Why is the (pre T) California considered bad?

azlin75 · Apr 21, 2019

flat_plane_eddie said: ↑

In my opinion it's not as loved because it's not a looker. I wouldn't call it ugly but for 100k or whatever they go, I can think of 100 cars I'd rather buy. They honestly do nothing for me when I see them. The Maserati GranTurismo is a looker, on the other hand. It pretty much boils down to nobody wants an ugly Ferrari.
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I suppose beauty is in the eye of the beholder, that being said when the California was mentioned to me as a candidate for purchase it took me a little bit to come around to it. But to be fair ferrari in my mind looks like the 308, 355, 360, ect so to wrap my mind around a GT car took a while. Interestingly enough I was on the fence about the granturismo too but have since come around.

To me both iterations of the California , the California and the T variant, are both decent looking cars and are just different enough to appeal to different audiences. My wife prefers the T while I’d be happy with either since I like different things about each car, but I’d probably be just as happy with a Granturismo with the exception of the performance differences probably being my only gripewhich the granturismo makes up for in other areas.

And while the 458/488 are much more comfortable and roomy then the 360 and 430 I found I still didn’t like how low you sit, which the California and t I never experienced that. And for the money entry into a California is relatively cheap for Ferrari with several examples under 100k which to my mind is a bargain for a modern exotic. And other then the 2 main , and major, possible issues relatively easy to maintain though as these cars get older we will find out what other parts will need attention.

I’ve said it before, but I think that the California gets most of its hate because it doesn’t have a v-12, and if it did have and retained the hard top convertible option I believe we would all be have very different discussions. And I think given that all Ferrari’s have certain quirks the top and DCT issues would have been chalked up to the “Ferrari” experience. Also given that they sold more California’s then any other model you can’t deny it was at least succesful for Ferrari. So I still stand by it’s not a bad Ferrari, it’s just not the Ferrari you’d expect.

flat_plane_eddie · Apr 21, 2019

Fireman1291 said: ↑

I couldn't agree more, this car is so damn ugly, fast, and quick handling, I jumped on it like a live grenade so nobody else has to experience it firsthand.
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I don't want to piss on anyone's parade. Looks are subjective but the general consensus is that the California isn't really a looker and the market shows that. I'm happy you like your car and I hope you enjoy it. You've selected a few good angles of your car and it looks great. Here's the angle that kills the California for me.

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tomc · Apr 21, 2019

flat_plane_eddie said: ↑

I don't want to piss on anyone's parade. Looks are subjective but the general consensus is that the California isn't really a looker and the market shows that. I'm happy you like your car and I hope you enjoy it. You've selected a few good angles of your car and it looks great. Here's the angle that kills the California for me.

View attachment 2696091
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Are you referring to second hand market? It is my understanding that the California was Ferrari's best seller of all time.
T

flat_plane_eddie · Apr 21, 2019

tomc said: ↑

Are you referring to second hand market? It is my understanding that the California was Ferrari's best seller of all time.
T
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Yes, the second hand market. I think the California T rectified the looks department but I personally like the na engine more.

paulchua · Apr 21, 2019

OmbryAmbry said: ↑

I'm not talking about the "it's the woman's Ferrari" or "it's ugly" or "fake exhaust tips". That's understandable.

But as I've been looking at them for myself and doing research I keep coming across the same opinion: the original California (non T) is not a good car to drive. The Handling Speciale addresses this to a degree but the car didn't "come together" until it was turbocharged.

Is it simply a "it's a GT instead of a sports car" or were there some quirks with its character that should be taken into consideration?
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The premise of your question is false.

You said you understand three things that you seem to feel are invalidating components, and I do not.

What does "It's a women's Ferrari" really mean today if not just misogynistic bravado?

You mean the Kardashians required specialized training to drive say a 458 but if it's a California, no?

