust car even more!

 

Same here. I had the opportunity to carefully compare euro and US versions during the recent F40 tribute event and there is no debate about which one is better in my eyes.
OK, I am biased but still...

 

And you have a particularly quick one!

 

I guess the sudden lack of response means we can assume that this is yet another myth busted then!

Pity those on here that have been perpetuating such a myth failed to do the most basic of checks over the last 30 odd years, right up until a few days ago when they sought to dispute what I understood to be the case.

With a few simple clicks on the internet I was able to show the evidence, despite being a rank amateur on the matters of F40s so they appeared to be suggesting.

 

Some people just show they are not worth wasting breath on.

 

Gracious as ever!

Well it seems that is it then, the F40 had just two engine specs, the early version prior to cats, which was then revised by changing the inlet cam duration to accommodate the needs of the additional emission equipment required by Euro 1.

Same with the gearboxes, just pre cat and post cat.

Along with the general extra federal car parts, the US cars just had tweaked software in the ROW cat spec ecu to combat the extra weight those cars were lugging around and the poorer fuels found across the US.

Case closed.

Happy to still be shown to be wrong...... with facts though, not conjecture, myth, bluff and bravado.

Luckily for them, US buyers now have the choice to own and drive whatever spec F40 suits their preferences.

 

Flat Out did their research well, and they are correct.

I just has a long chat with Ferrari SpA's own John Amette who was involved with F40 production and is still with Ferrari today as Classiche Director, he is one of the most knowledgeable technical authorities on the F40 extant. As he says, “Ferrari typically never changed the owners manual or the parts catalogs to reflect the differences or variances”. The clue for knowledgeable people is that the casting number on the engine block is clearly casting-marked to differentiate for a USA-only F40 engine. Others reading this know what I'm speaking of.

They are correct, for better or worse, it is.

Your understanding is incorrect, online parts catalogs not only often have errors & omissions, they also do not tell the full story, unlike some of the people sharing their longterm experience here, you have no hands-on F40 engine experience, and your assumptive conclusions are solely based on internet parts catalogs.

It's worth knowing that Type USA (Solo per USA) engines were ordered for replacement as a fully-assembled package including USA-only components from Ferrari SpA and the blocks were casting-marked, online parts catalogs doesn't reflect this variance, using the internet as your sole source, you wouldn't be aware of this.

If you needed a replacement USA F40 engine, the factory sold you a USA-only unit already built and set up with different cam-timing, different ignition, different fuel & boost reprogramming, and a different waste-gate. This is exactly what happened in the case of my client’s 87200. The factory did have a USA-only F40 engine with more differences than just the cam-timing, and it was supplied as a separate USA-only unit. To say the USA F40 engines are the same as Eu Cat version engines is simply borne out of internet ignorance, bearing in mind also that an engine type is the sum of it’s components.

I was involved with a USA F40 which had it's engine replaced and during that experience I learned that 148450 is a USA only engine, obviously your 30 year experience servicing and rebuilding these F40 engines is why you know all this, thank you for sharing your experience here.

FYI USA F40s have a gearbox with different ratios thus:
First gear - 1:10.707 (USA), 1:10.069 (Euro)
Second gear - 1:6.628 (USA), 1:6.262 (Euro)
Third gear - 1:4.745 (USA), 1:4.463 (Euro)
Fourth gear - 1:3.724 (USA), 1:3.501 (Euro)
Fifth gear - 1:2.965 (USA), 1:2.787 (Euro)

As regards the engines, simple question which isn't rhetorical: how many USA F40 engines & gearboxes have you personally rebuilt?

No myth busted, don't delude yourself that the lack of response is any kind of concession to your erroneous internet-based conclusions, the only reason you've not been responded to earlier is because most of us in discussion in this thread with you are busy engaged with activities that involve real F40s, so responding to you simply isn’t a priority till there’s time. Meanwhile, you've confirmed for us that your F40 experience is based on clicks on the internet perusing online parts catalogs and we know you have no real hands-on experience with the cars, so the erroneous conclusions are understandable.

