VW group could enter F1 now boss quits

I think a better option for VW and the sport as a whole would be if VW came in as a power unit supplier, rather then as a whole team... if they were to enter the sport as a team, with the budget one would expect them to have, they would drown out the smaller teams and make F1 less fun.

 

Or possibly so... Analysis: Why F2 could be Volkswagen's perfect way into F1 | FORMULA 1 news | Motorsport.com

 

If VW's entry means a greener more "relevant" formula I'd pass. Big automakers looking for Eco-cred is what got F1 into its current technical morass.

 

+1


Exactly.
What we need is more power and cheaper too.

 

I do not see where would be the benefit of entering a Volkswagen ("People´s Car") in a race series that is further away from the people than ever before...
Volkswagen tried to sell luxury cars (Phaeton) and failed, they do not really sell sports cars so to brand has nothing to win in F1.
If they would enter F1 then it would just make sense under Audi (promoting a duel with Mercedes like in the 30s) giving way to Porsche in Le Mans or Porsche when they have finished their LM program. Audi going to F1 would be a risk as they risk their reputation as technilogy leader they have built up in the last years at La Sarthe with the diesel and the four wheel drive (that has a connection to the road cars).
Entering Bugatti would be no marketing but rather prestige just as the entire brand...Who cares whether the Bugatti was in F1 or just in GP before the war, most of those buying these kind of cars do not know the difference anyway, they just know that Bugatti is a good sounding name.

 

As I'm told Prof. Porsche was fond of saying "shoemaker stick to your last".

If VW finds F1 to be a suitable platform it will just demonstrate how far F1 has strayed.

 

That same 'technology leader' just lost the WEC Championship to F1 reject Toyota didn't they?

 

So??? After how many years of winning? I would say that they have won more often than they didn´t, I guess every other marque could be happy about their statistics, be it in F1 or LM...

 

Not many have come anywhere near their spending during that time nor have many stayed in the series as long as they have either, so they should have dominated. The fact an F1 reject can come into the series and within three seasons take the championship away from them, despite their history, tech and levels of spending says it all.

If they are worried about losing in F1 affecting their reputation they shouldn't because they are already losing in WEC.

 

What about Renault then?

Do they sell any sports cars?

Carmakers enter F1 because of its worldwide exposure, not because it reflects their range.

 

Audi has said they are not entering F1. Audi is thought here in Germany to be the more natural conduit. Given the changes in Wolfsburg within the greater VW structure why on earth are people here not listening to the official statements. No member of the VW family is about to enter F1 as posted by Audi. So much for that.

 

They seem not to be happy either. As far as I know there was a statement just recently that when RB-Renault wins RB/Newey get all the publicity and if they loose it is Renault...So not really the publicity they want. As mentioned elsewhere they are not stepping into saving a French GP either to shine on their home ground.
As one can see that as soon as economy goes backwards the manufacturers are all leaving as apperently they get not enough in return to justify it in front of their shareholders who do not see any particular value in F1.
Same can be said for WEC to a certain point, series like the DTM (German Touring Car Championship) seems to attract more these days as people have a connection between the race cars and the cars they sell. Same in Rally sports where VW is active...

 

Do they? I thought they won the last race but I might be wrong...And 13 Le Mans victories in 15 years including one time stepping back because of Bentley does not sound to embarrasing to me...

 

I don't know what you are talking about.

You say that F1 doesn't make sense for VW because it doesn't sell sports cars.

But what about Renault, another carmaker that don't produce sports cars, but still allowed drivers to win 11 WDC, and associated to 12 WCC through teams it supplied with engines.

Not bad for an "ordinary" carmaker, I think!


Also, in motor racing fortune varies and no team, engine or driver is permanently at the top. Renault's position isn't bright, right now, but if Renault sticks around, it will go back to the winning circles (just like Ferrari). It's just a matter of persevering and not throwing the towell too early.
Unfortunately, large companies have to please their shareholders, and not all are convinced that spending on racing is wise (Toyota, Honda, BMW stopped F1 at time for that reason, so did Renault too).

 

What automaker wants to emulate Renault?