Is it ugly? Get used to it if you drive an exotic. Just peruse any number of car threads, and you'll find no shortage of criticism of any Ferrari aesthetics. Just like any beautiful actress will have her share of detractors from the locker room to an army barracks. Something tells me though that if said actress magically asked for one of the naysayers on a 'date', their tune changes..hmmm?

While I do agree with you that 'tips' are unnecessary, in the long list of styling faux pas, it is on the lower end of the scale and doesn't invalidate the rest of the car as a whole. If it really bothers you, easy to rectify.

What is objective truth is this:

It performs well, it has a sweet exhaust note, and it provides a level of comfort and practicality that is prized by many.

All that matters is if you like it.

anunakki · Apr 21, 2019

I just sold my 2010 California. Amazing car. Did everything well and easily used as a DD. Nothing ever broke in 33k miles. Just regular services.

Fireman1291 · Apr 21, 2019

The tips are fake? Why, because the exhaust outlet is inside of it instead of welded to it? They did it for sound resonance and ease of color changes I'm sure. The sport exhaust on mine is easily seen if you look into the tip, its inside the tip a couple of inches. Hardly fake. Now If there was 2 outlets and 4 tips then yes, but thats not the case.

Bradley C · Apr 21, 2019

Bradley C said: ↑

Some people say that the California is not a "real" Ferrari because it's a front-engine V-8 with a "mere" 453 HP. People who say that either can't afford a Ferrari in the first place, or they've never driven one.

I had bought a 911 S Cab, but wasn't happy with it. Granted, I loved looking at it: the curves turned me on big time, but driving it was another story. I felt like I was driving a go-cart because it seemed really small when I was driving it, perhaps like driving a small roadster. What I really wanted was a convertible GT. Getting in and out of the Porsche was not very flattering for this old guy (54 yo) and my wife. And whenever we drove over a bump, my better half would complain that she just lost a kidney.

I knew I wanted to trade up to a California, and thought it would be prudent of me to test drive one before buying one. So I made an appointment with my local Ferrari/Maserati dealer to do a test drive. I first test drove a beautiful, brand new GranTurismo convertible. It was very comfortable, and there was plenty of room in the back seats. When I switched the car over to Sport mode, the exhaust note was almost obnoxiously loud -- if there is such a thing -- which I kind of liked. It was a great car, liked it a lot, and could visualize myself driving one.

Then I test drove a California, and I immediately connected with the car on another level. More than just really liking the car, I loved the car and the way I felt driving the car. The front was shorter than the Maserati, making it feel and drive more like a true sports car, and the car seemed to handle more like one too. It was like I took my 911 S Cab and converted it into a bigger, faster, more comfortable version. The only drawback was that when I put the manettino switch into Sport mode, the exhaust note barely changed, if at all.

My advice to all California nay sayers is: take it out for a test drive and then tell me what you think. I loved it, bought one.

Now consider this: if you're anything like me, the word "Ferrari" has a special meaning somewhere inside. I suppose I've wanted one ever since I was a kid, yet as I grew older and had a family, that feeling must have faded away into my subconscious. Besides liking the California better than the GranTurismo, owning a Ferrari would be like making a dream come true. If I had bought the Maserati, I'd be second guessing myself saying I should have bought the Ferrari, because that's what I really wanted, even though I didn't know it at the time.

Also, spec-wise, the California has a hardtop convertible (which I like), weighs about 500 lbs less, is about a foot shorter, and a full second faster (0-60 in 3.9 seconds vs 4.9 seconds for the GranTurismo), not to mention costing about $100K more when purchased new. You can buy a new Maserati right off the showroom floor, yet all Ferraris are made to order.

Everything pointed toward buying the California, which I did, and loved while I had it. There aren't a lot of Ferraris where I live, so wherever we go, we get comments on it, even people shouting things to us as we drive by them. I didn't get that with the Porsche, and I don't think I would have gotten that as much with the Maserati.

A year later I traded up to a Cali T. And in a couple of years, maybe I'll trade up to a Portofino. I love being a Ferrari owner. I guess I'm hooked.

