Where's the Engine?

Just learned of this thread. It makes me sad that I was so close in saving 3787 as I was negotiating with the seller to purchase the car right before he shipped it to RM Auctions to sell. The car was in excellent condition through out. It also got about $5K+ of work done right before the sale at RM. I was a little conservative and only offered the seller $95K for the car at the time. Later I kicked my self for not buying the car for the $110K the seller wanted.
I am also upset that the engine was ripped out of the absolutly beautiful 250 GTE. What a color combo! The owner of the 250 SWB had other options, but took the easy way. If I was him I would of stored the GTE so he can put the car's engine back in it if he was ever to be done with using it for racing his SWB. From the preservation stand point it would be the right thing to do and this we would not be reading this thread today! Who knows, could the GTE become even more desirable by collectors in the future. With all the parted out or wrecked GTEs out there, could these cars can be worth tall dollars one day? Maybe. The current owner if he kept the car could than be motivated to put the engine back. Here are a few pictures of the car.

Geno.
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Well here is the chance for those saying 'someone should do something' to put up or shut-up. Sorry to be blunt...

It is very easy to wax prophetically about how these cars should be saved but in reality is there a demand for these cars? I would prefer that engines stay with the cars they were originally put into but if big money wants to use those engines they will be seperated from the originals cars....

We will have to start a GTE rescue fund!

 

Instead of using a spare engine I would have hired a mechanic that is able to rebuild the original unit so that it could be used like originally intended. It is physically impossible for a V12 to throw a rod, so they should be very reliable if only rebuilt properly. For me the bottomline is that this poor GTE was wasted for nothing at all.

In my point of view such behavior damages the reputation of both Ferrari and the shop in question: when owners and specialists seem to think these engines are too fragile to be used what they were designed for, the crowd sees is as substancial evidence for their assumptions: Ferraris are fragile and it costs a million to just hold them together.

Best wishes, Kare

 

Physically impossible? When Pete Iurilli (later a partner of Bruno Borri at Modena Sport Cars) was a mechanic at Hollywood Sport Cars a customer drove in with a 4-cam, complaining that the engine was running rough. Inspection showed a rod sticking out the side of the block. I didn't make this up!

 

That is a nice looking 250 GTE. I love the color combination. Hope that the owner can get a 330 engine and keep it alive. That is the best scenario at this point.

 

Yes as Ed says any engine can throw a rod, and many old vintage race cars are running replica engines to save the original. The fact is, even if an engine throws a rod, it can be repaired but it is understandable that the original engine is a precious thing.



The real problem is that these people are vintage racing these cars too hard. If you race a car at 90% it is unlikely that the engine will have a failure that cannot be fixed. If instead you are over-revving the poor thing all the time trying way too hard to win then yep it will explode eventually.

I blame Goodwood and many other events for this "win at all costs attitude". I recently watched the 2009 Goodwood and was frankly p!ssed off listening to the winners (Redman and Newey) talking about how important it is to be fast and to win at this event. For Pete's sake it is an old car race where winning should not matter. Go and buy a brand new race car and go and fnck that for your "win at all costs attitude".

There will be NO old cars left if we keep this attitude up.
Pete

 

Possible as per material problem or bad rebuild, but highly unlikely as engine dimensions make it impossible to rev it up to a level where critical piston acceleration values are reached.

At 8000 RPM rods in a 250GT engine run roughly the same stress level (piston acceleration) as a SBC at 6000 RPM. This means they are pretty safe, which also was one of the initial design principles when Enzo wanted Colombo to design an engine that is extremely reliable.

Best wishes, Kare

 

More than happily. $50 is cheap for such a good deed.

 

Right... I would say the same for Le Mans Classic. The long 24 heures du Mans is a real race, what Le Mans Classic is not. Remember the Iso accident at Goodwood in 2007? Read the message of "Gaston" here: http://www.pbase.com/steephill/strettoncrash

 

Well, a racing car's primary function is to win races, no?

 

Real races yes.

 

Are historic races real races?

They seem more like theater to me.

I wouldn't be happy to see Macbeth only to learn that they were really killing people.

If you want to really race old cars, races like the 24 hours of LeMons seem more honest and reasonable.

 

That's exactly my point.

 

An historic racing car is no longer a front running racing car where it's only function is to win races.

It now has a more important function and that is celebrating our rich automotive history.

Yes they should be exercised, but winning (at all costs) should not be part of the equation, just for fun and to keep the components in full working order. The car must survive so more people can enjoy it!
Pete

 

Exactly. And when I see today a 512M and a P3/4 together on the track, I can only laugh. The last time I was in Hockenheim, I saw a 312P and several 512BBLM in the same race. Something is wrong. So for me, real old race cars? Yes. But not real races. That means owners and pilots should always think "safety" for the cars. Maybe it's not the right place to debate this.

 

I've been going to "historic" racing in the States for years and the racing is the least interesting part of it. Seeing, hearing and smelling the cars in action adds a dimension that static displays miss entirely.
Anyone, IMO, who looks at it as a real competition is taking it (and themselves) far too seriously. If you want to race get something contemporary and have at it.

 

Couldn't agree more. How many times have I gone to the Monterey Historics (sic) and spent the whole day in the pits......and shopping, I am embarrassed to say.

George

 

Really? I'm surprised the owners let go of their beauties so easily.


Onno

 

Gee, I almost feel bad for taking this thread back to its original topic, but here is a GTE on eBay that has a good body with a Corvette engine and drive train installed. It is my understanding that the engine went to an SWB in 2000 or so.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=110572276143&viewitem=&_trkparms=algo%3DLVI%26its%3DI%26otn%3D1&category=6212#ht_500wt_1071

 

120K with the wrong engine? With the wrong kind of engine?

 

That is the buy it now price, you can still make an offer

 

Onno,
I wouldn't have been so embarrassed if I had been shopping for cars! Wait, were you talking cars or wives?

George

 

I missed the fine print