V-12 Engine into 308 Build, over on Grassroots

Those do look nice. The really cheap set I have use pins and just the other day I was about to roll under the car and realized the pin was only 1/2 in. With the racket ones I've had the car sitting with the lock handle 1/2 way up. The blue ones don't look nearly as well made as the esco, but do have both a ratchet and a pin so double locking which seems good....if I actually use it.

 

For me its very much the project I know there are a handle full of turbo 308s in the 600-800hp range and probably a few dozen in the 400-600 range and the engine I pulled out to begin the V12 effort was supercharged to around 500. I think the high hp frame issue thoughts mostly come from front engine rear drive where the torque WILL twist the car, I've built a couple of those in the past. Mid engine will handle a hold lot more without frame issues because there is no torque passing though the frame like the front engine cars but handling and traction as still issues for sure....hopefully issues with solutions.

 

My two cents on jack stands is that I use 4 ton rated jack stands. I like them because of their wider, more stable base and because they go up higher.

 

Years ago I gave away a boat about 6 times and yet it remained in my yard so I listed it for sale and it was gone in a couple hours. Can't give away dyno rollers? sell them!

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This evening I should have been working on the intake but messed with the rear wheel sensor instead....ECU still won't read it. I'm pretty sure its because it doesn't actually go to 0V. I am NOT in any way an electronic guy so in my mind all I need to do it put a 5V zener diode in series with the 1-7V signal and the ecu will see a 0/5V signal and be happy....I think I'm going to try it.

 

I had not thought of that.....

 

Today I re-pinned the ECU to get the speedo sensor on the input that I think will read it once the bits I ordered arrive, just so its ready

Next one bolt didn't feel right last manifold install. the bolts I meant to use are 20mm but for whatever reason I have a bag of 18mm long bolts and as I dropped and otherwise lost the 20mm long bolt a few got replaced and the one the felt wrong was 18mm lg....so all the 18mm lg bolt went in the trash and the sketchy hole got a helicoil. I couldn't drill or tap straight to save my life so I made a drill/tap block like always.
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When I opened the injectors they looked new, clean everywhere, new o-rings and on top an o-ring spacer replacing the double o-rings I had been using. I feel like another shout-out to mitch at T1 Race Development (where the service request or injector dynamic went), he did a great job.
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When I was pulling it apart I popped the plug off injector #7 but could remember needing to release the latch....yup, it was broken. Lucking for a reason I do not real have a handful of spare connectors so i could replace itr without causing any delays
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then, because I'm me, I put all the injectors in flow order with the lowest in #1 and highest in #12. My thought is that now with a TB bank adjustment I can match the air flow to the injector flow....at least in my head. With that done, intake on
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Tomorrow early i need to make another trip to tirerack for the Supra's winter tires then the manifold sealer should be hard so I'll pressure test the fuel system and get the last few bits on then hopefully make some noise after lunch.

 

The fuel system leak test leaked fuel so that was sad. I removed the intake and it was clear several injectors were leaking at the fuel rail but it wasn't clear why. After stewing a bit I removed the new correct o-rings and fancy spacers and switched back to the double slightly smaller than correct o-rings I'd been used, polished up the o-ring bores a little and put it back together, no leaks. So tomorrow will be make noise day I guess.

 

Today was to be a couple firsts, it didn't work out...which is why after like 8 year of failures I've come to dead run days. The plan was to run it with the air box on which also means starting without ether. I figured I had 2-3 hours before I wanted to make noise anyway and it it now runs decent it would be nice to maybe drive and not worry about gravel in the the intake.

Step 1, the air box. When I fitted it last time I just removed the fuel return hose with a plan to relocate it at a future date....which was today. I found a fitting that would work but in the wrong color so "for now" I used it anyway, spray painted it the right color and setup the the hot air gun to speed up the drying.

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Step 2, filter boxes installed. I never really had a plan on how to secure them so "for now" they got glued and some duck tape to hold them while it dries
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Step 3 the air air ducts. The Passenger side went right on, pleasant surprise. The driver's side I decided I had been a bit too optimistic in my ability to tuck wiring out of the way so I my some additional clearance and closed the hole with duck tape "for now"
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Not bad!
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The tires are probably too close, I'll need to seal with that but it looks ok "for now".
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Time to make noise.....why isn't it starting? Ok, a little ether in the airbox and just a couple pops???....and why is the MAP reading 16kPa when it should be close to 100???....because its broken again. There was no voltage on the10V buss so I ordered a pack of 5 power supplies for $6 delivered tomorrow to use "for now".
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But something made me dig a bit more.....and there was no 5V on the 5V buss and I was seeing about 138Ohm to ground when it should be a couple kohms. I removed the old 10V power supply I was replacing and the output conditioning stuff that never worked right so I don't use...no change. The sensors are the only other things on the buss so I clipped the sensor 5V pins one by one, no change so I guess the corrosion in the board that killed the 5V to sensor 7 has spread. I made a new 5V buss with jumper wires "for now" and the board is working again other than the 10V power supply coming tomorrow.