The exhaust note on the Cali T doesn't sound quite as loud as the California due to the turbo, but it still sounds decent. Someone in this thread mentioned that the best version is the 2013/14 model years, naturally aspirated with the extra 30 HP over the previous years. That may very well be true, don't know because I never drove one, but since my wife and I may want to someday trade up to the Portofino, the Cali T made more sense for us. Even though it's basically the same model as the previous iterations, the Cali T seems to have its own, separate identity.

When I tell people about the absurdity that some people feel that the California is not a "real" Ferrari, they shake their heads in disbelief, envying the beautiful exotic sports car with the Ferrari badge in front of them. I explain that the Porsche 911 S Cab with PDK and sports chronograph hit 0-60 in 4.2 seconds, the California in 3.9 seconds, and the Cali T in 3.6 seconds. No one cares that it's a front-engine V8: 3.9 seconds debunks all doubters. Like I said, it's a full second faster than the GranTurismo. And if it were twenty years ago, 3.9 seconds would have made it one of the fastest cars on the planet.

Don't listen to the noise, follow your heart. Believe me, it's a "real" Ferrari. Good luck.
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Bradley C said: ↑

Some people say that the California is not a "real" Ferrari because it's a front-engine V-8 with a "mere" 453 HP. People who say that either can't afford a Ferrari in the first place, or they've never driven one.

I had bought a 911 S Cab, but wasn't happy with it. Granted, I loved looking at it: the curves turned me on big time, but driving it was another story. I felt like I was driving a go-cart because it seemed really small when I was driving it, perhaps like driving a small roadster. What I really wanted was a convertible GT. Getting in and out of the Porsche was not very flattering for this old guy (54 yo) and my wife. And whenever we drove over a bump, my better half would complain that she just lost a kidney.

I knew I wanted to trade up to a California, and thought it would be prudent of me to test drive one before buying one. So I made an appointment with my local Ferrari/Maserati dealer to do a test drive. I first test drove a beautiful, brand new GranTurismo convertible. It was very comfortable, and there was plenty of room in the back seats. When I switched the car over to Sport mode, the exhaust note was almost obnoxiously loud -- if there is such a thing -- which I kind of liked. It was a great car, liked it a lot, and could visualize myself driving one.

Then I test drove a California, and I immediately connected with the car on another level. More than just really liking the car, I loved the car and the way I felt driving the car. The front was shorter than the Maserati, making it feel and drive more like a true sports car, and the car seemed to handle more like one too. It was like I took my 911 S Cab and converted it into a bigger, faster, more comfortable version. The only drawback was that when I put the manettino switch into Sport mode, the exhaust note barely changed, if at all.

My advice to all California nay sayers is: take it out for a test drive and then tell me what you think. I loved it, bought one.

Now consider this: if you're anything like me, the word "Ferrari" has a special meaning somewhere inside. I suppose I've wanted one ever since I was a kid, yet as I grew older and had a family, that feeling must have faded away into my subconscious. Besides liking the California better than the GranTurismo, owning a Ferrari would be like making a dream come true. If I had bought the Maserati, I'd be second guessing myself saying I should have bought the Ferrari, because that's what I really wanted, even though I didn't know it at the time.

Also, spec-wise, the California has a hardtop convertible (which I like), weighs about 500 lbs less, is about a foot shorter, and a full second faster (0-60 in 3.9 seconds vs 4.9 seconds for the GranTurismo), not to mention costing about $100K more when purchased new. You can buy a new Maserati right off the showroom floor, yet all Ferraris are made to order.

Everything pointed toward buying the California, which I did, and loved while I had it. There aren't a lot of Ferraris where I live, so wherever we go, we get comments on it, even people shouting things to us as we drive by them. I didn't get that with the Porsche, and I don't think I would have gotten that as much with the Maserati.

A year later I traded up to a Cali T. And in a couple of years, maybe I'll trade up to a Portofino. I love being a Ferrari owner. I guess I'm hooked.

