Virginia goes after Out-of-State License Plates

Discussion in 'Mid-Atlantic Region - USA (PA, DE, MD, DC, VA)' started by toggie, Aug 3, 2016.

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  1. toggie

    toggie F1 World Champ
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    #1 toggie, Aug 3, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  2. toggie

    toggie F1 World Champ
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    Here's the news article that was in WTOP News on the topic.

    Fairfax Co. officials citing cars registered out of state - WTOP

    Fairfax Co. officials citing cars registered out of state.

    FAIRFAX, Va. (AP) — Officials in Fairfax County are cracking down on residents and business with cars registered out of state.

    The Washington Post (http://wapo.st/2an6KBp ) reports that officials have identified roughly 2,300 incorrectly registered vehicles and about $6,000 in unpaid vehicle property taxes since July 2015.

    County Supervisor Jeff C. McKay initiated the enforcement effort last summer. He says he was prompted by complaints from residents in his district about cars with Maryland tags.

    The enforcement effort is based on resident reports and traffic stops. Those cited with out-of-state registrations will be mailed a tax bill from the county Department of Tax Administration.

    Residents who think that they were cited incorrectly can appeal to the county and then to Circuit Court.
    .
     
  3. toggie

    toggie F1 World Champ
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    Not sure why the Facebook post referenced the Montana plates specifically.

    The WTOP and Washington Post articles say that Maryland and DC plates are the biggest number of illegal out-of-state plates for Virginia residents.
    .
     
  4. CornersWell

    CornersWell F1 Rookie

    Nov 24, 2004
    4,458
    F Virginia. Seriously.

    CW
     
  5. nicholasn

    nicholasn Formula 3

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    All of this over $6,000 for vehicle property taxes????
     
  6. hezgon

    hezgon Karting
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    From the Post "Since July 2015, Farfax officials have identified 2,300 incorrectly registered vehicles — 742 with Maryland plates — and recovered about $600,000 in unpaid vehicle property taxes."
     
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  8. blackbolt22

    blackbolt22 F1 Veteran
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    You have to pay the Man. Either now or later. He will find you.

    I'm not surprised by this news at all.
     
  9. dm_n_stuff

    dm_n_stuff Global Moderator
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    Dec 10, 2003
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    Montana is a well known haven for out of state fakers. Set up a corp in Montana, register your cars through the corp. All you need is a cooperative lawyer with an address for your corporate entity. Makes 'em easy to spot with that Montana plate.

    Pull your Montana plated ass over, ask for your driver's license, which, no doubt, will be VA based, and BOOM, hammered.

    D
     
  10. energy88

    energy88 F1 Rookie
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    Arlington County has also been trolling apartment parking lots for years looking for this very thing.
     
  11. blown daytona

    blown daytona Formula 3

    Feb 6, 2008
    1,529
    maryland
    I have seen a few exotics in the area with Fl tags and trailers with maine tags etc. With this age of info gathering we are in, it wont be long before you wont be able to fart with out someone knowing :(
     
  12. carz80am

    carz80am Karting

    Sep 23, 2015
    196
    Northern Virginia/DC
    That's not the only way either. You don't even have to be driving the car. They know were a lot of these hangout at...
     
  13. CornersWell

    CornersWell F1 Rookie

    Nov 24, 2004
    4,458
    Technically, as far as I know, it's perfectly legal to do this. The car is owned by a MT-based corporation. You're just driving it. Last time I checked, Americans are allowed to freely cross state lines, so a car from MT can be driven elsewhere as long as it is properly registered somewhere. Doesn't matter where the driver is from.

    VA's not special, and it doesn't impress me. They just want more tax dollars to misspend. Who would voluntarily subject themselves to higher taxation if they didn't have to?

    CW
     
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  15. CornersWell

    CornersWell F1 Rookie

    Nov 24, 2004
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    Car is properly registered. Just registered elsewhere. On what basis can VA claim they're entitled to property taxes for a vehicle properly registered in another state?

    CW
     
  16. Entropy

    Entropy Formula 3
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    Jul 10, 2008
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    It's also actually the law in many (and, an increasing number) that if the car is in the state and meets some criteria (eg., in CT and CA, it's in the state for 30 days), the car must be registered in the state.

    In the northeast, the number of plate readers (tolls, police cars, et al) is increasing and they sort of know if you're in the neighborhood. Our local town has taken to enforcing this aggressively to recover property taxes. Ask me how I know.

    The "Montana LLC" shelter has sort of been undone. If for example you split your time between Boston and Florida homes, and you have your car in MA for the summer, they can cite you and you then have to demonstrate/prove that you actually have a home, the car spends time in Florida, etc. Some states are enforcing more than others; in my recent experience, it's less the states and more the local tax domain (town, county). When we sell or trade a Ferrari, to get our car off the tax rolls our town requires 2-3 distinct documents to prove that we actually haven't just moved the registration to a different tax domain.
     
