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What to look for with a Euro 3x8?

Discussion in '308/328' started by Fairview, Sep 9, 2009.

  1. Fairview

    Fairview Formula 3
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    Mar 16, 2009
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    Jeff Ward
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  3. ducowti

    ducowti Formula 3

    Jan 27, 2008
    1,501
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    David
    Do some searches for euro for more discussion, but suffice it to say that euros are the unadulterated intention of a model, and provided you have the conformity documents and your state isn't prohibitive like at least CA is for emissions, you should have no legal/DMV problems.
     
  4. barcheta

    barcheta F1 Rookie

    Nov 15, 2003
    3,705
    Fellow f-chatter dudereno is selling this car. Most of what he says is spot on cept the 10-15 horsepower part. :) Euro 308s in this country are rare and euro GTBs are even rarer. If the car has all its dot paperwork (I'm sure it does) and has had a just completed major it's a fair buy. I say fair because in spite of all the work done it's still a 55,000 mile Ferrari. But I myself went for a driven car with mileage so bearing that in mind I would go for it. These cars need to be driven. Things sometimes don't work right if they are allowed to sit for extended periods.
     
  5. stratos

    stratos Formula Junior

    Dec 9, 2003
    637
    Switzerland
    It still has the ugly side indicators, ugly mirrors and is an i :(
     
  6. branko

    branko F1 Rookie
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    Mar 17, 2003
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    This has been discussed many times, so you might do a search. But I'll reiterate a few of the points. The euro is about 287 lbs. lighter than a US version and has a higher compression ratio, 0-60 for Euro is 5.9, 0-60 for US version is 7.4. This is the way the car was originally designed in Italy. The bumpers are recessed and has smaller side mirrors.
     
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  8. eracer

    eracer Karting

    May 29, 2009
    141
    Michigan
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    Eric W.
    I have a Euro 308 and love it. It's basically the same car as the US version, sans the extra weight and emissions crap. I live in Michigan and have never had trouble titling, insuring, etc. (I don't have DOT or EPA papers). If your area doesn't require these certs. then go for it.

    As others have said, it's the way Ferrari intended the car to be.
     
  9. miketuason

    miketuason F1 World Champ
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    Feb 24, 2006
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    It's a Euro, a "B", a QV, and has Euro front spoiler, and the price is right,
    what more can you ask for?:)
     
  10. Bullfighter

    Bullfighter Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Jan 26, 2005
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    Make sure it will be register-able where you live -- either due to age, or because it has DOT papers certifying that it was modified to U.S. specs. Euro cars are a huge P.I.T.A. to try to bring into California -- you can get deals on 308s that guys have tried to register here and failed.

    If you have to deal with smog laws, a 328 is a better car. The U.S. version lost 10 bhp to the Euro, but it's nothing like what happened to the U.S. 308s.
     
  11. johng

    johng Formula 3

    Oct 23, 2004
    2,284
    northern va
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    john g
    i have a euro 308 GTS. in VA, you don't need the epa/dot stuff. car is too old for emissions and DMV will not ask for it. on this particular car, you can see the rear metal "diaper" covering the exhaust pipes. euro cars do not have this so it was probably added during the conversion. this may mean the car has cats.

    john
     
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  13. Club_Sport

    Club_Sport Rookie

    Aug 11, 2009
    44
    Philadelphia, Pa
    You guys are forgetting the most important part - dry sump!
     
  14. flyngti

    flyngti Formula 3

    Jul 16, 2009
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    Eric L
    Not all Euro cars had dry sump.
     
  15. Ferraripilot

    Ferraripilot F1 World Champ
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    May 10, 2006
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    lol when on Earth are you going to stop with this misinformation. you have posted this several times and every time I say something so we can prevent further spreading of these myths.

    Euro car is NOT 287lbs lighter. The items of note within a US car which add weight are: bumpers (80lbs extra), door sidebars (5lbs), extra rear bracing (15lbs), somewhat heavier muffler depending on the year of the car but not that much heavier except if it is a very early carb car with the thermoreactor muffler. There is maybe 100lbs-120lbs difference total! This has been verified over and over and has become somewhat of a hobby of mine in debunking these silly urban legends.

    A Euro car is maybe .1 or .2 to 60mph faster depending on who and how it is being driven and the weather and road conditions that day. Different magazines have different ways of testing, especially back in the day when these cars were new so for Enzo's sake don't go off some foolish number in some magazine when making comparisons.
     
  16. stratos

    stratos Formula Junior

    Dec 9, 2003
    637
    Switzerland
    This may be true for injected cars, but even then I doubt it, but on carb cars the difference is VERY significant, more than a second.
     