The exhaust note on the Cali T doesn't sound quite as loud as the California due to the turbo, but it still sounds decent. Someone in this thread mentioned that the best version is the 2013/14 model years, naturally aspirated with the extra 30 HP over the previous years. That may very well be true, don't know because I never drove one, but since my wife and I may want to someday trade up to the Portofino, the Cali T made more sense for us. Even though it's basically the same model as the previous iterations, the Cali T seems to have its own, separate identity.

When I tell people about the absurdity that some people feel that the California is not a "real" Ferrari, they shake their heads in disbelief, envying the beautiful exotic sports car with the Ferrari badge in front of them. I explain that the Porsche 911 S Cab with PDK and sports chronograph hit 0-60 in 4.2 seconds, the California in 3.9 seconds, and the Cali T in 3.6 seconds. No one cares that it's a front-engine V8: 3.9 seconds debunks all doubters. Like I said, it's a full second faster than the GranTurismo. And if it were twenty years ago, 3.9 seconds would have made it one of the fastest cars on the planet.

Don't listen to the noise, follow your heart. Believe me, it's a "real" Ferrari. Good luck.
Click to expand...

Bradley C said: ↑

Some people say that the California is not a "real" Ferrari because it's a front-engine V-8 with a "mere" 453 HP. People who say that either can't afford a Ferrari in the first place, or they've never driven one.

I had bought a 911 S Cab, but wasn't happy with it. Granted, I loved looking at it: the curves turned me on big time, but driving it was another story. I felt like I was driving a go-cart because it seemed really small when I was driving it, perhaps like driving a small roadster. What I really wanted was a convertible GT. Getting in and out of the Porsche was not very flattering for this old guy (54 yo) and my wife. And whenever we drove over a bump, my better half would complain that she just lost a kidney.

I knew I wanted to trade up to a California, and thought it would be prudent of me to test drive one before buying one. So I made an appointment with my local Ferrari/Maserati dealer to do a test drive. I first test drove a beautiful, brand new GranTurismo convertible. It was very comfortable, and there was plenty of room in the back seats. When I switched the car over to Sport mode, the exhaust note was almost obnoxiously loud -- if there is such a thing -- which I kind of liked. It was a great car, liked it a lot, and could visualize myself driving one.

Then I test drove a California, and I immediately connected with the car on another level. More than just really liking the car, I loved the car and the way I felt driving the car. The front was shorter than the Maserati, making it feel and drive more like a true sports car, and the car seemed to handle more like one too. It was like I took my 911 S Cab and converted it into a bigger, faster, more comfortable version. The only drawback was that when I put the manettino switch into Sport mode, the exhaust note barely changed, if at all.

My advice to all California nay sayers is: take it out for a test drive and then tell me what you think. I loved it, bought one.

Now consider this: if you're anything like me, the word "Ferrari" has a special meaning somewhere inside. I suppose I've wanted one ever since I was a kid, yet as I grew older and had a family, that feeling must have faded away into my subconscious. Besides liking the California better than the GranTurismo, owning a Ferrari would be like making a dream come true. If I had bought the Maserati, I'd be second guessing myself saying I should have bought the Ferrari, because that's what I really wanted, even though I didn't know it at the time.

Also, spec-wise, the California has a hardtop convertible (which I like), weighs about 500 lbs less, is about a foot shorter, and a full second faster (0-60 in 3.9 seconds vs 4.9 seconds for the GranTurismo), not to mention costing about $100K more when purchased new. You can buy a new Maserati right off the showroom floor, yet all Ferraris are made to order.

Everything pointed toward buying the California, which I did, and loved while I had it. There aren't a lot of Ferraris where I live, so wherever we go, we get comments on it, even people shouting things to us as we drive by them. I didn't get that with the Porsche, and I don't think I would have gotten that as much with the Maserati.

