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When will the F12 reach the bottom of the bell curve?

Discussion in 'FF/GTC4Lusso/F12/812S' started by VG221, Sep 22, 2018.

  1. Eilig

    Eilig Formula 3
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    #101 Eilig, Oct 1, 2019
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2019
    I see ONE F12 in the US priced at $185,995, being sold by a place called "Black Label Auto Firm," with over 20k miles.

    Could you please provide links to the F12's (plural) you claim to have seen priced in the $170-$180k range? All others that I can find are currently priced $200k+.

    Do you TRULY believe F12's will lose 25%+ of their value over the next 3-15 months? Or are you just trying to get a rise out of F12 owners on this board by making such a statement.

    My counterpoint: The ONLY way that F12's could possibly trade in the $150k range next year would be if the US falls into a deep recession during said period, in which case all bets are off for ALL Ferraris. But you did not reference/suggest this in your $150k estimate, in which case I suggest you are WRONG.
     
  2. Caeruleus11

    Caeruleus11 F1 Veteran
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    I think we should see if we can establish a premium the F12 should trade at relative to the 599. I love the 599, but I think the F12b should trade at a healthy premium, its just that much more car.
     
  3. kiryu

    kiryu Formula Junior

    Mar 28, 2016
    370
    Los Angeles
    i was in the market earlier this spring. cars with over 20k miles are trading in at 180, low mileage cars are at 200. Add dealer margin and that's pretty much where all the asking prices are on average. Prices bumped a bit in the summer. I think it feels like at least 2 years or more before reaching 150 in asking prices...maybe never reaching there unless the mileage is super high. Who knows. Unlike the lambo v12s under 200k which have very high repair/upkeep costs, the f12 will be an awesome buy at mid 100s, even if they dont hold value.
     
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  4. Eilig

    Eilig Formula 3
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    Black Horse Motors has a 32k mile 2014 F12 priced at $209k.

    Auto Holding of Hillside has a 24k mile 2016 F12 priced at $209k.

    Midwestern Auto Group has an 18k mile 2014 F12 priced at $207k.

    Ferrari Newport Beach has an 18k mile 2014 F12 priced at $220k.

    Grand Prix Motors has a 16k mile 2014 F12 priced at $220k.

    Ferrari San Fran has a 15k mile 2015 F12 priced at $225k.

    Are you guys referring to retail or wholesale pricing?
     
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  5. ttforcefed

    ttforcefed F1 World Champ
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  6. Avia11

    Avia11 Formula Junior
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  7. Eilig

    Eilig Formula 3
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    Like everything else in life, you get what you pay for. Skim off the bottom of a pond and you get muck. Skim off the bottom of Ferrari market and you get ........... Some of us prefer quality, and quality never comes cheap.
     
  8. Surfah

    Surfah F1 Rookie

    Dec 20, 2011
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    Those two examples have over 20000 miles and fugly interiors, that's why they're so cheap.
     
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  9. ChipG

    ChipG Formula Junior

    May 26, 2011
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    Santa Monica, CA
    The HORROR for putting 4k ish miles a year on a car!
     
  10. Raydog9379

    Raydog9379 Karting

    Jan 10, 2018
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    I'd say it's the interiors more than anything, then the mileage which is higher than many others being offered for sale. I'd have no problem popping 4k miles on them a year though, they're meant to be driven.
     
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  11. Caeruleus11

    Caeruleus11 F1 Veteran
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    You guys are both right. But I think if you are going to look at a market for a pre owned car, you have to look at the middle/mean position/ and not the outliers. I'm sure we could find a 70th Anniversary model that's sold in the past year for a high number relative to a 2014 model with 6k miles.
     
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  12. Bundy

    Bundy Formula 3

    May 18, 2011
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    Very true, Jerry. I sold our Tailor Made 2015 F12 with 6,500 miles via Ferrari of Atlanta for $290K earlier this year. Original MSRP was $509K.

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    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
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  13. Caeruleus11

    Caeruleus11 F1 Veteran
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    What a beauty!!!!
     
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  14. Surfah

    Surfah F1 Rookie

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    How many exotics have you resold or traded in?

    Bottom line is that used car buyers for recent model Ferrari's are very mileage sensitive. Why buy a 20000 mileage car when there's gently used options with less than 10000 or even 5000 miles?

    You picked 2 unique examples with relatively high mileage and butt ugly interiors that are statistical outliers to support your F12's will be trading at $150K within one year. Barring an economic recession, the only F12's trading at $150K will be examples like the two you've listed.

    But hey who am I to judge, maybe you have a preference for those interiors?:eek:
     
  15. MDEL

    MDEL F1 Rookie
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    Looking at Mobile De and Autoscout 24 the panorama for the used standard F12's (not included the special editions and the tuned ones) in Europe is roughly the following.
    There is a total of around 110 cars for sale that distribute this way:

    165K to 200K Euros : 59 cars
    200K to 230K Euros : 30 cars
    230K to 250K Euros: 12 cars
    > than 250k Euros : 10 cars

    In the price range 165K to 200K are situated 53% of the total cars for sale. This price range has the older and the less equipped cars and also the ones with more mileage. There is a considerable number of cars with more than 40.000 Km and there is at least one with 75.000 Km. My impression is that the total number of F12's presently for sale isn't higher than what it was 12 months ago. For the lower priced older cars, less equipped and with higher mileage, the prices have decreased between 5 to 10% during the last 12 months. On the other hand the prices of the above 200K cars continuo relatively steady and not very different of what they were 6 months ago.
     
  16. ChipG

    ChipG Formula Junior

    May 26, 2011
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    Not here to brag but it's been a lot of cars over the years. Just keeping it real, not trying to hurt your feelings.
     
  17. DaveMc

    DaveMc Formula Junior
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    My Red 2013 F12 is in the classified section and it has a normal tan colored interior. It does have 17,000 miles, but I adjusted my asking price for that. $187,500
     
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  18. dustman

    dustman F1 Rookie
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    Nice car indeed...following.
     
  19. WilliamB

    WilliamB Karting

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    I believe all quoted is correct Mario.
    Mine, well-equipped, has reached 86K km (for sure hitting the 90K before the end of the year), still enjoying it as much as I can BUT it is not for sale :)
     
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  20. Surfah

    Surfah F1 Rookie

    Dec 20, 2011
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    LMAO no hurt feelings here. I hope you're correct as I'm considering adding a gently used F12 to the stable in a couple years and if the prices come down to $150K in 2020 as you prognosticate then that bodes well for my wallet.

    I won't entertain >20000 miles fugly examples like you've listed however.
     
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  21. Goblin

    Goblin Rookie

    Nov 15, 2019
    6
    I very recently got myself a 2016 F12 for USD310k equivalent. I say equivalent because I am in an Asian country and it was in the local currency. Gorgeously speccd and 7,100km on the odo. Probably a bit more expensive than market but I am so happy. It is an unbelievable car.
     
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  22. Thecadster

    Thecadster Formula 3
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    Congrats on the car and welcome to Fchat.
     
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  23. Gh21631

    Gh21631 F1 Rookie
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    Zero chance they will be at $150K in 2020 unless super high miles, wrecked or storied cars. The F12 offers quite a bit against other even newer GT cars. High 100's low 200's is. much more realistic. I have been looking to add one as a DD but waiting on the sale of another car. Also on the fence about ordering an 812. TDB
     
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