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430 Well, I Spoke Too Soon (CEL After Header Install)

Discussion in '360/430' started by BlacktopRacing, Feb 10, 2019.

  1. BlacktopRacing

    BlacktopRacing Formula Junior
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    Sep 18, 2016
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    Dale
    So in at least my DIY thread and in a reply to somebody else's thread, I mentioned not getting a CEL after installing my ceramic coated AP headers. That was based on three separate occasions when I've pulledthe car out of the garage, let it warm up to normal operating temps, revving it a few times, then pulling it back it the garage. All in all, each occasion lasted around 15-20 minutes. Never a CEL. I went to do the same today, and got a CEL. My theory is that at least one O2 sensor is failing due to the ceramic coating on the inside of the exhaust. I still have all the panels off, so I plan to check and make sure all the manifold nuts and sensors are still tight. I don't have a scan tool, but I'm open to recommendations. I was thinking of this one: https://www.oreillyauto.com/detail/b/bosch-3089/tools---equipment-16488/diagnostic-16546/code-readers-scanners-17943/5609f7011617/bosch-scan-tool/obd1300/2578941
     
  2. ok, so without an error code such as p0xxx , it is shooting in the dark. Why o2 sensor would fail because of heat insulation? the stock header insulation is even better than ceramic coating! It is just that the oem style insulation is way too expensive to produce in the afttermarket hence the ceramic, which is an half-ass solution, in my humble opinion.
     
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  3. Skidkid

    Skidkid F1 Veteran
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    Aug 25, 2005
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    John Zornes
    I am with 24000. It has nothing to do with the coating. It has everything to do with the sensitivity of the O2 sensors and is the problem that EVERYONE who replaces the stock headers faces. Why would yours magically not have that issue and it be attributable to something that shouldn't have any impact? When you hear hoof beats you don't think zebras.
     
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  4. mike32

    mike32 Formula 3

    May 13, 2016
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    Uk
    While it is warming up, dont rev it- this sends unburnt fuel up the pipe and deposits it on the cool sensor. Just let it tick over to get some heat in the sensor
     
  5. cpep

    cpep Formula Junior
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  6. parkem

    parkem Karting
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  7. BlacktopRacing

    BlacktopRacing Formula Junior
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    Dale
    That's a good point. I never rev a car while it's still warming up, but I might have done so a little early that time. I thought I dodged the bullet like others with AP headers have reported (not getting CEL). That's part of the reason I suspect it has to do with the coating. We just got 4" of snow, so it may be a while before I get another chance to pull it out to see if it goes away on it own.
     
  8. FerrariFab

    FerrariFab Karting
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    Retune the care and blank sensor signal so its never an issue.
     
  9. mwstewart

    mwstewart Formula 3
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    360Trev is offering a reflash tool to desensitise the rear cat o2 sensors.

    I have a custom tune on my car which included it - it is my preferred option.
     
  10. JoeTSI

    JoeTSI Formula Junior
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  11. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

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    Its not going away on its own.
     
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  12. hessank

    hessank Formula Junior
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    If you live in a State that requires emission testing then it is prudent to purchase a scan tool that has the "Monitor Ready" or Drive Cycle Complete " status built in. That way you know when not to go to the test facility

    My $0.02
     
  13. BlacktopRacing

    BlacktopRacing Formula Junior
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    I do (Pennsylvania), but my car is exempt die to putting less than 5k miles on it between inspections. I'll be exploring those bungs mentioned above. Yay, another $300+ between a scanner and hardware.
     
  14. BlacktopRacing

    BlacktopRacing Formula Junior
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    I ordered an Actron CP9680 scan tool and was wondering if it will go so far as to indicate which O2 sensor(s) might be causing the CEL, assuming that's what it is. Was also wondering if it's safe to assume it would be one, or both, of the O2 sensors that were mounted on the OEM manifolds, now on the back part of the headers??
     
  15. cpep

    cpep Formula Junior
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    The code will indicate left bank or right bank pre or post.
     
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  16. BlacktopRacing

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    So, I received my OBDII scanner today and the code it found was P0600, which reads as follows:
    Motronic ME 7.1.1 - RH
    P0600
    RH-B AND LH-B CAN LINE ERROR
    CAN line communication error between the RH ECU and the LH ECU
    Communication Error
    Wiring and system intactness check.
    I don't know what to make of this. I was extremely cautious with disconnecting the four sensors and reconnecting them. I even wrapped everything in cotton and plastic. Another thread elsewhere mentioned something about not getting a reading on the tach, but my tach works. As far as I know, there are no noticeable traits to consider, such as rough idle, hard starting, etc. Everything appears as normal, but then again, I haven't driven it off my driveway yet. I was able to clear it without it coming back (at least not yet).
     
  17. Testarossa Lover

    Testarossa Lover F1 Rookie
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    Dec 31, 2006
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    Mine had fabspeed headers, it left me with codes. I had the 02 sensor extenders installed, codes still remained. I went back to stock headers, problem solved. I installed fabspeed muffler and tips months later, check engine came back. revert back to stock and problem solved. The only modification I am able to do without codes is to keep everything stock except the tips which I have are Fabspeed.
     
  18. BlacktopRacing

    BlacktopRacing Formula Junior
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    "EVERYONE"? Others have reported not getting a CEL after installing headers. In my case, it turned out the CEL had nothing to do with emissions or exhaust, so my AP headers are still CEL-free :) Maybe I'll still get a header-related CEL down the road, but keeping my fingers crossed.

    The P0600 points to communication between the left and right bank ECUs, and I have a suspicion I know why. After a successful header install, I thought I'd take on something easy, like installing a custom drink holder assembly on the rear parcel shelf between the seats. The assembly was secured by two fine thread screws, which I'm guessing nicked a wire below the shelf. I'll have to take out the panels and check things over. I wish I never got thirsty while driving :(
     
  19. BlacktopRacing

    BlacktopRacing Formula Junior
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    Well, my above theory was disproven. Not only did the two screws I put through the rear parcel shelf clear all the wires underneath with ample room, everything is still like new. So the search for the cause of the coincidental P0600 code continues.
     

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