WEEPING/LEAKING 40 DCZ 6 | FerrariChat

WEEPING/LEAKING 40 DCZ 6

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by Van de Merghel, Sep 29, 2007.

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  1. Van de Merghel

    Aug 18, 2006
    39
    Anaheim, CA
    My 330 has the standard 40DCZ 6s which have been rebuilt a year ago with new throttle shafts, throttle plates, jets, gaskets, floats were adjusted etc, etc, in short they were rebuilt from A-Z and have been functioning well all along. However, with the engine shut off, carb #2 is weeping/leaking fuel from the "left" throttle shaft only and is not leaking from the carb. top cover assembly or anywhere else. I have disconnected the fuel line and I can see it leak very slowly. It leaks with the carb. top cover assembly off. The fuel leaks through the left "exhaust valve # 18" and not the right one. Both of these "exhaust valves" are in the bottom of the bowl. It will leak until the fuel level in the bowl reaches a level below the side hole on the "exhaust valve" and by then the bowl is almost empty.

    Thank you for any assistance in solving this irritating problem!
     
  2. Motob

    Motob Formula 3
    Professional Ferrari Technician

    Nov 11, 2003
    2,389
    Frederick, Maryland
    Full Name:
    Brian Brown
    By the exhaust valve in the bottom of the float bowl, I assume that you mean the inlet check valve for the accelerator pump. If fuel is somehow leaking through this valve into the bore for the throttle shaft or the venturi, then you have a breach in the casting of the carburator body. Have you looked down the carb throat to see where the fuel is entering the venturi? If it fills up the venturi with the throttle plate closed, then it will tend to leak out around the throttle shaft.

    I would remove the carb and then try and find the breach by using compressed air. Remove the inlet valve and use a rubber tipped blow gun to apply a low air pressure to find the leak (be careful not to shoot the piston for the accelerator pump across the shop.

    Was the carb body bored for oversized throttle shafts?
     
  3. Miltonian

    Miltonian F1 Veteran

    Dec 11, 2002
    5,966
    Milton, Wash.
    Full Name:
    Jeff B.
    It seems to me that I read somewhere (Lancia Club Journal?) that the DCZ carburetors (Z for Zinc) eventually just crumble into dust from porosity, and there is nothing you do about it except re-cast. I'm not an expert.
     
  4. Van de Merghel

    Aug 18, 2006
    39
    Anaheim, CA
    Thank you for your speedy responses. Yes, the bodies were bored to accept oversize throttle shafts and your thoughts make sense. The crack most likely developed due to shaft wear because of the oversize bore leaving little "meat". If that's the case, then there isn't much that can be done to rectify the problem. One option would be to put a sleeve in; the other, get an other DCZ. And yes, zinc does have a usable life. Sorry for the nomenclature but I used the exploded diagram for the DCZ and the available nomenclature from Pierce Manifold's site. I will take the unit off and follow through with your recommendations. I will keep you posted on the results.
     
  5. AndruetBiche

    AndruetBiche Formula Junior

    Oct 7, 2006
    427
    Did Pierce do the rebuild? I was going to ship my DCL6s to them this winter for oversize throttle shafts.
     
  6. Van de Merghel

    Aug 18, 2006
    39
    Anaheim, CA
    The rebuild was done locally. I followed your recommendations, Brian and there was no apparent air leak. Maybe the fracture is so fine that no noticeable volume of air can escape but fuel can weep through that very same hairline fissures. I filled the bowl and fitted the top cover assembly (without the floats) and the carb. is going to sit overnight on the workbench. We'll see tomorrow. Thanks!
     
  7. Motob

    Motob Formula 3
    Professional Ferrari Technician

    Nov 11, 2003
    2,389
    Frederick, Maryland
    Full Name:
    Brian Brown
    If the crack is that small, you can seal it using a penetrating anaerobic sealant (Loctite 290). Or you can send the body out to have it cleaned and sealed.
    We have used this company with good success to seal similiar cracks/porosity in cylinder heads: http://www.westernsealant.com/what_is_casting_porosity.html

    You will have to completely disassemble the carb down to the bare body.
     
  8. Van de Merghel

    Aug 18, 2006
    39
    Anaheim, CA
    Thank you very much for your input, Brian. The leak was there this morning and I have been on a quest trying to find the recommended "Loctite 290". I figure, I may just as well give it a try, who knows? If it doesn't work, well there's always plan B (and C & D). I'll let you know how all this turns out.
     
  9. Ed_Long

    Ed_Long Formula Junior

    Nov 11, 2003
    686
    Salem, Oregon USA
    Full Name:
    Ed Long
    Yves:
    Are you sure it is not the needle valves and seats? I had a huge leak down the venturi of one my Webers on the Pf coupe. The gasoline in the needle valve had shellaced the bore of it and the needle valve would no longer stop gas coming in when the bowls were full with the electric pump turned on. I replaced all needle valves and seats with parts from Pearce Manifold and have had zero problems since then.

    Consider that if the carbs are leaking gas into the venturi, then it is trickling down into the cylinder. I had so much gas in there that it hydrauliced one piston and the starter motor stopped turning. So, I had to remove all the plugs, turn the engine over on the starter, received a bath of gasoline in my face, then drained the crankcase and put in fresh oil.

    Best of luck on this dilemma,
    Ed
     
  10. Van de Merghel

    Aug 18, 2006
    39
    Anaheim, CA
    Thank you for your input, Ed. The problem is simply that fuel in the bowl is seeping/weeping/leaking out the body even when the fuel line is diconnected and the carburetor is sitting on the workbench with the top cover assembly off and the floats removed. There is no fuel running down the throats at all which could possibly cause hydraulock. The carburetor body is in very good shape, no visible cracks/fissures, dings etc. All the working internals have been replaced and oversize shafts installed. So far, all indications seem to point that the problem is somewhere else - an internal or near surface fissure opening on a casting porosity near the accelerator pump assembly/well.

    Brian, I followed your recommendations and the carburetor is on the car. So far (4hrs), there is no weeping and if it holds, I will fire up the engine later on today - and see.
     
  11. Ed_Long

    Ed_Long Formula Junior

    Nov 11, 2003
    686
    Salem, Oregon USA
    Full Name:
    Ed Long
    Sounds like you found the crack. One of the carbs on the Boano had this problem and I smeared JB Weld on the crack and it never leaked again.
     
  12. Van de Merghel

    Aug 18, 2006
    39
    Anaheim, CA
    Thanks Ed, I didn't try JB Weld because I didn't think it would work so close to fuel, although I have used it successfully to hold a couple studs that were holding down the air filter assembly. I really didn't want to go the Heli-coil way, so JB Weld saved the day. It's held up for 4-5 years now.

    Brian, it didn't leak all day. I fired up the engine and exercised it a bit to get it very hot. Hopefully, that would work the zinc some and quite possibly make it weep again. So far, it is holding. I had three areas of concern. One was under the main jet where it joins the carburetor body, underneath the bowl, there was minute porosity. The second one was in the operating rod chanel - right into accelerator pump well; again more porosity. The third (hopefully last), in the throttle shaft passage there was a hairline fissure. I had to use a loupe to locate all those leaks. The Loctite 290 worked well and if it leaks again, I know what to do.

    Thank you very much for your assistance, Brian. Thank you ALL.
     

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