Why I Chose to spend new-car money on my old tech 308 GTBi | FerrariChat

Why I Chose to spend new-car money on my old tech 308 GTBi

Discussion in '308/328' started by John A. Muller, May 16, 2023.

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  1. John A. Muller

    John A. Muller Formula Junior

    Apr 16, 2022
    259
    Chesapeake Beach, MD
    Full Name:
    John A. Muller
    I've owned my car for the past 38 years and had run the odometer up to 79K. A decision had to be made: 1) buy a newer Ferrari or 2) give my faithful old girl a major refurbishing instead. I chose to keep my car because I saw no reason to leave the analog universe for new tech. Short story - Close to 3 years and $150K later my 308 is once again the beauty she was when new. I did not attempt to upscale the car, nor to make a concours contender out of her; I focused on a total long-block rebuild plus total suspension rebuild etc. I have enclosed a couple of photos of the end result...Yes, it cost me to stay as original as possible (factory parts are extremely expensive), but I figure the price of the car was $50,000 in 1980; so if you figure in cost-of-living increases over the years the car would now sell new in the $180,000-200,000 range. In closing, I have my new 308 GTBi for another 30-40 years of enjoyment (OK, I will be long gone, but someone will enjoy her).
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  2. Viperjoe

    Viperjoe F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    A wise choice and a simply stunning result. Congrats and enjoy in good health. Is the seat pattern original?
     
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  3. jm2

    jm2 F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Aug 19, 2002
    19,221
    michigan
    Full Name:
    john
    Very cool, congratulations!
     
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  4. alex

    alex Formula Junior

    Dec 19, 2003
    699
    Crystal Lake, Illinois
    Full Name:
    Alex
    It’s beautiful! Enjoy!
     
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  5. John A. Muller

    John A. Muller Formula Junior

    Apr 16, 2022
    259
    Chesapeake Beach, MD
    Full Name:
    John A. Muller
    Yes, I had the upholsterer take measurements from my original and stitched the pattern into the new hides. He also replaced my headliner with Ferrari fabric in black (it was a factory option). The difference really sets off the interior.
    It cost $4,500 for the seats and headliner. The paint was done by a master refinisher in 1987 ($10,500 at that time) and the 7 coats of hand-rubbed acrylic Nero still look new after 35 years (again, well worth the effort and expense).
    The old girl really appreciates her refurbishing and is rewarding me with the best drives I've had. She is all stock.
    Thank you for your kind words!!!
    John
     
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  6. Brian A

    Brian A F1 Rookie

    Dec 21, 2012
    3,150
    SanFrancisco BayArea
    Full Name:
    1983 US 308 GTS QV
    Fantastic!

    I completely agree with your choice.

    308s are underappreciated Ferraris. Not sure why.
     
    NYC Fred likes this.
  7. Sunshine1

    Sunshine1 Two Time F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Jan 22, 2011
    27,231
    Miami
    Beautiful! Enjoy in good health.

    150K is a lot of money to restore a 40-year-old car, wondering what was done to it that cost this much.
     
    05F430F1 likes this.
  8. Bullfighter

    Bullfighter Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jan 26, 2005
    22,601
    Gates Mills, Ohio
    Full Name:
    Jon
    Well done. I've considered modern cars, and the happiness calculation has me always coming back to the '70s-'80s. I wish I still had my 328, but I went through the same thought process in regard to some restoration/refresh items on my Porsche 964. Expensive, but the newer cars are somehow commodities.

    $150K seems a lot, but good luck to anyone trying to find a properly restored 308 for less.

    As time goes by, I've also noticed the 308/328 seem even more exotic -- plenty of California/Portofinos here, but I haven't seen a 308 on the road in years. (Similar feeling in my 964 -- tons of late model Porsches, but the air-cooled cars are scarce in the wild.)
     
