Well, it had to happen eventually

LouB747 · Dec 6, 2011

Got a CE light. 1-4. 94 348 Spider. Luckily it happened only a block or 2 from home. Funny thing, I'm not worried about it. I figure the brotherhood's got me covered. Just gotta start reading some older posts to figure out where to start. Car did go into limp mode. Sure wouldn't want to drive far like that.

I could just have it towed (AAA) and pay to have it fixed, but I think I might have some fun with this one. Would love to say I fixed it myself....

Any info and thoughts welcome!

Lou

yelcab · Dec 6, 2011

i think you start with the error code, and go from there.

AceMaster · Dec 6, 2011

Lou, do you know how to get the codes?

http://www.my348.com/

How To Check The 348 A/F ECU Diagnostic Codes (non-Euro 348's):

Thanks, ernie

Remove the cover(s) behind the seats so that you have access to the ECU's.

2) Place the key in the ignition and turn it to the (on) position, but do not start the car. You will see the two Check Engine Lights (CELs) on the instrument panel illuminated (if not, then you've got burned out or missing dash bulbs*** and can't proceed until new bulbs/LEDs are in place).

#2a) Make sure that the transmission is not in gear. Now start the engine, and let the car idle. Wait for all the dashboard warning lights to turn off, then follow the rest of the procedure for pulling the codes.

3) Push and hold down the button** (located next to each ECU) for 5 seconds, then release it. When you are holding down the button for those 5 seconds you now should see the dashboard check engine light illuminate for the ECU you are on (check engine light 1/4 or CEL 5/8 depending upon which ECU button you are depressing).

**Oh, you don't have a red button?! Not all 348 models have them. You'll need to order two parts: tester cable 146196 and button 145810 thanks, stevew

***Oh, you've got a Euro 348 that doesn't have CEL's?! You'll need to add two bulbs under your instrument gauge console (two phillips screws to remove). This will give you the U.S. model electronic engine diagnosis functionality.

4) When you let go of the button you will see a pause and then a long flash for 2 and 1/2 seconds, a pause with no flash for 2 and 1/2 seconds, then begin the flashes of the engine codes. The long flash indicates the beginning and end of the code. Then it repeats the same code, until you move on to the next code.

5) Each number of the code is flashed for 1/2 second followed by a pause and then the next number in the codes is flashed. For example you will get the long flash indicating that the code will start, a pause, three flashes, pause, two flashes, pause, one flash, pause, four flashes, pause, a long flash indicating the code is finished. If this were the series of short flashes you got, the code would be 3214.

6) After you pull a code you will notice that it just keeps repeating. To get to the next code what you want to do is wait until the long flash comes on after the code. When the long flash comes on you want to hold down the ECU button for the whole flash and let go of it in the middle of the pause. You should then see the check engine light give you another long flash to indicate the beginning of the next code.

7) When the last codes has been pulled, you will get nothing but long flashes telling you that there are no more stored codes.

8) Now that all the codes have been pulled you will want to clear the ECU of the stored codes. When the ECU's is giving nothing but long flashes, you need to push and hold down the ECU button for 10 seconds to clear out the old codes.

9) If needed, repeat the process for the other A/F ECU (348's have two).

10) The A/F ECU Codes are explained below.

NOTE: contrary to a long-standing myth, 348's do *not* store the above trouble codes after the battery has been disconnected. 348's have a battery disconnect switch above the car battery to quickly disconnect the battery.

Also: Euro cars *can* check these codes, however, this may require a Ferrari tool.

NOTE 2: Our 348's store two types of errors, transient and permanent. If your CEL went out, you had a transient code. The error was recorded, but your system hasn't seen it again. The "permanent" codes will remain stored in ECU memory for 50 starts/starts of your car, even if you fix the problem (unless you clear the codes manually or disconnect the battery).
Ferrari 348 A/F ECU Codes (check with engine running):

*note: Your CEL 1-4 light is located on the bottom *right* side of your instrument cluster; CEL 5-8 warning light is to the *left* side of that CEL 1-4 light.

This is because your engine's 1-4 cylinders are on the right side of your 348, and your 5-8 cylinders are on your left side. Likewise, your right side A/F ECU is behind the right seat for your 1-4 right-side cylinders, whereas your 5-8 A/F ECU is behind your left seat.

http://www.my348.com - thanks, AirBarton

Hot wire air flow meter 1111
Engine coolant temp sensor 1112
Throttle potentiometer 1113
Lambda sensor (O2 Sensor typically unplugged or bad ground or bad sensor) 1114

RPM sensor 1121 (this code may be shown if checked when your engine is off)

Battery voltage 1122
Secondary air solenoid valve relay 1123
Purge valve 1124 (the purge valves are marked as part #21 in this diagram)

Lambda regulation Additive value for self adaptation (O2 sensor or coolant temperature sensor or MAF) 1211
Lambda regulation multiplicative value for self adaptation 1212
Lambda regulation intake manifold compensation (MAF or O2?) 1212 (1213?)