 

True - but Audi had little to no competition at the same level. Toyota, Peugot and Pescarolo - Bentley was basically Audi. and Porsche was in and out - but not really at LMP1 status... even then they did beat Audi at times ( not at LeMans )

Audi will not win right out of the box in F-1 - very unlikely, if MB, Toyota, Ford ( Jaguar) Honda, BMW etc.. did not I dont really see Audi doing it... so at best they place 3-5th in championship in first 2-3 years = which does not sell cars or make a compelling story. That is why I think Bugatti is the way to go. there is no down side if they fail or dont really win... if they do great - then you can "import" Bugatti F-1 technology into your other "lesser" mass produced car lines.

Porsche would have the most to lose - 1/4 of its buyers know and understand racing - while 1/8th of the Audi people know and understand its racing... bout on par with MB customers

 

I was answering to P.Singhof ‘s post #55.


“Volkswagen … … do not really sell sports cars so to [sic] brand has nothing to win in F1.”


I was merely commenting that F1 has also been chosen as platform by carmakers that don’t sell sports cars to sharpen their image and advertise their brand: Ford, Renault ?

 

Yes I know.
My question was a general one.
Given its history why would any automaker want to emulate Renault?

 

If they enter I hope one of their drivers decides to go with #53.

 

Red Bull won some races last season but they still lost the championship. Ferrari just won a race recently but will still lose the championship.

Audi have spent more than a decade in one series outspending everyone without a consistent battle with any manufacturer in particular and were just embarrassed by an F1 reject with a petrol engine, smaller budget and less experience building LMP1's and lost a championship that they thought was a given.

They are already getting a taste of losing in a series that they are supposed to be the big fish in. Losing in F1 until they catch up won't be quite the shock many seem to think it will be as a result.

 

Audi has 'no' Formula 1 plans

 

lol, that would be awesome and clever marketing.
Pete

 

Sorry, but I do not get your point...

Renault is in F1 for almost 40 years, they started as some sort of French National Team with many French drivers (Prost, Tombay, Arnoux, Jabouille...). As I think that French people are very proud I suppose that winning in such a French Team might help selling whatever have on offer within France, even if it would be lawnmower. Later they became engine supplier, again a work team and then engine supplier again.

So one could think that they are in F1 for some sort of tradition but even within the Renault Group there are not few questioning this effort. The question now is far more would Renault enter the F1 in the current state with bad publicity (Engines not loud enough, cars ugly, uninteresting races...) and decreasing visitors numbers (at least within Europe)?
Most likely not, so why should Volkswagen? Especially as the affair with Ecclestone at court did not really add to the understanding of people about the F1 over here in Germany.
And as (I think it was even you) mentioned above, VW does not even have any link to F1. Not that they do not have a 40 year tradition (like Renault) they even have to construct history from prewar appearences of subsidiary companies.
And even if Renault is in F1 why does that mean that VW should do the same? Just because someone different does something rather wasted you do not have the same...

All I said is that I do not think that entering F1 as Volkswagen would give them enough return to their effort with their current car lineup. Although I doubt that it gives enough to Renault this was never my question so I do not know why you repeatingly point on that?

So you obviously do not like Audi
Yes, Audi is very dedicated to WEC and yes, they lost against Toyota last year. As in F1 the regulations change from time to time and as there are different possibilities to choose from the Toyota Engine was far more than "just a petrol engine". But looking back into the last years they always came with something new and it looks like they are competitive again just one year later. If you think that loosing one year within all this time is already embarrassing then some in F1 should shoot their head for being much longer without success and having a huge budget...
But tell me: why should Audi leave the WEC for F1? I have seen more commercials in TV associating their Le Mans racers to the street cars than I have ever seen Mercedes/Renault commercials linking their cars to F1...

 

That might be because enough people already watch F1 while they need to remind they're in LeMans

I thnk sooner or later they'll enter with the Lambo name which doesn't bring too many expectations with it

 

If VW were to enter F1 as a constructor or an engine/PU manufacturer, I don't think it matters which one of its brands it uses (except Skoda and Seat). Obviously Audi, Porsche and Lambo have more of a sporting connotation, but they will still be known as VW owned companies. If they do enter it would make sense to wait until the next formula change. The current PU ad token system are very complicated and restrictive, and the other teams have a big head start. Wait for new regs and then start on a level plane with the others.

But, my gut says they won't enter F1. It's too irrelevant to production cars.