wanted-308/328 without engine

Apparently non running or poorly running 308's sell for more than running ones. There is one on Ebay with a water filled tranny that will probably sell for more than I have seen (claimed) good running 308's sell for. Someone recently showed up here wanting to sell a 308 motor, I think the high bid was $2000. So there you go, since the motor is worth $2k then the body is worth $28,000 alone. Just kidding.

Aaron

 

that's retarded........but seriously what do you think one would be worth.......BTY yours is really nice i think i have seen you out on 35 before

 

I own a 308 GTSI with a carburated GM 2.8 liter engine installed. Engine and cradle came out of an 85 Fiero. The Fiero cradle gives you a lot of options. I would be interested in knowing what you plan to do, as I'm looking at upgrading my engine, possibly to a Northstar. I don't have the skills to do it, but I found a really good Fiero guy who said he could do it for $7 or $8 grand. I've recently put in new Koni coil overs on the rear and replaced most of front suspension as well, and the car feels nice and tight. The 2.8 liter does a pretty good job - makes me wonder if it's been modfied in some way. Still, I'd like more HP with fuel injection. The bigger engine and an a/c system capable of keeping me cold in 100 degree weather are next on my agenda

 

has anyone on here done a 350 swap or anything like it?

 

That is like asking if any of us have sacrificed virgins. Haha. I know it has been done though. There was a GTO kit built on a 308 chassis a couple weeks ago on Ebay. It had a 350 in it. I don't know anything else about it though. I think it ended around $17,000,reserve not met. So there is more evidence that one without a motor is worth more than one with a motor. Haha.

Aaron

 

That's what I'm up to these days...or at least the parts collecting phase anyway. We'll see how it goes

 

well i dont want to dump a bunch of money into this so the v12 is out i can get a 350 with 500-600 hp for around 750 so i think that would be a cheep way out with still getting some extra hp

 

I agree 100%. You should probably consider buying a complete car though. Swapping 350's in doesn't add value, and you can always swap the original motor back in and not lose too much money. Maybe you can get lucky and find one that is cheap because it needs it's major service done.

BTW count on some issues with the transmission. The Ferrari engine and the Ferrari transmission share an oil pan.

What is the V12 camp's school of thought on getting over that hurdle?

Aaron

 

I do very much understand the $ part. If you want a cheap american engine in an italian sportscar, why not just go buy a pantera?



Adding a US engine to a ferrari may make the car exactly what you're after, but it also makes it worth less money than it was worth with no engine at all if you need to do any cutting during the installation....so I don't know how much you would really be saving.

If you want 500+ hp, you could also just bolt-on a turbo or supercharger a QV (maybe a 2v, but I think you'd need to open it and work on it a bit to hit the numbers) engine and hit your numbers.

 

The V12 can be made to fit the 308 trans without a HUGE amount of work. It's been done with the SOHC 330/365s....but they are really pricey these days. The DOHC 365/400/412 are (I think) the same block, but there is supposedly a problem with the heads fitting in the engine bay and under the hood. I don’t have all my parts yet to start measuring and test fitting to really understand the problems…..but it’s going to fit whether it wants to or not....and the same goes for the TR 4 valve heads on the 400/412 block

 

If I was going to do an engine swap using an American V8 it would be like this beast. Chevy Can Am engine 675 hp.
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Can you please provide the date of the Sports Car Illustrated issue dealing with the Norwood transplant and/or better yet, can you reproduce the article and photos for us? Thanx

 

I know Bob. He got me into tuning Motecs and stuff. I asked him about that today. He said that is a "kit" he sells that stretches the frame 4 inches and includes GTO style fenders that match the stock 308 doors. I didn't ask for a price.

For under 500hp he is a pretty firm believer in keeping the Ferrari motor and adding a turbo (and a Motec). I am sure you can build a decent Chevy 350 long block for $750, but I can also guarantee that it will cost quite a bit more by the time you actually get it installed and running.

Bob says the 308 trannies are good for 500hp and Mike says he made (about) 400 without opening up his motor. I've driven a 350hp 3000lb car and that is a nice street car so I think I am going with a smallish single turbo kit myself. I already have the manifold and turbo sitting here. I was considering setting the car up with fuel injection (I have a 78 with carbs) but I re-read the carburetor section in Corky Bell's turbo book (Maximum Boost?) and he seems to think the Webers will do pretty good until about 10 psi. That should get me to 350hp.

I am looking for a GTSi or a early Mondial to test fit the same basic kit on and see what needs to be done to make it run nicely with the stock fuel system.

Aaron

 

I can confirm the 308 trany is good to at least 500 hp, my car dyno'ed at 420 rwhp so right around 500 crank. It's a QV, all stock except the valve springs and rings - the rings were changed during rebuild to a non-stock brand, but stock would be fine.

I personally just don't care for turbo'd street cars, I don't mind 5 psi ish, but more than that and the soft low end power get very noticable. A blower solves that, but is harder to install.

I'm thinking the "no replacement for displacement" saying is true and a built 5 liter will beat my blower motor without any of the boost headaches (intercooler, intake temps, ect). We'll see soon enough.

BTW, a built QV engine should make about 350hp in street trim without boost.....I've got one I won't be needing (I just need to pop pistons in) if anyone is interested.

 

Sports Car Illustrated May 1988

Norwood specs.

Engine

Type: Ohv V8
Displacement: 371 c.i.d.
Horsepower: 675bhp@7800rpm
Torque:502 lbs. ft @ 5250 rpm
Compression ratio :13:1
Fuel System : Lucas timed fuel injection

Transmisson

Type: ZF 5 speed Manual
Gear Ratios: 1st: 2.42
2nd: 1.61
3rd: 1.14
4th: 0.846
5th: 0.704
Final Drive ratio: 4.11

Wheelbase: 96.6 in.
Length: 168.9 in.
Width: 75.2 in.
Height: 44.1 in.
Curb Weight: 2578 lbs.

Brakes: Ft. 12.0 in. vented rotors
R. 11.0 in. vented rotors
Wheels: Ft. 15x10
R. 15x14
Tires: Ft. 285/45/15
R. 345/35/15

Top speed 199mph

I can copy the article if you need it.

 

I have posted pictures of my '85 308 with the Chevy small block on this sight. The car is finished but I had to remove the rear calipers because I discovered a leak. As soon as I get it down off the jack stands, I'll get it out where I can get some good pictures and post them.

 

in 1985, Norwood built a 83/308 Ferrari, the first with programmable fuel injection that competed on the Bonneville Salt Flats setting the F-GT and F-Modified class speed records at 168 mph and 170 mph. Those records still stand.
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This looks like the same car converted to the Chevy Can Am power in 1988 picture I posted.

 

Good quote, wrong pictures. The 83/308 had basically a stock body.

I think they are two different cars. The Can-Am powered 288 was owned by John Sullivan, and the 1800 hp big block chevy powered 288 posted by 350HPmondial was owned by Bill Gordon. I could be wrong.

Aaron

 

I searched and found the pics. Great job. I'd like to see how the fenders look.

Aaron

 

My Bad.

 

Hi Aaron,

Hoping you are still active on the board.

Are you able to give me any contact (Bob or otherwise), leads, or further information on the kit you mention for stretching the chassis to achieve the correct 288 wheelbase, with body parts/fenders to suit?

If anyone else can please assist in this regard , it would very much appreciated.

Many Thanks

 

Www.bobnorwood.com

 

Www.berlinettamotorcars.com