Why are clutches on exotics replaced at such low mileages?

thats funny...............

 

"A Ferrari owner is not necessarily a Ferrari driver." - Enzo Ferrari

 

C'mom you guys, I had a wet clutch in a car...although the thrust bearing had leaked all over it but, still it was a wet clutch. Now...Brian you had to get a laugh out of that!?

 

That would certainly "grab" you would it not?

 

Hudson's used to have wet clutches. We have a can of Hudson clutch fluid in the shop

 

I think all motorcycles have wet clutches and most have for 60+ years.

Basically they need them for the same reason exotics to go through clutches....high rpm starts fry the clutch if you don't cool it. A car with a 500 rpm idle pulls away at 700-800 rpm. My 308 with a 1000 rpm idle and CIS used to buck at anything below 1500, and wasn't some until 2000. Tha't pretty hard on the clutch. Converting to EFI fixed that by the way, it now pulls out smoothly right from idle.

 

Maybe you can sell it to Ivan Z.

 

Nope. BMW and Moto Guzzi have made almost no wet clutches in their history, most (all?) modern Ducati's are dry as well. Almost all Japanese bikes ever made are wet.

 

Yep, that's true. I've owned 4 different Ducatis and they sound pretty cool with the open or vented clutch covers so you can really hear the clutch rattle. That, combined with the deep, booming, bass exhaust note from the Termignoni system is the Ducati trademark! Have an MV Agusta F-4 1000 now and miss the exhaust and clutch rattle as it has a wet clutch.

 

It's a rare Lotus that has a "dry" clutch! LOL

My '72 is still on the original clutch. It has about 55k miles on it, mostly around town both from the PO and me. It's still strong too. I always figured it was designed for an engine of twice the HP, and a car of twice the weight since it's lasted so long. Plus, I don't abuse the car with wild, mismatched revs on my occasional downshifts. Brakes are a lot cheaper than clutches! I also leave the heel and toe stuff for rare occasions as it's easy for an amature like me to slip the clutch when doing it near the red line.

Ken

 

Veryons have wet clutches. (Two).

I drove my 308 85K on one clutch, and my TR 125K before repalcing the clutch.

 

I can't tell you how many people I have seen that put the clutch in, shift gears, then hit the gas before the clutch pedal is fully out. These people should not be surprised when their clutch wears out quickly.

 

Most Ducatis have dry clutches, hence the shattering in neutral at the stop light.

 

This may sound idiotic, but isn't the clutch going to slip just a bit every time you move off from a standstill? I'm assuming that the "slipping" into 1st that everyone is mentioning is a reference to dropping the clutch at higher rpm than the car requires to move out, and, perhaps, punching the throttle furhter before the clutch is full engaged.

 

I know you drive your cars but that's a LOT of miles on any Ferrari for one guy to drive! I bet no one else here has put 125k miles on a Ferrari by themselves.

Ken

 

show off !! lol !!!

 

Let me tell you the TR clutch was done at 125K but as we were doing a major it seemed like the thing to do.

F1 clutches are a totally different matter. So far I have 20K on my Maser and all seems fine but somehow I don't see it lasting 125K miles...

 

My understanding: any time the clutch somewhere between fully disengaged (pedal on or near the floor) and fully engaged (foot off the pedal), the disc will wear, as it is designed to.

If you are starting the car on level ground or going downhill, you should have minimal slippage. Starting the car uphill requires raising the engine revs a bit to cope with the load. So yes, that's more wear, but nothing the car wasn't designed for.

Ferrari clutches may not be the most long-lived, but you can help it along by:

1. Putting the car in neutral and keeping your foot on the dead pedal (NOT the clutch) at stop lights. This saves wear on the throwout/release bearing.
2. Selecting the right gear.
3. Knowing your car well enough to launch it smoothly with minimal slipping of the clutch. You don't want to stall, but but if every launch involves 5 seconds of letting out the clutch pedal you will be buying a lot of clutches.
4. Avoiding 'Magnum' starts, where you rev the engine and 'drop' the clutch to spin the wheels.

I'm not a mechanic - this is advice I've received along the way. If anyone wants to add/subtract/edit, I welcome comments.

 

A mechanic once told me that if you don't stall it once in a while, you are beating on the clutch. I think it is an intended exageration but the point is correct.

 

Jon,
That coincides with what I do, exept that I usually leave the clutch disengaged and the lever in 1st at lights; I'll trade the throwout bearing for the ability to move if accident avoidance requires it.

 

I'm a bit surprised about the bmw, (although there engine orientation means no primary to lube I guess)....but I'd expect as much from the italians

Indian, Triumph, Norton, BSA, H-d sporters were all wet clutches I think

H-D big twins mostly dry I think

 

You guys are brutal Give a guy a break who "may" have made the wrong statement. I will check into this further and maybe come back and eat crow and apologize to the forum.

As one of the poster mentioned motorcycles can be wet. I restored two old harley davidson and they were wet clutchs, one was actualy a drip mechanisim. I have never torn into a Ferrari clutch. The 2 cars I restored never got any clutch work. I was going on what I was told by a service technician.

This clutch arrangement was how i think it was explained to me at the dealership by the technician, maybe I misunderstood. On the other hand all of you might be liberal arts majors who have no clue.

The post that gives me some concern I am wrong is the Lambo/Ferrari Technician. i suspect he would know. You guys got me curious. It should be no mystery only a simple mechanism.

I will probably be back to eat crow and i have learned something which is the point of the forums

Lee

 

You were right anyway that wet is the rule in motorcycles. Many Ducs were dry but I was surprised by the BMW.

 

With a bit of practice, you can toss the car into first pretty quickly.

When I took delivery on my first Alfa -- back when they still had shake-down runs -- the mechanic was all over me about the clutch both to and from the test course: "Get your foot off the pedal. That play is for me, not for you."

I've been keeping cars in neutral at stop lights since. Putting it into first to move out becomes second nature pretty quickly. (And how big a cliche has it become to see someone leave their car in reverse at a light? How do you know it's first you'll need for accident avoidance?)

The only problem I've had since then has been the short throw shifter in the EVO -- sometimes I'd like one of those gear indicator displays the rally cars have.

 

I talked to several mechanics and I got the same responses from them as I got from the forum. Basically "what planet have I been on".

I talked to many mechanics including the Ferrari mechanic that told me what I had posted.

He said that ferrari's have a dry clutch as do almost all cars. He said the difference is on F1. The ferrrari is a dry clutch and is a manual computer controlled clutch. The computer engages or pulls away the clutch. He called it a manumatic.

Other automatics on cars are oil bath or oil drive systems, not dry like Ferrari F1 dry clutch. This is one reason it is so fast to shift. So the wet or dry clutch is only within the context of an automatic discussion. The error I made was assuming the same on manaul transmissions. I screwed up
Now if this is wrong I did not climb under the car and take apart the ferrari clutch.

So as I eat crow I least understand a "little" more now. Thank you all for setting me straight. The sad part is it made sense to me when I was wrong.

I hope you are all correct on the length of service on ferrari clutchs I had been going on the assumption is 10-12k miles and it is cauput. This is what I have been told.

Thank again

Lee