You have been shown to be wrong, and, you can close your own narrow-minded case all you like, for everyone else, especially those involved with real F40s, the facts remain the same, perhaps you can be forgiven for your penchant for making things up as you go along.

You are right about one thing though, even if you've drawn the obvious conclusion by internet observation alone, US buyers can indeed buy Eu F40s, and we're only too happy to be actively engaged in helping them do so.

 

So when a US spec F40 engine or gearbox needs components replaced then what are the unique part numbers for those items which are different to those for the ROW spec cat versions?

Simple question, simple answer, go on prove me wrong.........

 

You're ignoring the question you've been asked: how many USA F40 engines & gearboxes have you personally rebuilt?

Here's a more relevant question for you: what are the casting stamp differences between a USA F40 engine and a Eu F40 engine?

You're also ignoring the fact that it's been pointed out to all that the shortcomings of your online parts catalog sources and their completeness as regards part numbers and variant identification mean your premise is flawed, so you're barking up the wrong tree. Just because dear Paul refutes something actual Ferrari SpA development engineers assert doesn't mean anyone has to prove anything to you. Anyone who from the comfort of their armchair who would openly refute Ferrari SpA's John Amette who is largely responsible for the USA F40 only shows their ignorance borne of a misguided agenda. The full context of your agenda is, you failed to build a replica F40 based on nothing F40 at all, and somehow in your mind this makes you an authority of relevance on F40s? That was a rhetorical question.

Rifledriver said of you, Some people just show they are not worth wasting breath on, a fair assessment IMO, however, it's the holidays now and I have lots of breath to waste on you as the community needs to now that your input here is largely erroneous & irrelevant.

The next time your imaginary F40 needs an engine rebuild or replacement, depending on wether it's a USA or Eu F40, it'd be good to know what the differences are.

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They are not the same although this does not mean the USA engine is better, one could argue that the Eu engine is the purer more potent version, that said, which one is this, USA F40 engine or Eu F40 engine? Inquiring minds want to know but alas our resident expert Paul cannot tell us.

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So you cannot even provide one single unique part number for the so called F40 spec engine components.

By trying time and again with your obsession to seek to disparage my reputation on here for some reason, and constantly attempting to divert the facts at hand with more bluff and bravado you are simply cementing the widely held views of your own.

I am sure many people are having great amusement at the moment reading all this at your expense.

Everyone can see it bar you!

 

In conclusion, you are saying that Ferrari SpA development engineers, Ferrari Chief Techs who rebuild engines, and well-researched entities are all wrong just because you can't find different part numbers?

And you're saying that all online parts catalogs are complete & correct?

And you're saying that USA engine do not have different casting stamps?

 

I cannot find something that does not exist, and neither can you hence your usual smoke and mirror tactics to ever avoid admitting you are wrong.

Post up the unique part numbers and I will happily admit I was in error, will you?

 

Paul answer the simple questions that are relevant to your claim:

Are you saying that Ferrari SpA development engineers, Ferrari Chief Techs who rebuild engines, and well-researched entities are all wrong just because you can't find different part numbers?

And you're saying that all online parts catalogs are complete & correct?

And you're saying that USA engine do not have different casting stamps?

If your claim has any basis of reality, you'll answer these questions, if not we know you're full of it.

It's explained very clearly above that it's not a matter of unique part numbers, and John Amette and I have explained why, it's a matter of the fact that there is a USA only engine, that's the fact, part numbers may not readily reflect this in the online catalogs that are your sole source of information. if you missed all that re-read the last page. Bear in mind I have much more in my archives than I will post here for numerous reasons.

 

Only for America.

USA F40 engine, Ferrari North America Order number D1075250, Part Number 0148 - 45000 - 0000 (148450).

A factory F40 engine with correct USA-only part number, USA casting numbers, assembled to USA-only specification using a set of USA-only ancillary components.

The block has stamp clues.

Paul will scurry along from teaching his cats to catch mice and log onto the internet in a futile attempt to sway opinion away from facts set forth by Ferrari themselves.

Some people simply cannot save themselves.

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