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  9. John A. Muller

    John A. Muller Formula Junior

    Apr 16, 2022
    259
    Chesapeake Beach, MD
    Full Name:
    John A. Muller
    The engine-out long-block rebuild was close to $70K; the suspension was over $20K; the Ferrari factory parts (new or rebuilt) are unreal (15" shielded cable cost $709, radiator, $3,500 etc.); labor - area mechanic hourly rates are from $125-295/hr.; Michelin XWX 205/70 x 14 at $485 ea.etc. At that rate it doesn't take long. Do understand that I chose to go with the best in the area (i.e. within a 150 mile radius of home). I knew that to get a reliable analog, gated 5-speed, non power boosted car I would be limited as to fulfill my needs...I knew my car, and I was ready to do right by her...She is happy as I am traversing the windy roads in this area.
    I happy that you like the results...I hope this explains my apparent lunacy.
    John
     
  10. Sunshine1

    Sunshine1 Two Time F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Jan 22, 2011
    27,231
    Miami
    This is impressive. Congratulations!! That’s a serious restoration (including half for the engine rebuild), your car is going to live many more decades in great shape. Enjoy :cool:
     
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  11. John A. Muller

    John A. Muller Formula Junior

    Apr 16, 2022
    259
    Chesapeake Beach, MD
    Full Name:
    John A. Muller
    Of the 12,143 model 308s manufactured between 1975 and 1982, very few are seen as of late, and many are not in the best condition. People took them for granted and many didn't have the spare cash for proper upkeep. Over my 38 years of ownership I found that model year 1980 only had 24 GTBi and 29 GTSi cars manufactured for US export - all other 1980 cars were Weber models (GTB/GTS) for Europe and elsewhere. Also, my car was the car used to explain the V.I.N. coding (see factory service bulletin SB-006) issued 03/07/80. It might prove to be worth the investment...Thanks for your interest!
     
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  12. tbakowsky

    tbakowsky F1 World Champ
    Consultant Professional Ferrari Technician

    Sep 18, 2002
    19,977
    The Cold North
    Full Name:
    Tom
    Umm..forgive me..70k for an engine and gearbox build? Did I read that right?
     
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  13. John A. Muller

    John A. Muller Formula Junior

    Apr 16, 2022
    259
    Chesapeake Beach, MD
    Full Name:
    John A. Muller
    Not quite...only the motor was given a long-block rebuilt (no gearbox as it was and is fine)...Removal and disassembly of the engine was labor intensive due to age and fusing of some parts several bolt removals etc were problematic; from there the engine was shipped to Napa, CA for machining, milling, new sleeves and pistons, etc, etc.; then back to MD for assembly and installation (time period was over a year due to waiting for the highly rated shop was able to start work). During the wait time I had the suspension rebuilt, the cooling system refurbished (new radiator and fans); the electrical system gone over to fix anything not right (swapped fuse boxes for a Birdman308 unit); AC rebuilt, original Alpine am/fm cassette radio rebuilt; new clutch pressure plate/throw-out bearing; factory rebuilt oil cooler and new braided hoses; all gauges and lamps were refurbished, new Michelin XWX 205/70 x 14 tires at $495 each. Ferrari parts were very hard to find and very expensive (a 15" braided fuel line was $709). I ended up with 37 pages of invoices. Was it worth it? Yes, because I got the car I wanted for less than a newer car...I would do it all again.

    Your "Umm" indicates you wouldn't go this route, and I understand. My 308 has a history and value since it is only one of 24 fuel injected coupes made in 1980 (all other 1980 cars were Weber equipped), and it was the car used to decode the new V.I.N. (see factory bulletin SB-006 issued March, 7, 1980. In any event, I have a quality build car good for the next 40+ years.
    Best Regards
     
  14. Schulz308

    Schulz308 Formula 3
    Rossa Subscribed

    May 21, 2014
    1,506
    STL USA
    Stunningly fierce spec also!

    Great that you have chosen to ride that stallion all the way to sunset.
     
  15. John A. Muller

    John A. Muller Formula Junior

    Apr 16, 2022
    259
    Chesapeake Beach, MD
    Full Name:
    John A. Muller
    Thank you for the kind words. I'm hoping to drive her a few more years before I can no longer get in or out of it (44" high).
     