  17. Ferraripilot

    Ferraripilot F1 World Champ
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    No possible way I would bet on it. I have as I am sure you have driven Euro QVs, Euro carb cars, early US carb cars and cannot see that much of a difference with any so long as they are in proper fettle. Dyno numbers never yield Euro cars having some substantial difference either. The highest rwbhp figure I have seen is from an fchatter with a US GT4 pulling 190 at the wheels. Next was the Euro QV pulling 188 at the wheels.

    The US '76-'77 engines are not different with the exception being the intake cam is 4 degrees earlier than that of Euro timing. The weight savings even in a Euro carb car are not all that substantial given the same options on the car (a/c etc). Bumpers, small bars in doors, small amount of rear bracing is the only difference besides the muffler which just about everyone has had changed to a sports exhaust of some sort anyway. Euro carb engine output is not different so long as jetting and cams are the same. Carobu engineering has gone through this quite a bit.
     
  18. stratos

    stratos Formula Junior

    Dec 9, 2003
    637
    Switzerland
    It is the cumulation of negatives that makes the difference, not an individual characteristic.
    The weight, the cams, the cam timings, the ignition timing, the anti-pollution equipment, ...
    Different cars.
     
  19. pippo

    pippo Formula 3

    Sep 25, 2005
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    Pretty nice car. If you are looking for original with no mods/adulterations, be sure to ask if the red was the original color. Guys here have bought 308's that were red, and found out the orig color was not red. If'n even you care about it, that is.

    Also, kinda a tech point but, his list of states that DONT have emissions testing omitted FL.

    Personally, burgundy interior is not for my taste, but man, he did spent a lot on lots of stuff on that car for having owned it for a short time, huh?
     
  20. BassMan

    BassMan Formula Junior

    Aug 14, 2008
    626
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    Andy
    If you have emissions issues with registering the car, you can look into setting up a Montana LLC and registering the car there. No state inspections, no taxes, 1 time registrations.
     
  21. Ferraripilot

    Ferraripilot F1 World Champ
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    California busts people for that. There is a regulation specifically for loopholers such as that. I read it here on fchat but cannot recall where.
     
  22. Ferraripilot

    Ferraripilot F1 World Champ
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    I heard something about a CA DMV referee of some sort having the ability to waive a car through emission testing should it be brought from out of state. Anyone know anything about this?
     
  23. Ferraripilot

    Ferraripilot F1 World Champ
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    May 10, 2006
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    Just found the answer to my question.

    Per California DMV.
    Parts Availability Repair Waiver
    In any of the above failure cases, if the parts needed to bring the vehicle into compliance are not available, you may apply for a referee-approved parts availability waiver. Take the vehicle to a referee station and verify through documentation that the needed parts to repair the vehicle are not available. You can then receive up to a 2-year waiver on repairing the vehicle, and the vehicle will be smog certified for the allotted period of time.

    In California, I believe one MUST use OEM parts for it to pass. Proving to one of the referees that OEM 308 emission parts and injection systems are NLA should not be too terribly difficult. Problem is, you have to go through the mess again in 2 years. Hopefully with the same referee though.
     
  24. mustardfj40

    mustardfj40 Formula 3

    Jun 17, 2004
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    Ken
    There are loopholes and tricks that people don't share with others how they did it for fear of being reported to authority here in california. I also know of people who had their vehicles confisticated and crushed.

    I like Euro spec'ed 308 QV for the looks but I dealt with smog checks on these older cars before and personally I think it just doesn't worth the trouble here in California unless it's ultra rare exotic and you enough money to let others deal the issue for you.
     
  25. thecarreaper

    thecarreaper F1 World Champ
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    #22 thecarreaper, Sep 9, 2009
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  26. wards70

    wards70 Karting

    Feb 27, 2005
    208
    Coto de Caza, CA
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    Ward Prickett
    I see bidding just ended on the Euro GTBQV that was on ebay. Fairview did you strike a deal on it? Looked like a nice car!
     
  27. Owens84QV

    Owens84QV F1 Rookie

    Oct 2, 2001
    4,482
    Somewhere in NC
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    Greg
    Interesting that this 'euro' seemed to have non-euro bits on it...the muffler diaper for example. I also thought that all euro's had the mini-spare as well.
     
  28. Irishman

    Irishman F1 Rookie

    Oct 13, 2005
    3,486
    Raleigh
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    Kevin
    Hmmm... Euro though it has the extremely weighty basket case handle spoiler. And painted to boot! :):)
     

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