What track pads for CCM rotors | Page 2 | FerrariChat

What track pads for CCM rotors

Discussion in '458 Italia/488/F8' started by racingbrake, Jul 30, 2015.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

  1. Jasone

    Jasone Formula 3
    Owner

    Nov 15, 2011
    1,203
    Tampa Florida
    Full Name:
    Jasone
    Iron conversion.
     
  2. racingbrake

    racingbrake Karting
    BANNED

    Mar 17, 2014
    155
    Fullerton, CA
    Full Name:
    Warren
  3. MuratC

    MuratC Formula Junior

    Jul 6, 2014
    539
    Istanbul, Turkey
    Pads maybe, rotors are just fine. I track my car frequently for more than a year and they show no visible wear. There is absolutely no need to convert them to iron spending $$$ unless you plan on endurance racing
     
  4. Jasone

    Jasone Formula 3
    Owner

    Nov 15, 2011
    1,203
    Tampa Florida
    Full Name:
    Jasone
    You can't tell by the "look" of your rotors. CCM tolerance is determined by weight, and after a few track days they are out of spec. Sucks that Ferrari didn't spec the brakes on the Speciale and LaF for the track vs. the street but that is the case.
     
  5. Jasone

    Jasone Formula 3
    Owner

    Nov 15, 2011
    1,203
    Tampa Florida
    Full Name:
    Jasone
  6. racingbrake

    racingbrake Karting
    BANNED

    Mar 17, 2014
    155
    Fullerton, CA
    Full Name:
    Warren
    We believe the rotors are the same as F458 although the calipers are different although not 100% sure.

    If you can post a picture of your brake (behind the wheels) that can be helpful, or someone in the know may chime in.

    Thanks
     
  7. action-ant

    action-ant Karting

    Nov 16, 2015
    176
    San Francisco, CA
    Full Name:
    Anthony
    Hi Warren, could you PM me a price for replacement pads for stock CCM rotors? Thank you!
     
  8. racingbrake

    racingbrake Karting
    BANNED

    Mar 17, 2014
    155
    Fullerton, CA
    Full Name:
    Warren
    Will do.

    In fact a lot of these RB sintered pads have been happening lately in track circles (aside from Nissan GTR) In addition to the highly successful run by David Donohue (Well known Porsche pro racer) on his 991 Turbo equipped w/a complete RB-CCB system (sintered pads) competing in Pikes Peaking Racing last June.

    In rennlist (Porsche):
    How to restore your damaged CCM rotors at no cost
    https://rennlist.com/forums/showpost.php?p=14323804&postcount=90

    Camaso Z28:
    Russ winning his NASA race
    http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9611235&postcount=126
    http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?p=9611223&posted=1#post9611223

    Mustang GT350: (CCM rotors were built by RB)
    https://trackmustangsonline.com/threads/carbon-ceramic-brakes-theyre-on.12573/

    Hellcat/Challenger: (CCM rotors were built by RB)
    http://www.racingbrake.com/category-s/7329.htm

    Repost from Viper forum:

     
  9. Need4Spd

    Need4Spd F1 Veteran

    Feb 24, 2007
    6,646
    Silicon Valley
    Interesting thread from 2015. I see that RB has a trackable sintered street pad for CCM brakes now. Sale price is $1395. Is that for all four wheels or just front (or back)?

    Also, it’s not clear to me what the characteristics of the street pad are compared to he track pads. Do they cause equivalent or less wear on the CCM rotors? Or are they harder on rotors? This is important to me since CCM rotors as we know are very expensive.

    Do the street pads have same or better initial cold bite as OEM? Are they more noisy? More dusty? By how much? I assume they have similar high temp characteristics such as good modulation, high fade resistance as the track version, and at least as good or better than stock? As you might guess, I’m starting to look at pad alternatives. Thanks.

    http://www.racingbrake.com/RB-Front-Rear-XC-40-Trackabke-Street-Sintered-Br-p/pd-ccm-02.htm


    Sent from my iPad using FerrariChat
     
    action-ant likes this.
  10. RayJohns

    RayJohns F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    May 21, 2006
    7,402
    West Coast
    Full Name:
    Ray
    When I contacted Brembo about changing my pads [to something more like race pads] they indicated that the pad compound is matched closely to the rotor compound and that changing to different pads could do real damage to the rotors. I have no first hand exerpience with this, so couldn't say much beyond that myself. Also, Brembo was very tight-lipped about the entire subject, citing privacy issues with Ferrari.

    However, after speaking with them, the main takeaway I got was that you're better off changing both the rotors and pads, not just the pads only.

    What setup do the factory challenge cars run?

    Ray
     
  11. racingbrake

    racingbrake Karting
    BANNED

    Mar 17, 2014
    155
    Fullerton, CA
    Full Name:
    Warren
    1. $1395 is for the complete car set (front and rear). Better yet is RB pad lining is made to fit better than OE (78mm depth vs. OE 86mm) on CCM discs.

    2. Unless you are racing at pro level, or on an extremely heavy and fast car like Hellcat (5800 lbs @158 MPH). All users report very satisfactory result with tackable street compound (XC-40). This is the only true "hybrid" compound that is streetable yet can stand for track abuse and deliver consistent high brake torque at elevated temperature. So you don't have to switch the pad like conventional semi-metallic between street and track.