A year later I traded up to a Cali T. And in a couple of years, maybe I'll trade up to a Portofino. I love being a Ferrari owner. I guess I'm hooked.

The exhaust note on the Cali T doesn't sound quite as loud as the California due to the turbo, but it still sounds decent. Someone in this thread mentioned that the best version is the 2013/14 model years, naturally aspirated with the extra 30 HP over the previous years. That may very well be true, don't know because I never drove one, but since my wife and I may want to someday trade up to the Portofino, the Cali T made more sense for us. Even though it's basically the same model as the previous iterations, the Cali T seems to have its own, separate identity.

When I tell people about the absurdity that some people feel that the California is not a "real" Ferrari, they shake their heads in disbelief, envying the beautiful exotic sports car with the Ferrari badge in front of them. I explain that the Porsche 911 S Cab with PDK and sports chronograph hit 0-60 in 4.2 seconds, the California in 3.9 seconds, and the Cali T in 3.6 seconds. No one cares that it's a front-engine V8: 3.9 seconds debunks all doubters. Like I said, it's a full second faster than the GranTurismo. And if it were twenty years ago, 3.9 seconds would have made it one of the fastest cars on the planet.

Don't listen to the noise, follow your heart. Believe me, it's a "real" Ferrari. Good luck.
Click to expand...

Cali T, Bianco Avus over Blu Sterling. Completely blue interior (no black) even on the back of the seats with matching calipers. My wife and I love the color combo. Out of about 400 Californias for sale, only 1% have a blue interior.
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paulchua · Apr 21, 2019

Fireman1291 said: ↑

The tips are fake? Why, because the exhaust outlet is inside of it instead of welded to it? They did it for sound resonance and ease of color changes I'm sure. The sport exhaust on mine is easily seen if you look into the tip, its inside the tip a couple of inches. Hardly fake. Now If there was 2 outlets and 4 tips then yes, but thats not the case.
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Agreed.

Not sure if it is for sound resonance, or color - so awesome if that is the case.

I personally like integrated tips, but for the car that does have extra tips, it and I see it very low on the list of faux accouterments, and most importantly, easily remedied if it bothers you that much.

azlin75 · Apr 22, 2019

The exaust tips aren’t attached on the 458 either if I recall don’t know why could be sound resonance as is speculated I just thought it was so the tip didn’t become discolored from heat.

rob lay · Apr 22, 2019

I first thought the California was ugly. I thought the F12 was a stud. I noticed it took a double take for me to identify California vs. F12. I confirmed with dealer and 75% of even Ferrari people that walk through door couldn't tell the difference. I appreciated the California more with that perspective.

Fireman1291 · Apr 22, 2019

rob lay said: ↑

I first thought the California was ugly. I thought the F12 was a stud. I noticed it took a double take for me to identify California vs. F12. I confirmed with dealer and 75% of even Ferrari people that walk through door couldn't tell the difference. I appreciated the California more with that perspective.
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I can appreciate that. Strangley enough I prefer the first Cali/Cali30 to the Cali T, I believe it will age better over time. It has very sexy lines and is more of a theatrical experience with exhaust and lowered. BAM goes the shifts! Good fun.

BOOMER7 · Apr 23, 2019

OmbryAmbry said: ↑

Just read the Clarkson review of the 30. While it is equipped with HS, his only complaint was (to paraphrase) "it's a great car that you don't want to drive because going to the store isn't worth the occasion".

I haven't test driven one to find out myself. We were considering a GranTurismo but my better half feels that the interior is just way too old (though I prefer the larger back seats but...) The GT is a great driving car, so if the California is anywhere close to it then I wouldn't have a problem. I haven't bothered for a test drive since I'm not committed enough to waste anyone's time.
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The newer GranThrismo 2013+ had much better interior at least the MC vesrsion
I actually prefer the looks of the GT over the CalI. The Cali is a better car overall than the GT.

