WHO IS LIABLE IN AN ACCIDENT IN THIS ODD SCENARIO | FerrariChat

WHO IS LIABLE IN AN ACCIDENT IN THIS ODD SCENARIO

Discussion in 'Other Off Topic Forum' started by bryanc4, Oct 23, 2008.

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  1. bryanc4

    bryanc4 Formula Junior

    May 22, 2008
    594
    Delray/Boca, FL
    Full Name:
    Bryan
    jason does a private party financing on his 2005 corvette titled under his name. Buyer Kristen has full coverage on the car but title/registration is still under jasons' name.

    the parties have a notarized contract stating the facts of the sale and that jason is no longer driving the car but merely the legal owner on paper until kristen pays in full.

    Kristine is caught DUI and causes damage to persons/property.

    is jason liable and can he be sued?
     
  2. UroTrash

    UroTrash Four Time F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner

    Jan 20, 2004
    40,470
    Purgatory
    Full Name:
    Clifford Gunboat
    If Jason has the deep pockets... I don't even have to answer.
     
  3. Darolls

    Darolls F1 Veteran
    BANNED

    Jul 2, 2003
    7,782
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    Sparky
    NOTE: Anyone can sue anyone they want; doesn't mean it will hold up in court though, or that you'll find an attorney to handle the case!
     
  4. SRT Mike

    SRT Mike Two Time F1 World Champ

    Oct 31, 2003
    23,343
    Taxachusetts
    Full Name:
    Raymond Luxury Yacht
    Yes there is liability.

    The person suing would sue the person driving as well as the owner.


    Motorcyclist Billy Lane was given a promotional vehicle by Chrysler. He killed a guy DUI and he AND Chrysler got sued over it.
     
  5. SrfCity

    SrfCity F1 World Champ

    You said she had full coverage. I'd think they'd go after her insurance company. No different than if you wrecked and did damage in a rental car.
     
  6. drjohngober

    drjohngober Formula 3

    Jul 23, 2006
    2,040
    Cville and Gbury Tex
    Full Name:
    Dr.John Gober
    They are both in trouble, for driving a corvette.
     
  7. parkerfe

    parkerfe F1 World Champ

    Sep 4, 2001
    12,887
    Cumming, Georgia
    Full Name:
    Franklin E. Parker
    Not only can Jason be sued for negligent entrustment, Kristen could have a problem collecting under his insurance policy as he has no insurable interest in the Vette since it is not titled in his name. Hopefully for him his insurance company will not question his ownership and pay the claim without asking any questions.
     
  8. bpu699

    bpu699 F1 World Champ
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Dec 9, 2003
    17,680
    wisconsin/chicago
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    bo
    Can the guy argue that he was acting solely as the bank?

    If you buy a car and 100% finance, the bank is technically the cars owner (only name on the title). Yet, if the buyer crashes the car, the bank holds no liability.

    I know that the explanation you gave is right, as I have heard that before. But, why is the scenario I described different? The guy was acting as the "bank." He was no longer the legal owner?
     
  9. UroTrash

    UroTrash Four Time F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner

    Jan 20, 2004
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    Purgatory
    Full Name:
    Clifford Gunboat
    I don't think that is true. the car is in the driver's name and the bank is listed as the first lein holder.
     
  10. parkerfe

    parkerfe F1 World Champ

    Sep 4, 2001
    12,887
    Cumming, Georgia
    Full Name:
    Franklin E. Parker
    Not true...if you finance through a bank your name goes on the title as the owner...the bank is only listed as the lien holder, hence no legal liability on the bank. In this scenario however, the owner who financed the car never had his name removed from the title, so he is in fact still the legal owner regardless of any private agreement he had with the guy buying the car...
     
  11. bryanc4

    bryanc4 Formula Junior

    May 22, 2008
    594
    Delray/Boca, FL
    Full Name:
    Bryan
    lets take this a step further:

    jason signs the title over and dates it, and also has a bill of sale showing the exact date the car was sold. however, he does NOT give the title/bill of sale to the buyer but rather gives her copies of such to drive around with.

    and in a case of an accident, though the car is still under his name, he can provide the bill of sale showing his car has been sold long ago. essentially, the car was purchased and NEVER TITLED.

    in Florida as in other states, when buying a car from a private party, you get a title which you dont have to take to the DMV right away. lets assume buyer pays in full for a car and recieved title but does not register the car til a year later
     
  12. parkerfe

    parkerfe F1 World Champ

    Sep 4, 2001
    12,887
    Cumming, Georgia
    Full Name:
    Franklin E. Parker
    If sued, that would be an argument you could make and it would be up to the jury to decide. That being said, it is never a good idea not to just give the new owner the title in his name and you listed as the lien holder if you are also financing the purchase. Otherwise, you could face not only potential legal liability exposure in the event of an accident, but the buyer who's name is not on the title has an insurable interest problem he may have with his insurance carrier...especially if the vehicle is totaled when the insurance company requires the title before paying for the totaled car...
     
  13. SRT Mike

    SRT Mike Two Time F1 World Champ

    Oct 31, 2003
    23,343
    Taxachusetts
    Full Name:
    Raymond Luxury Yacht
    I am no lawyer (thank god) but I don't think the above argument would hold water, and I'd think any lawyer worth his salt would punch enough holes in that to make it like swiss cheese in about 10 seconds.

    I am surprised Kristen was able to insure a vehicle not titled in her name. Furthermore, if it is registered in Jason's name, he clearly knows about it since he is paying excise taxes on it, no? I think it would be very hard for Jason to make the case that he had no knowledge of what was going on. Presumably Jason DID know what was going on, but is looking to absolve himself from liablity... the only way to do that is sell Kristen down the river and claim he didn't know she was driving on his registration. Not only is that a lie (presumably), Kristen is going to object, and if the house of cards comes tumbling down, it's not going to look good to a judge/jury that Jason lied to try to get out of the situation.

    There has to be (or should be) some other element to cross-check ownership. Here in MA, you have to get proof of insurance before you can register the vehicle. You go to the insurance office, they stamp your application for registration with a stamp identifying the insurance co. You take that to the registry and walk out with your registration showing who the insurer is.

    If other states let you insure a vehicle without being the registrant, that opens up the possiblity of all kinds of fraud... purchasing a vehicle that you never actually register and driving on someone else's plates. There HAS to be a mechanism for preventing this?

    If nothing else, it would be questioned why Jason didn't remove the plates and cancel the registration? Here in MA, I'd never let someone drive a car on my plates... because whatever they do, that is tied to me. I've done it for family/friends, but anytime I sell a car, I remove the plates and tell the purchaser to either get it insured/registered before pick-up, or they can take a plate off another of THEIR cars and drive home illegally at their own risk.
     

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