*Lambda codes 1211 and 1212 refer to the fact that the emissions O2 sensors are going full tilt to regulate fuel mixture and it's still not enough. I would unplug them and run the car to add to the data base. If the car then runs normally then something in the O2 system needs to be considered. If on the other hand if it persists we can consider the code a sympathetic action.
It could also be a problem with the coolant temp sensors. Way too many times I have seen a broken wire at that connector cause similar symptoms and it would also cause a Lambda regulation code.
An open connection or high resistance at the coolant temp sensor will make the A/F mixture very rich. Something it can tolerate when cold but less so when you get some temperature in the motor. *thanks, rifledriver

If the 1211 code appears on one side of your engine only, then you'll want to swap MAF's from your left engine side to your right engine side (this is also a good time to clean your MAFs by spraying starter fluid into each end of each MAF) and vice-versa. When you next drive your 348, notice if your 1211 code either returns on the same side of your engine (if so, then your problem is not MAF related) or if it switches sides to follow where you moved your MAF in the above side-to-side swap (which may very well hint that the MAF itself is the problem).

If the1211 problem isn't MAF related per the above test, then swap O2 sensors from side to side when/if your code returns to see if the issue is related to a failing O2 sensor. See also: O2

If your 1211 problem isn't MAF sensor or O2 sensor related, then replace your coolant temp sensors. If this doesn't solve your 1211 issue, then you probably have a fundamental fuel mixture problem caused by any number of things such as a failing spark plug, bad spark plug wire, bad coil, failing alternator, failing fuel pressure regulator, failing fuel pump or bad fuel pump relay, cams mis-timed, etc.

Short circuit on engine idle regulator 1311
Open circuit on engine idle regulator 1312

Electronic control unit 1313 (can be triggered by something as simple as your main Ground strap from frame to tranny being bad or disconnected)

Injection valve 1 (or 5) 1411

Injection valve 4 (or 8) 1412
Injection valve 2 (or 6) 1413
Injection valve 3 (or 7) 1414

Malfunction Indicator Lights (MIL) 1444 *dash light burned out

The 8 undocumented error codes:

2111
2123 Secondary air solenoid valve
2124
2312
2411
2412
2413
2414
Click to expand...

LouB747 · Dec 6, 2011

Just pulled the codes. Feels great already. Alright, maybe no big deal, but it does feel good. Got 2 codes. 1211 and 1114.

So based on this:

Throttle potentiometer 1113
Lambda sensor (O2 Sensor typically unplugged or bad ground or bad sensor) 1114

and this:

If the1211 problem isn't MAF related per the above test, then swap O2 sensors from side to side when/if your code returns to see if the issue is related to a failing O2 sensor. See also: O2

I'm guessing the 1-4 O2 sensor is bad.

Just for info, that sensor was recently replaced when I had to replace my right cat. The old sensor was in so tight my mechanic couldn't get it off. So I just had him replace it.

Is this the logical conclusion you guys reach too? Car ran great right until light came on. Bumpy roads on this mornings drive. Gonna check the connections now.

Wish me luck, Lou

Ricambi America · Dec 6, 2011

LouB747 said: ↑

Just for info, that sensor was recently replaced when I had to replace my right cat. The old sensor was in so tight my mechanic couldn't get it off. So I just had him replace it.
Click to expand...

Not to be a Debbie Downer.... but O2 sensors are reactive. If this code is now on the same side of the engine that had a failed catalytic converter, do you know why the first cat failed? They don't just 'wear out' like an old sneaker. If the cat failed once, and it was simply replaced with another unit, then I'd wager whatever running condition caused the first failure is still at work on the new cat (and it's O2 sensor).

-Daniel aka "Debbie Downer"

LouB747 · Dec 6, 2011

OK. Just smogged recently. CA car. Good numbers. Car runs great. What are your thoughts? Does the O2 sensor come attached to it's wire. In other words, does the sensor disconnect from the sensor right on the sensor?

When my mech replaced the old cat, he said that the OEM ones were crap to begin with......

LouB747 · Dec 6, 2011

Cleared all the codes in an attempt to find out what's wrong. Now pull codes with engine off.....just get 1121 (RPM sensor) to be expected with engine off. NO other codes. Try and start engine and turns over but won't start. Tries to catch, and maybe fires on a cylinder or 4, but won't run. Somethings up. Hard to switch things side to side if she won't run. Am I defeated already!!

LouB747 · Dec 6, 2011

One question, can a CEL cause a bank to shutdown? Because I didn't see a Slowdown light. From what I've researched, a bad O2 sensor won't shutdown a bank. I believe you could disconnect it and the car would run, just have a CEL showing. Is that right? Thanks guys........

plugzit · Dec 6, 2011

Do you get RPM sensor code after cranking engine?
Willing to bet on a bad 1-4 crank sensor then.

LouB747 · Dec 6, 2011

plugzit said: ↑

Do you get RPM sensor code after cranking engine?
Willing to bet on a bad 1-4 crank sensor then.
Click to expand...

