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Why does my 2013 Dodge minivan have more Git-Up than my QV 3.0?

Discussion in 'Mondial' started by stasha, Sep 13, 2021.

  1. stasha

    stasha Rookie

    Sep 10, 2021
    35
    Full Name:
    steve steve
    I have to say, I am more than slightly disappointed with the acceleration of our 84 Mondi QV 3.0 cab (40K miles).
    For certain, our stock 2013 Dodge Caravan has a kickdown, at any speed, that launches the van 100X faster than the QV. The QV's acceleration power is about equivalent to our 2014 3 cylinder Smart car!

    This can't be right.
    The car smells of raw gas when it's running, so I'm wondering if I should start with the injectors?
    Timing?
    Get a "T"?
    Get a Miata?

    Other suggestions?
    Thanks.
     
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  3. Subito Grigio

    Subito Grigio Karting

    Jun 2, 2009
    233
    Raw gas smell in the car means “Do not drive me.”

    Engine bay is extremely tight fit with little fuel distribution lines running around; exhaust pipes, two catalytics and muffler; perhaps an errant spark or two because vermin like ignition wires sometimes; a pair of boxy fuel tanks are quite near too.

    I have never smelled raw gasoline in my Mondial.

    SG


    Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat.com mobile app
     
  4. mike32

    mike32 F1 Rookie

    May 13, 2016
    3,645
    Uk
    Take a set of compression reading first to see if the engine is worn, what is the history on the cam belts- are they on the correct tooth. Any backfiring or missing. Check the fuel pump lines in the rear wheel well, last fuel filter change ? Check if fuel accumulator is leaking
     
  5. stasha

    stasha Rookie

    Sep 10, 2021
    35
    Full Name:
    steve steve
    Upon closer inspection, this is what I can report:
    The smell of gas is only when the car is running.
    No smell of gas from engine bay, nor can I find pooling or other evidence of a gas leak in the bay.
    There is a distinct difference at the exhaust tips -- left side is black and sooty; right side is what I would expect -- light brown.
    (See attached pix)
    Suggestions how to further investigate this?
    Could this possibly explain lack of the power I would expect from a Ferrari?

    Thanks.

    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  6. stasha

    stasha Rookie

    Sep 10, 2021
    35
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    steve steve
    Mike - just saw your suggestions.
    Compression tests - I can see how to access the rear bank, but how do I get to the front plugs?
    Cam belts supposedly recently changed within past year, as well as fuel filter.
    There is no backfiring -- well, no loud burping, although I think I heard a burble once in a while.
     
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  8. mike32

    mike32 F1 Rookie

    May 13, 2016
    3,645
    Uk
    Front plugs are fun to get out, be sure to blast the area with compressed air before you remove the plugs in case any crap drops into the cylinder. You need to be nimble and have long arms. You should have a special plug spanner with a rubber ring to grip the plug if i remember correctly. I seem to remember it has a universal and a hexdrive to use with a flat ratchet in the tool kit. Take out a rear plug first until u get the idea. If the oem plug spanner is missing you need one with a rubber ring to grip and lift it out. It is deep and you dont want it falling back in.
    Compression tests first .
     
  9. mike32

    mike32 F1 Rookie

    May 13, 2016
    3,645
    Uk
    #7 mike32, Sep 13, 2021
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2021
    One or 2 distributors ?
    Does this thing have a cat connverter
    Buy a cheap laser thermometer and shine that on the exhaust manifold, about $40 . Compared rear and front or each exhaust out of the heads
     
  10. spicedriver

    spicedriver F1 Rookie

    Feb 1, 2011
    3,074
    Sounds like it's only running on 4 cylinders.
     
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  11. Jeka

    Jeka Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 20, 2010
    1,124
    Rotterdam
    Full Name:
    Johan
    It looks like it's running on one bank, even in that case it's running smooth but with less power. I would start with a check for spark on all 8 cilinders.
     
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  13. paulchua

    paulchua Cat Herder
    Moderator Owner

    Jul 1, 2013
    11,625
    Menlo Park, CA
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    Paul Chua
    A Dodge Caravan is no slouch! That said, you're QV should be faster in a straight line.

    I looked up the Dodge and the 0-60 is 8 seconds. Even the slowest QV I could find does it in the high 6s. Something is not right. The reasons can be a lot of things.

    Definitely get it checked out! The running on a half bank might be the culprit as others have suggested.
     
  14. stasha

    stasha Rookie

    Sep 10, 2021
    35
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    steve steve
    Yah, sumptin's wrong. Hard to believe only half a bank running. It should sound terrible, right?...and it has a great V8 rumble.
    Must be some cause that results in a fractional dimminuation of performance -- but still can get over 105mph (Nevada desert at midnight).
     