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  16. SirTony76

    SirTony76 Formula Junior

    Jan 18, 2004
    302
    MN
    Nice work any chance you could share pictures of the process?
     
  17. fpb

    fpb Karting

    Dec 18, 2003
    179
    MI, Chicago
    You made the right decision, this is awesome. You basically have a new car. Keeping an "older" vehicle on the road is also a great way of preserving history (and it's even more eco-friendly than buying new).

    +1 on pictures!
     
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  18. John A. Muller

    John A. Muller Formula Junior

    Apr 16, 2022
    259
    Chesapeake Beach, MD
    Full Name:
    John A. Muller
    I've got a bunch, but here are just a few such as engine removal, engine after disassembly, engine assembly at machine shop, ready to reinstall engine and tranny and my favorite mechanic, Mike at work. Were you looking for anything in particular?
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  19. John A. Muller

    John A. Muller Formula Junior

    Apr 16, 2022
    259
    Chesapeake Beach, MD
    Full Name:
    John A. Muller
    Thanks...I fell for the lines of the 308 coupes, and didn't want to give up on my old girl...Many nights were spent justifying the expenditure of doing a rotisserie (not needed) and a full refurbish of the car's engine, running gear, suspension, electrical system, cooling system etc. I justified spending over $150K by calculating the original $50Kpurchase price in1980 to what that price would equate to now...a new 308 built new today would cost over $175K...The car is better now than ever before and it is stock (no tricks add to improve performance). The car is fast enough, still looks great, has its Nardi steering wheel sans airbag, a gated shifter and analog gauges...so, I am a happy camper.
     
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  20. Sunshine1

    Sunshine1 Two Time F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Jan 22, 2011
    27,231
    Miami
    Stock. Even better (like if you had bought it brand new from the dealer now). :cool:
     
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  21. Brian A

    Brian A F1 Rookie

    Dec 21, 2012
    3,150
    SanFrancisco BayArea
    Full Name:
    1983 US 308 GTS QV
    I too keep my cars for a long time. It just takes me a long time before I understand their nuances, fix them the way I want and, thus, come to trust them.

    I totally "get" what you have done. There is something wonderful about watching the progress, making decisions, scrounging for parts, and watching it come together. It is such a different experience than a car that just comes and goes quickly like a visitor in the garage.

    When people unfamiliar with Ferraris think of what a Ferrari looks like they think of the 308. It is absolutely a classic design. One of the greatest car designs in history.
     
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  22. Bullfighter

    Bullfighter Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jan 26, 2005
    22,601
    Gates Mills, Ohio
    Full Name:
    Jon
    I agree absolutely . I’d add that you end up with something really special. I’ve tried to like an F430 and 458, and they’re interesting, but if I could walk into a showroom and buy a new 308/328, I would do it without hesitation. (And over in the Porsche world I’d be all over a long hood 911 or 964.)



    Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat
     
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  23. Bullfighter

    Bullfighter Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jan 26, 2005
    22,601
    Gates Mills, Ohio
    Full Name:
    Jon
    Yes. Appreciate the experience and the era. No need to try to pretend it’s a modern car. The restomod thing is overdone these days.


    Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat
     
  24. John A. Muller

    John A. Muller Formula Junior

    Apr 16, 2022
    259
    Chesapeake Beach, MD
    Full Name:
    John A. Muller
    Thanks for the support, Brian. It must have been the right move as my wife never tried to stop me spending the money. I have run up enough break-in miles that I can now take the revs past 5K...Everything works as advertised. Probably the best investment was the Birdman308 fuse block as it provides the missing link to getting the power windows to work 2-3 times faster, the car to start on the first try, lighting is brighter etc...Enough said...Again, I appreciated your comments.
    John
     
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  25. willrace

    willrace Three Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Oct 21, 2006
    35,090
    North Tay-has
    Full Name:
    Kurt
    Either you "get" the New 30/40/50 Year Old Car, or you don't.
    The same cost spent on a new, rapidly depreciating car with little character just doesn't have the same appeal (or even close, for me).
     

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