Didn't get that one when I first had the problem. Just codes mentioned above. Only got that one(RPM sensor), and that one only, after resetting and testing while car was not running but key turned on. Isn't it normal to get that one while the car isn't running? Wouldn't I have gotten that one before?

Cars halfway in the street. Steep driveway. So gotta either get it started or towed.

LouB747 · Dec 6, 2011

Just tried one more time. Cranks, sorta starts, then dies. Only code is 1121 (RPM sensor). But this is on with the key turned and car not running.

Due to the slope of the driveway, I can't get under the car to check the connections. May have to have it towed. Can't spend the night where it is...

plugzit · Dec 6, 2011

Check the connection at the rpm sensor on the back of the intake cam on the 1-4 bank. Make sure that's good.

LouB747 · Dec 6, 2011

Not sure I know where that is. But will have a look. Checking receipts from before I bought it, I found CEL 1-4.

January 2008:

Written up as coming on occasionally between 4 - 5 K RPMs. Found broken wire on crank/TDC connector. Remove and replaced connector......

plugzit · Dec 6, 2011

Sounds like that connection may have gone bad. The wires down there tend to become brittle.
The connection on the cam sensor is at the end of a wire that protrudes from the back of the cam cover on the passenger side. Often it's attached to the cover by a little bracket.
Get that sucker back into the driveway if you can. There's a towhook in the tool kit, or maybe you have soome brawny friendly neighbors. I pm'ed you my phone number, so call if you need some guidance. Order some kia crank sensors.

ernie · Dec 6, 2011

LouB747 said: ↑

Just tried one more time. Cranks, sorta starts, then dies. Only code is 1121 (RPM sensor). But this is on with the key turned and car not running.
Click to expand...

You will always get the crank sensor code when the engine is not running. The reason is because the pulley is not rotating and crank sensor is not getting any feed back. So the ecu "thinks" it's not working. The car has to be running in order to avoid getting the "false" crank sensor code.

AceMaster · Dec 8, 2011

Lou - any updates on this issue?

LouB747 · Dec 10, 2011

Found the problem. Car runs great now. More to follow.....

ernie · Dec 10, 2011

Well what was it?????

Inquiring minds wanna know.

AceMaster · Dec 10, 2011

LouB747 said: ↑

Found the problem. Car runs great now. More to follow.....
Click to expand...

Awesome, Lou...happy to hear you got this issue settled...can't wait to hear what it was, how you found it, and whether or not this was entirely DIY or did you end up taking it in to a shop.

LouB747 · Dec 10, 2011

Well, I made this short video showing how to pull codes. Notice anything strange....

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PKFhGWLM0i0&feature=player_embedded[/ame]

AceMaster · Dec 10, 2011

LouB747 said: ↑

Well, I made this short video showing how to pull codes. Notice anything strange....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PKFhGWLM0i0&feature=player_embedded
Click to expand...

Hey Lou, I tried clicking on the link but the video won't play and gives the message "This video is private"

LouB747 · Dec 10, 2011

Think I fixed the video problem. Just a video showing me pulling codes 1211 and 1114. But it felt good doing it.....

Engine right at around 1000 RPM.....

AceMaster · Dec 10, 2011

LouB747 said: ↑

Think I fixed the video problem. Just a video showing me pulling codes 1211 and 1114. But it felt good doing it.....

Engine right at around 1000 RPM.....
Click to expand...

Yes Lou, this time the video worked...thanks for posting this video.

LouB747 · Dec 10, 2011

Long day with the kids, finally some free time.

OK. The short of it..............I ran out of gas!!!!

The gauge still showed 1/8 tank and the Low Fuel Level light hadn't come on yet. I've owned the car 2 years now and have seen the light before a few times. Apparently it doesn't work now!

That being said, the car didn't quit running. I saw the CEL 1-4 and awhile latter went into what I thought was "limp" mode. I've never experienced limp mode before. Sure felt like 4 cylinders. I drove 2 blocks home and the car was still running when I got home. Restarted it when I took the video shortly after. So maybe you can see why I thought something was wrong.....

1: engine running at steady but rough 1000RPM idle
2: CEL 1/4
3: Pulled what I thought were valid codes.

I'm guessing the 1114 pertaining to the O2 was the fact it was so lean!!!!

I talked to a few people including my mechanic. I was told that a CEL shouldn't shut down a bank. A Slowdown would, but not a CEL.

I knew the fuel level was low, so I put a gallon in and it fired up and ran nicely. Go figure.

What I've learned:

Don't trust the fuel gauge at low levels
Don't trust the fuel low level warning light
How to pull CEL codes
Where most the electrical connectors are located

Question: Are there 2 fuel pumps in the 348? If so, is one located lower in the tank than the other? It seems like one bank died from fuel starvation while the other kept running....

Good times......

Lou

AceMaster · Dec 10, 2011

Lou, you ran out of gas? LOL! I mean that in a good way

It could have been worse

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