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  15. MauroV

    MauroV Karting

    Jun 24, 2013
    147
    Italy
    Full Name:
    Mauro
    I'm no expert but, seems to me, the different colour on the exhaust pipes must mean something is wrong. I think sooty black is the most normal.
     
  16. hnichols

    hnichols Karting

    Apr 15, 2020
    122
    Chicago IL
    Full Name:
    Hugh Nicholson
    The running on only one bank hypothesis would make sense of both the gas smell when running and the low power. I think it would still run smoothly enough, though.
    Doesn't the QV have indicator lights on the dash indicating if there's a problem with each of the banks? Of course, no one wants to rely on Mondial indicator lights.
    If that is in fact the case, I definitely would not drive it -- that's how alot of the Ferrari engine fires start: a combination of unburnt fuel from the non-funtioning bank and hot exhaust from the running bank.
    You could check the hypothesis easily enough simply by pulling a plug from each bank.
     
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  17. stasha

    stasha Rookie

    Sep 10, 2021
    35
    Full Name:
    steve steve
    Sounds good. I'll give it a try later next week.

    So, we just had a 2300 mile "trial of life" driving it from Portland OR to Ft Worth TX. Either that or we just used up our lottery luck, huh.
     
  18. FamilyCar

    FamilyCar Formula Junior
    Rossa Subscribed

    Sep 26, 2007
    561
    Seattle, Wa
    Full Name:
    Peter Goodall
    I don't think that a difference in color on the exhaust tips tells you anything, since they are not dedicated to different cylinder banks. Both come off the same muffler, and one tends to only emit an a higher engine speed. You'll notice that a start up on a cold morning will get most condensation from one side at idle.

    The unburned fuel smell may simply indicate a failed catalytic converter, although I would certainly recommend a full check over on the engine. Ignition or fouled injectors, perhaps? It sounds as if you got the car recently, so replacing the fuel lines or a least a good inspection are in order.

    As far as acceleration, we're on our second Grand Caravan, so I do know how they drive. We had a 2010 and now a 2018. The torgue delivery between the Mondial and the van is very different, with the van being much stronger at lower rpms. The Mondial hits peak torgue at quite a high rpm so I don't view it as great off the line. It does best when the engine can be kept in a high rpm band. I'm not saying there isn't something wrong with your car, but it may be expectations or how it is being driven.

    Also, its 30-something year old car, so the van may be about as fast with a lot less effort. Keep in mind that in 1987 (my year) a Corvette was 240 HP and a Mustang was 225, so that perspective is pretty different from today. You just need to find the right roads for it--the Mondial can sweep through curves in a way the van can't!
     
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  19. stasha

    stasha Rookie

    Sep 10, 2021
    35
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    steve steve
    GTK ref. mixing of exhaust from both banks! Thanks.
    Yes, very recent purchase of the car, so everything new to me (and still of interest, hah).
    Yes, we did notice that the car pulled well, when in the 4-5000rpm range!
     
  20. donkost

    donkost Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 1, 2016
    388
    Blandon, PA
    You state that you have a cab, so you should be able to remove the access panel behind the rear seats in order to access the front bank of plugs from the interior.
     
  21. stasha

    stasha Rookie

    Sep 10, 2021
    35
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    steve steve
    Yep, there's a panel, and yes, I will try it tomorrow hopefully. thanks.
     
  22. Eddie.h

    Eddie.h Karting
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    Mar 30, 2015
    89
    Houston, Tx
    Full Name:
    Ed
    Yep. Off the line is a tough one for a car built for the road. Occasionally I get a youngster in a Vette or Mustang etc that wants to act silly at a light. I just have to wave and let them go. (Would do that anyway). But I am sitting in a Mondial and they are not. My wife’s Audi Q5 will definitely out perform the Mondial. But once again it is a Ferrari and the other is just an Audi.


    Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat
     
  23. stasha

    stasha Rookie

    Sep 10, 2021
    35
    Full Name:
    steve steve
    Yes, I was getting the car inspected yesterday, and sure as rain, an AC Cobra replica pulled up behind me.
    Hmmmm, Ferrari vs Ford, huh?

    I'm thinking up appropriate personal license plates (7 letters max) to preempt and counter hotrodders, cops, and other unreasonable expectations. like: OLD-FRT, SENIOR, NO-PROBS,180TOPS, 55MPH, 180MPH, DECREPT, NOT FST, GOGOGO, TICKETS, LVCOPS, 2OLD, C-DATE, SEDATE, GOARMY, EX-SF, 2-OLD, IDUNNO, MENTAL, PTSD, DISABLD, NO-GAS, STOPIT,
    and all the things new F owners go thru, right?


    Im sure most of you have gone thru this
     
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