V-12 Engine into 308 Build, over on Grassroots

I’ll just leave this here hahahahaha


Yes, I finished it, and yeah it goes really really well now


But I kid, stay the course.



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Next you're probably going to tell me it doesn't piss oil all over the floor either I assume?

 

Oh yeah it does..
I was mentioning it as an option not knowing if the new one has that.
It's the gearbox that has no signal output for such. I've toyed with the idea of a custom gate that houses small micro switches or reed switch. One more thing for the custom pile...

 

They won't let you di it with a math function or 2d table to calculate the gear from speed and rpm?

 

I'm not sure, I don't think so... There's math functions for various inputs but I'm not sure about that case.

 

you could do it in a simple table of rpm v speed and put gear in the cells. you do the math in accel and just plug it into the table.....then use gear for the table on your 4th axis for fuel. If that doesn't break the software nothign will

 

$500 ECU with all you need? What an awesome deal!

 

Yeah it is!

and I agreed to help with the user manual so for the 1st time the install/setup info will be actually written down somewhere so more people can joy the party without so much fear or the unknown.

 

A manual like that would have been a big help to me when I started.

 

The Link will calculate the gear based on RPM and speed, it works great, I've set it up on multiple cars and it indicates the gear as fast as you can change them.

 

Excellent to learn.. 'Only' requires adding a wheel speed sensor.

 

I've seen it done with a sensor mounted near bolts on a CV joint, or the back side of a hub and use the sensor to detect the end of a wheel bolt or stud. There looks like there is space to do it at the front of the car for a non driven wheel speed, and the rear for driven wheel speed.

 

I just got the ecu reading the factory QV speedo sensor. Its a hall sensor but at least mine is like 1-7V no 0-x, I put a 5V zener in the line going to the ecu and both the ecu and speedo seem happy now.

 

I think the 458 was the first ferrari to do gear based mapping.

Since the OEM shifter and transmission are being used, something like this could go on the shift shaft either attached to the shifter box or at the other end where the shaft enters the sump. Would probably be better closer to the shifter end as there's less heat and debris.

https://motionraceworks.com/products/operator-shift-position-sensor-kit-16-146?currency=USD&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=Google Shopping&stkn=6699decc859e&gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAiA6t-6BhA3EiwAltRFGPxhjoaMtCQdFPIbi3uCYOhmaKI8mhlUwdM8H5rcR_6NQrKy1-Z9lBoCWwwQAvD_BwE

Sorry, I'm almost as good at spending other people's money as my own!

 

You'd need 2 I think with the second for the rotation but yeah it would definitely work.

 

I haven't done digging into the 355/360, but they used two pots for the F1 system, so those models do know what gear it's in. If that was used for engine tuning..I don't know.

 

Yeah it was two - for back forth and one for rotation that were on the end of the actuator bolted to the gearbox. The ecu's didn't have those kind of controls - it was purely to indicate if the F1 system knew it's position and display the digital number on tach. It was somewhere around the 458 / 488 where individual maps per gear were created.

These are hilariously expensive online and the identical maserati part is 1/10th the cost! Oh yellow and black boxes....

Given I am using a F1 actuator to convert to manual, I could actually do this with my haltech! - though they call it a map correction per gear...
https://support.haltech.com/portal/en/kb/articles/gear-correction. Maybe I should buy the sensors to build in my loom. Wait, now I'm back to spending my own money... S#!T

 

Some slow progress.

The ECU specs are slowly coming together. It looks like its getting about 7x5in OEM type case with a 154pin connector with the goal to use every pin....but the case is the size it is so what fits fits. There will be more of everything than anyone could use up like 40 analog inputs that can be logged at 1000hz. On board accelerometer is being worked on now and they are looking for a good solution on GPS logging for track day use. I've been kind of helping the the guy with the alpha unit work through his tuning so his car is running a lot better now and I have a lot better understanding of the software and agreed to draft a user manual so its all written down. I also slapped together a bench test setup so I can confirm what anything I'm uncertain about does.

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The important part is its proceeding and I should have a unit by spring.

The oil has continues to leak....clean up the floor 2 or 3 time and finally just drained it. I got about 1qt out of the tank and maybe 2-3 from the sump. It had 14qts so 10 slung around the engine bay and leaked out on the floor. I THINK its the oil pump housing to timing cover that is leaking. I struggled a bit last time trying to get the timing cover assemble on and thought I saw the pump housing move when I tapped it together so I'm thinking that is exactly what I saw. New gaskets ordered but I need to pull the engine to change them.