4th_gear · Apr 23, 2019

The original Cali/Cali30 employ the traditional Ferrari looks and design cues from the 599 and older V12 cars. The CaliT takes its design cues from the F12... and so on.

Personally-speaking, I prefer the older design cues as they are more uniquely Ferrari and Pininfarina, whereas the newer design themes are not and have connections with other contemporary car brands. The newer cars lost some of the unique Ferrari look and feel, as they follow modern design cues that everyone else are also following. There illustrates an advantage to using iconic retro design that a brand owns because if it does it, it is nostalgic and romantic; if other people copy someone else's retro design, it looks tacky. To create a look that ages well means you are perceived to own the look, hence authenticity. It helps that it is also iconic and the look be perceived to have already taken and held its place for a long time, without anyone else being able to copy it or dilute it.

IMO, a good design looks more interesting as you familiarize yourself with it. When it is based on earlier designs, you will notice and appreciate those details only with time, unless you also have a great deal design experience with those older models. A design that immediately says everything it has to say is not as interesting to live with. It's like seeing intriguing similarities between members of your immediate family with those of celebrated patriarchs or matriarchs in your family tree.

crinoid · Apr 23, 2019

rob lay said: ↑

I first thought the California was ugly. I thought the F12 was a stud. I noticed it took a double take for me to identify California vs. F12. I confirmed with dealer and 75% of even Ferrari people that walk through door couldn't tell the difference. I appreciated the California more with that perspective.
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The Cali T is an underrated beauty of design. I genuinely believe time will show it to age gracefully and be a classic.

azlin75 · Apr 23, 2019

And in my humble opinion the California T has the superior interior. If I could have a car with the early California exterior minus the stacked exaust and that had the California T interior and better DCT it would be the perfect car for me.

anunakki · Apr 23, 2019

As far as looks, which are subjective, Ive always felt the front end of the First Gen California was the best of the bunch. Lots of 60s styling cues in it which I dig.

The rear however, is a travesty. There is nothing appealing about the rear end of the First Gen California.

The Cali T fixed most of the design problems on the rear end, and the side profile vent, BUT screwed up the front end.

Just my $.02

Bandit23 · Apr 23, 2019

to the OP of this thread, test drive a Pre Cali-T if you can -
California models...now it is a few years old and perhaps slightly dated -but they are very good cars for daily use.
will they get you attention --arghh not really, you might get a look here and there but certainly not the attention from the race-bred 458s/488s etc.

If you are look for a comfortable GT ...and the Ferrari badge this is the car to have...
The Cali-T is definite refinement as is with all newer models- and PT will be an upgrade on the Cali-T.

I suggest you take California for a ride and then make your decision. Perhaps it lacks all the Ferrari exotic looks, but in my opinion from my Ferrari experience it has the last of the roughed, unpolished F430 feel to it whilst driving ....
Cali-T onwards Ferrari made serious improvements to compete in GT category with SLs, Aston etc.

Anyway my $.10

LamboGuyGetsRari · Apr 23, 2019

get a hamman kit on a cali, and wheels, everything changes

cls · Apr 23, 2019

LamboGuyGetsRari said: ↑

get a hamman kit on a cali, and wheels, everything changes
Click to expand...

Other may disagree, but IMO not for the better:
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Fireman1291 · Apr 23, 2019

azlin75 said: ↑

And in my humble opinion the California T has the superior interior. If I could have a car with the early California exterior minus the stacked exaust and that had the California T interior and better DCT it would be the perfect car for me.
Click to expand...

At high speeds, air pressure can build in the wheelwells, creating lift, which is not a good thing. Ferrari's solution to this was to put a vent in the back of the wheelwell to expel that pressure, eliminating the possibility of the car's rear end getting light while playing in the triple-digit zone. The traditional side-by-side design did not work as well at relieving that pressure buildup. ~Motortrend

azlin75 · Apr 23, 2019

I didn’t know that.... learn something new every day. But from my personal visual taste the stacked exaust doesn’t look as good but if your inside the car you can’t see it anyway. I’d rather have safety over aesthetics any day.