  17. energy88

    energy88 F1 Rookie
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    I think the test is whether one establishes permanent residency in Virginia. If one's principal residence is in another state, their drivers license is there, and they pay their income and property taxes there, then it looks like Virginia won't mess with them. People with multiple homes may want to weigh in on this. Otherwise, they are probably considered a visitor. There also seems to be all kinds of exceptions for military personnel. I think the issue here is people who move to Virginia and take longer than the cited 30 days to make the switch.
     
  18. CornersWell

    CornersWell F1 Rookie

    Nov 24, 2004
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    Which is ridiculous. I think that goes beyond the plenary powers of a state. I'd like to see it challenged. Just because a state has passed legislation doesn't mean it's legal to pass in the first place.

    CW
     
  19. CornersWell

    CornersWell F1 Rookie

    Nov 24, 2004
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    I am not a VA resident, but I own property there. I have been warned by a LEO that if I don't change my DL to VA after having spent 30 days in VA, I am in violation of VA law. Well, my DL is validly issued by another state because I live there. If I visit my home in VA for more than 30 days, I have to change my DL? Gimmeabreak. It's this kind of over-reaching that makes me think VA's legislators have lost their f'ing minds, and it's about nothing more than harassment and piling on. LOTS of my neighbors have homes elsewhere and are residents of other states. Yet, if they come back, every one of them has to change their DL according to VA law? Stupid AND ridiculous.

    CW
     
  20. David Lind

    David Lind Formula 3

    Nov 19, 2008
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    I smell a defense based upon this taxation violating the Interstate Commerce Clause. Think about it: if your (legitimate) business has multiple facilities in multiple states (such as a small chain of restaurants), then your travel to all of those locations for extended periods of time would be completely legitimate, and you can't be taxed in every state for taking a company vehicle to company locations. Hell, even if you don't own the restaurants and merely want to eat there you have that right. (For example, there are numerous people who have been to > 250 Hard Rock Cafe' facilities.) For the moment this is still the USA, no?
    Typical BS government lust for easy money ... in this case brought to you by the state that has outlawed radar detectors.
     
  21. randkin

    randkin Formula Junior

    Aug 2, 2015
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    CA is trying to do the same thing but not limited to license plates. CA residents are purchasing residences in other states to avoid the state income tax which is over 11%+ potentially. CA does have the law that says if you are domiciled in CA for 30 days you should change your DL to CA. I have several friends who reside two or more states and have 51% of their time outside of CA. They also try to have the other state's DL.

    Many of the exotic cars I see in So Cal have no license plate at all, not even a dealer plate. I can't believe they are all new purchases.
     
  22. David Lind

    David Lind Formula 3

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    Now all we have to do is define domicile!
     
  23. CornersWell

    CornersWell F1 Rookie

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    This is now, generally considered, illegal. One state of issuance only. Or, maybe to re-phrase it, DMVs will refuse to issue you a new license if they are aware that you have one issued from another state. Unless you surrender it. May depend on state, but in the post-9/11 world, I'm told that there are fewer and fewer that would allow you to have more than one.

    CW
     
  24. CornersWell

    CornersWell F1 Rookie

    Nov 24, 2004
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    Even the Black's Law Dictionary definition is subject to some interpretation. However, I don't know why it should be interpreted to favor the State. Generally, the moving party has the burden of proof. As this could potentially be prosecuted as a felony tax evasion case, it's a higher burden.

    But, hey, that just fits right into VA's (especially FFX's) silly legislature, gestapo LEOS and kangaroo court judges.

    CW
     
  25. randkin

    randkin Formula Junior

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    I am sorry you misunderstood me. These multiple state residents have given up their CA DL for the other state. They want their domicile state to be anything other than CA, as CA has pretty much the highest MVR fees and state income taxes. So technically while they are residing in CA over 30 days they are in violation of CA state DL laws.
     
  26. 308steve

    308steve Karting

    Sep 5, 2010
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    The police are also on the lookout for those with the never ending "temp tag" especially if it's from an out of state dealer.
     
  27. CornersWell

    CornersWell F1 Rookie

    Nov 24, 2004
    4,458
    Ah, got it. Sorry, my bad. Thanks for correcting. This is same as the example I gave in an earlier post. I live in one state, travel to a property in another, stay for some period but the state I'm then traveling in is telling me, by law, I have to get a DL in that state. Good luck with that!

    As an aside, I consulted with a VA traffic counsel on the matter who advised me that it was in fact NOT illegal to have multiple DLs, but good luck telling that to the DMV!

    CW
     

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