    3. CCM rotor has a very hard surface, so literally no pad (including sintered) can ever wear out a CCM rotor, but it can be damaged from overheat resulting lose of carbon and the surface becomes pitted. RB sintered pads can repair the damage (via the transfer of layer), restore the disc back to normal service condition but at the cost of faster pad wear in the repairing stage.

    4. Sintered brake pads are made of metallic powder "formed" to a metal block under extreme high temperature and pressure, the lining is then "welded" to the backing plate. It's a solid &100% metallic, unlike semi-metallic pads use resin as the bounding agent, and resin tends to get soft/melt at high temperature. So the COF is much higher (0.6 - 0.65) and far more consistent at higher.

    5. In addition to the high and consistent COF, our feedback from track customers reporting they last about 3 times longer than OE pads or other aftermarket pads (Pagid RSC or Endless W007) that are meant for CCM rotors.

    6. Almost no dust, so if you like what you see on your current set up, you would be even happier with sintered pads.

    7. Since the sintered pad is a piece of metal in nature, so you have to get used to a grinding noise when stopping.

    Review on GTR forum detailing the testing and performance of this "hybrid" sintered.
     
  12. racingbrake

    racingbrake Karting
    BANNED

    Mar 17, 2014
    155
    Fullerton, CA
    Full Name:
    Warren
    When a CCM rotor is damaged (from the heat), the surface becomes pitted and the rotor would acts like a "super grinder" so it's not uncommon to see a brake pad running on CCM rotors wear down to backing plate like this one on Speciale (bottom pic). It can easily turn a brake pad into dust in just a few laps, resulting unbearable high cost rotor replacement.

    We all know this fear and concern is the main reason driving users away from using them on tracks, and/or convert to iron. However this has been changed since our successful development and release of sintered brake pads.

    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  13. action-ant

    action-ant Karting

    Nov 16, 2015
    176
    San Francisco, CA
    Full Name:
    Anthony
    Has anyone successfully used Corvette ZR1 (2009-2013) pads on their F458?
     
  14. racingbrake

    racingbrake Karting
    BANNED

    Mar 17, 2014
    155
    Fullerton, CA
    Full Name:
    Warren
  15. action-ant

    action-ant Karting

    Nov 16, 2015
    176
    San Francisco, CA
    Full Name:
    Anthony
    Thanks Warren. I was wondering if the corvette brake pads will work and drop right in without any issue or modification. Could you confirm?
     
  16. racingbrake

    racingbrake Karting
    BANNED

    Mar 17, 2014
    155
    Fullerton, CA
    Full Name:
    Warren
    Yes, ZR1 pads will fit although the lining depth is more than the disc annulus can handle as illustrated in our web page.
     
    action-ant likes this.
  17. drvik

    drvik Rookie

    Aug 13, 2014
    27
    @MuratC do you have an update on stock CCM rotor ware on your Speciale with the Pagid RSC pads? I'm looking at making the conversion myself, but the dealer is warning me about accelerating rotor wear.

     
  18. MuratC

    MuratC Formula Junior

    Jul 6, 2014
    539
    Istanbul, Turkey
    Well, after almost 3 years of tracking the car my stock CCM discs (mostly rear) are almost finished. It will be a very expensive replacement, but I will have to do it very soon. After that I won't track the Speciale very much, maybe 1-2 times a year. 488 Pista will be the new track weapon :D
     
  19. action-ant

    action-ant Karting

    Nov 16, 2015
    176
    San Francisco, CA
    Full Name:
    Anthony
    What about sending the rotors in to get them refinished? 1200 euros per rotor?
     
  20. MuratC

    MuratC Formula Junior

    Jul 6, 2014
    539
    Istanbul, Turkey
    I am also considering that option. But I am not sure how they will perform afterwards. Most likely, I will buy OEM discs and get the old ones refurbished.
     
  21. action-ant

    action-ant Karting

    Nov 16, 2015
    176
    San Francisco, CA
    Full Name:
    Anthony
    Good to hear. Would be curious where you get new discs from and how they compare in cost to the refurbished original discs. Keep us posted!
     
  22. obbob

    obbob Formula Junior

    Aug 14, 2017
    774
    Approximately how many track days in total did your rotors last? Would you say you are a hard driver?
     
  23. MuratC

    MuratC Formula Junior

    Jul 6, 2014
    539
    Istanbul, Turkey
    Hard to say. I think I did around 15-20 track days. Some of them were half day some of them full day but I can't tell how many km's I did on track. Yes, I think I can drive the car near to its limits. So most of my track days were pretty hard on brakes.
     
  24. Need4Spd

    Need4Spd F1 Veteran

    Feb 24, 2007
    6,646
    Silicon Valley
    It also depends on the track. Those with long straights with tight turns at the end are harder on brakes than those with a lot of turns connected by short straights.
     
  25. action-ant

    action-ant Karting

    Nov 16, 2015
    176
    San Francisco, CA
    Full Name:
    Anthony
    Anyone try Ferodo pads for track use? If so, any specific part numbers from them? Thanks in advance!
     

Share This Page