4th_gear · Apr 24, 2019

IMO, side-by-side double exhaust tips is an UNREMARKABLE conventional layout - everyone in the car industry has used that on one occasion or another, for far too long already. It's boring. Much more expensive and more recent designs like the ones on my 675LT and the 458 Speciale, 488 GTB no longer use that layout because it IS boring. Those cars use a pair of larger single tips mounted closer to the centre. Similar ideas are employed with the Porsche 911 RS cars,.

The stacked twin exhaust tip layout on the NA Cali is quite unique and IMO the best implemented version of this layout. People who are after a conventional look often don't understand the design but stacked tips present a much more aggressive and interesting side view of 2 exhaust tips, instead of 1, like on many very conventional cars.

As for the rear of the Calis. Many people got brainwashed by low-IQ journos who spend less time thinking than flapping their lips in self-promotional videos. ALL good-looking muscle cars have large rear haunches and the need to stow metal roof panels while still providing trunk space also means you don't do away with the muscle-car haunches. Journos say stupid things. You can check for yourself in the photo comparisons of standard Calis I have attached below.

If you look, you can tell the rear lip of the CaliT is actually sloping down too much. The higher, more abrupt transition of the horizontal to vertical surfaces on the older Cali trunk lid increases the effects of a Kamm tail aerodynamic effect. The more tear-drop shape of the CaliT reduces turbulence which is great if you want to be a super quiet submarine but for improved traction on a performance car, this reduces downforce. It's the turbulence which enhances the air pressure differential needed to accentuate the upside-down air foil downforce effect of a Kamm tail.

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tomc · Apr 24, 2019

Bradley C said: ↑

Cali T, Bianco Avus over Blu Sterling. Completely blue interior (no black) even on the back of the seats with matching calipers. My wife and I love the color combo. Out of about 400 Californias for sale, only 1% have a blue interior.
View attachment 2696263 View attachment 2696264 View attachment 2696265 View attachment 2696266 View attachment 2696267
Click to expand...

Man, Bradley, that is sharper than a tack! Gorgeous ride.
T

LamboGuyGetsRari · Apr 24, 2019

4th_gear said: ↑

IMO, side-by-side double exhaust tips is an UNREMARKABLE conventional layout - everyone in the car industry has used that on one occasion or another, for far too long already. It's boring. Much more expensive and more recent designs like the ones on my 675LT and the 458 Speciale, 488 GTB no longer use that layout because it IS boring. Those cars use a pair of larger single tips mounted closer to the centre. Similar ideas are employed with the Porsche 911 RS cars,.

The stacked twin exhaust tip layout on the NA Cali is quite unique and IMO the best implemented version of this layout. People who are after a conventional look often don't understand the design but stacked tips present a much more aggressive and interesting side view of 2 exhaust tips, instead of 1, like on many very conventional cars.

As for the rear of the Calis. Many people got brainwashed by low-IQ journos who spend less time thinking than flapping their lips in self-promotional videos. ALL good-looking muscle cars have large rear haunches and the need to stow metal roof panels while still providing trunk space also means you don't do away with the muscle-car haunches. Journos say stupid things. You can check for yourself in the photo comparisons of standard Calis I have attached below.

If you look, you can tell the rear lip of the CaliT is actually sloping down too much. The higher, more abrupt transition of the horizontal to vertical surfaces on the older Cali trunk lid increases the effects of a Kamm tail aerodynamic effect. The more tear-drop shape of the CaliT reduces turbulence which is great if you want to be a super quiet submarine but for improved traction on a performance car, this reduces downforce. It's the turbulence which enhances the air pressure differential needed to accentuate the upside-down air foil downforce effect of a Kamm tail.

Click to expand...

totally agree. the stacked exhaust on the cali is the best thing about it. I think its the rear indicators that could use help

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Why is the (pre T) California considered bad?

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