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What brand is the new ecu? Sounds nice.

 

Its more then nice, its epic! All the for $499

https://epicefi.com/product/tinyefi/

or at least it will be once it launches. I'm waiting on a beta unit, production is probably closer to summer

 

It took a while but the wheel wells fit nice. I the driver's side I ran a ton of wires so I ended up cutting the top off the wheel well to clear them, seemed a lot easier than doing battle to make it fit. They still need paint but I guess I try and pull the engine tomorrow.

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completely unrelated and while I think everyone needs an epicECU, motec just rolled out a much lower cost lower feature M130 that runs a V8 and gives you 2, count them 2 optional outputs. its standard HW so can be upgraded to more features for more money later.
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I've been pretty lazy about working and updates but there is progress. The engine is on the bench at least
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I decided I didn't love the bare alum oil tank so its now satin black.
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and 2 header pipes were wrapped wrong so the wrap edge looked bad, I rewrapped them.
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The ECU guy is about 2weeks from placing the beta board order so I should have a sample in my hands in 6-8 weeks. It will have a 154 pin VAG connector and case so it should at least look like a real ecu if nothing else. The board guy is doing the setup and tuning on his car with the alpha board so I'm getting to see all the things that are a bit odd in the rus code and how to deal with them.....but if there is an embedded C/C++ capable programmer reading this who might want to trade some code for an ECU feel free to ping me as I would love to unweird it as much as possible and that kind of coding is just not my thing.

 

I have remained extremely lazy up until now but I figured I'd get the cams set and engine buttoned up tonight....then realized I pulled the timing cover with the engine at #1 exhaust not TDC, so I had to pull the cams and spin them 180 degrees. Then I couldn't get the the last timing chain sprocket on, a loop hiding somewhere in the chain, so cam back out so I could spin the engine safely, cams back in and sprockets on, ready for me time actually time the cams tomorrow. The goal is to have the engine at least sitting back in the car this weekend.

I'm told the ECU board design is final and we are now waiting for a few components with the first batch expected the end of march or early april. My BMW ITB throttle actuator uses more power then normal ECU outputs handle so board guy is making me an external driver that is supposed to be plug and play and will also be sending me the ECU harness connector so I can get busy wiring it in. I am responsible to write a user manual, I'm about 2/3 through documenting what I see in the software and confirming how it works which should make the switchover pretty straight forward.....should.

We're using a chinese version of a 154pin bosch case/connector so it will at least look like a real ECU. The final pinout has 35 analog inputs (7 are temperature capable), 18 fuel capable outputs and 12 spark capable outputs, , another 20 generic lowside outputs, 4 highside, a couple 1/2 bridges 8 hall sensor and 2 VR sensor inputs, 2 CAN channels, pretty fast USB, internal SD card logging, accelerometer, 8 thermocouple inputs....I got most everything on the wish list I think. Hopefully its everything I hope it will be.

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Forget this part of the lazy was helping my son motorcycle shop. 2 weekend wasted with local options then fell apart only after me driving, then a couple weeks ago we did an after work/school thunder run down to Orlando then turn around and straight back for a 48 hour day.....but he was pretty excited with the result. Now of course it's taking up room in my shop and time helping him sort a few things. But its done and car work can now continue.



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Yesterday I got the engine ready to go back in

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Today, I remembered I really needed to clean the oil out of the engine bay and the p-brake cable tube is in the way after I lowered the engine so the hood fits, , so not the car is a solid 3 oz lighter!
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As I was cleaning I got thinking about the rear suspension and noticing how much easier it is to work on without the engine so I'm thinking I want to sort out the rear roll center now. I was going to just offset the forks but I don't love that and I would need to remove or relocate a frame brace


My new plan is after dinner I'll pull the carriers and make plans to rework them to move the lower mount about an inch lower. That will put the roll center at about 3.6" (stock is 3.5") and my plan for the front puts that at 4.0" (stock is3.0) and that should be a pretty good starting point so it won't need much sway bar wise. I truly do not understand what the factory was doing with the original tuning but this should help.
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I think I said before I'm pretty happy with the new 800/500 springs, I wouldn't want them any stiffer I don't think but the car feels pretty good now. Responsive, good. Then moving the roll centers will get it cornering flatter.