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So tomorrow will be get the MAP working on the bench with new bits and then onto the car and it will likely be dark so next run attempt will tentatively be Tuesday. If the MAP goes quickly I may add the hood Monday night so it looks like a car that should drive.

 

That red quattrovalvole airbox is sooo cool!

 

Thanks. Looks more finished with the box on bout sadly less racy, at least ti me. I'm questioning the black air ducts, they just don't quite look right to me...maybe silver?...maybe black wrinkle?....something

 

Any brighter color than black will take your eye away from the airbox and engine, which are the stars here. I would be inclined to make the black more satin or matt to help them fade into the background, especially once the engine cover is installed.

 

That's probably right, it might just be the gloss level bothering me. When i pull them to fix the cleaned problems I'll try matt black and see how it looks.....no question in my mind black is what ferrari would have used so best to try and get happy with in i suppose

 

Definitely black. The factory fiberglass snorkel is gloss black but hidden by the air filter box.

Ferrari probably would have connected your airbox to the snorkels with an accordion-fold rubber connector fastened with those long strap clamps that you twist to tighten with a tuna can key.

 

Sounds right. The 308 engine moves quit a lot on its mounts so flexible couplings are a must....the tr mounts I'm using are pretty rigid so I'm hoping letting to float is ok and doesn't leak much dirty air in....hoping.

I'm working on the clearance now, then I'll try the matt...I know the old duct and wheel wells are gloss but something about it just doesn't look right to me.....hard to explain.

 

You could do them in crinkle black and stencil the Ferrari / UFI logos on them like the QVs had.

 

Oooo that sounds good.
VHT wrinkle Black, use a heat gun to get a tight wrinkle.

 

The power supply thing said it was coming late so I decided to just get on fixing the air ducts so they don't get broken...and as soon as I cut a chunk out of 1 the amazon guy came....but I was committed at that point. I reached in and marked the best I could then cut out a chunk. I picked up some 5 minute drywall mud and kind of coated and inch or so inside the cut-out, then made a pile on a plastic bag and puled the duct onto it and let it dry....no more hole
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It may say 5 minutes and it does set up, but inside was still soft an hour later when I started shaping it
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Then I dropped the suspension as low as it goes, about an inch below normal and worked the duct until a 1.5" spacer fit with room to spare so maybe 2" more travel or 3 total.
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Then glass it up.
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Side 2, the one that I already cut for the wires/filler neck got a second cut for the tire and both sided filled with mud. I did the first test fit and I still have some cutting to do and it was late so tomorrow job. Once I'm happy I'll power wash the mud out since that worked pretty well last time.

I did put the power supply on the bench and confirmed I could set it to the correct voltage but didn't wire it to the MAP...another tomorrow job once the glass is curing.

 

Wrinkle paint was one of my first thoughts...but I think it would take away from the wrinkle red, too much of a good thing. And that is the problem I'm having with the black in general, had I left the intake aluminum I think black ducts in any finish but wrinkle in particular would be a winner! With the red though....l'm thinking I'll try the matte black which usually looks more charcoal gray really and that might be ok because I have it....but I think silver would be the best. I think it will tie into the trim on the cover and blench in the engine bay with the silver engine and headers.....but I'll start with matte black.

 

Definitely matte, black or even the cast satin aluminum paint BMW is fond of.
The VHT stuff cured with the heat gun gives a nice tight wrinkle that looks matte. Used it a lot on old radio gear and the tube amp stuff I've built in the past.

 

FWIW, this is VHT black wrinkle with the heat gun to get it tight...and the inside of this airbox is "flat black" though it appears to have some sheen:

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I worked pretty hard all evening...on air duct still. The one is cleaned up and about ready to paint. The second really needed a lot of reshaping. Once I got the clearance I wanted the shape just looked wrong so I worked until it mostly looked right and re-glassed it. Tomorrow will be finish up and paint them then the MAP and I think the diode for the speedo sensor came so run is pushed to Thursday I guess. If it you know...runs, I'm thinking next week I should fit the wheel wells.

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The ducts are finished but what a frikin mess I've got

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Tomorrow everything finally goes back together.

 

This is probably buried somewhere in this thread, but what did you use to seal the liners to the block?

There's lots and lots on this and every factory seems to have their own 'thing' that works. Lotus used Hylomar 3400 for years, but before Hylomar they used Loctite 572, others use Loctite 620 at the base of the liners and some sort of anaerobic at the spigot.

 

The 400i and earlier V12s the3 liners light press in to the block and float unsealed at the deck. 308 and I THINK all the later engines float at the bottom and use an o-ring at the bottom and top just sit unsealed on the deck. I converted to the later design, which I'm starting to think was a mistake, but no seal at the top, -oring coated with three bond 1211 silicone at the bottom....and I suspect my thinner not designed for that deck is moving which is why I struggle with head gaskets. If it comes apart again I'll probably convert back to the old design.