Why No Ferrari Production Mid-Engine 12 Cylinder

No problem, I really liked the range of opinions and responses in this thread. FerrariChat is a perfect example of the purpose of opinions - to generate discussion. Unfortunately in todays climate, we must be reminded that diverse thoughts are a good thing. We receive far too much opinion in our everyday "news" and it usually comes from only one author or source. Questions like these help us remember how great it is to interact with others, like-minded or not.

 

as the owner of a 512bbi and a 512tr, i am rather pleased that they are not, and will not, build any more mid engined v12's !

it also served me well when i bought the 512tr from the dealer in rome - i had always wanted one, and when i walked in there in 2000 he had several for sale. i inquired and he just shrugged and said pick one, i picked the colors i liked, he named a price, i countered with what i thought was a completely ludicrous offer, and he booked me - provided i would rid him of it before the weekend !

 

I would love a mid engined v12 that wasn’t a halo/hyper car.
I mean no offence to anyone, but I have a hard time getting excited about front engine Ferrari’s. There’s just something about moving the engine to the back that makes it more “exotic” for me.

 

When they had the testarossa they had no real GT car. Now they do. Now limited production super cars seem to be reserved for v12’s. I think it was smart and spread the line out to offer more options. Would be pretty cool to see a v10 mid engine but I think those days are over in favor of small displacement turbos\kers. Get ready for an suv too. You are witnessesing anaylitics and profits trumping passion within Ferrari. It’s working for them big time.

 

Interesting question. I wondered the same after test-driving a 1984 512 BBi last year.

I suspect it may have at least something to do with the handbuilt nature of the V12 engines - each of which requires one of six master techs (and an apprentice) about 8-10 hours to build. These limited number of V12’s are needed in the 812S, GTC4 Lusso, and LaF / LaF Aperta. It might not make sense to produce a “reasonably”-priced (sub $1M) rear mid-engined car that could parasitize 488 demand when the V8 TT’s are easier to produce in greater volumes. I think the relative shortage of V12’s is also one reason the Lusso V8TT was introduced.

Plus, as others have stated, the front mid-engined V12’s have closed the gap on handling & performance while offering significantly more practicality and easier packaging. Also, the current strategy reserves the rear mid-engined V12 layout for the halo hypercars which can be priced much higher.

Seems like smart product management. Having said that, I’d absolutely buy a modern 512 BBi or TR if they made one.


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One thing is sure IMO. Having 3 front mid-engine cars and only 1 rear mid-engine model in the production portfolio seems rather unbalanced.

 

Awesome. That's a perspective I never considered. If Ferrari is going to go over 10K units per year, they might as well add a rear-mid V/Boxer line that is a twelve cylinder car.

 

Another aspect to keep in mind is the upcoming FUV and its impact on the Lusso. Will the Lusso line still have a place in the portfolio next to an FUV? To be honest I have my concerns. However without the Lusso only the 812 will remain to make use of the V12 (except for some units in the halo car). Is that enough to be profitable? I think they have to use an engine at least in two production models. So in theory a rear mid-engine V12 could be the solution.

 

This answers the OPs question. But, the big thing is . . . . been there, done that.

 

Pretty sure the FUV will replace most of the FF/Lusso line, except for the V12's. No V12 for the FUV, so the AWD V12 2+2 FF/Lussos may be the last of that breed.

I've loved 2+2 Ferraris since the 365GTC/4 2+2. My first Ferrari was a 456M GTa, because I love that classic look and feel.

 

I love Ferrari 2+2’s as well, including the 456M. We owned a 612 OTO before the FF. My wife drives a Levante S because she prefers a taller driving position, but crossovers and SUV’s don’t appeal to me. I don’t blame Ferrari for making a “SUV” (taller 4-door Lusso), but I hope it’s not instead of the GTC4 Lusso range.


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This would require the V12 to be about 4 litres and mounted transversely (ala Muira).

 

Why is that?

Didn't someone on here have a v12 458 that was a development car that Ferrari sold them?

So the current v12 can be packaged into the existing mid engined v8 platform.......

Regards Michael



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Back in the days the V12 was a way to increase power by reducing the capacity of each cylinder (which increased the engine efficiency when using carburettors for fuel injection).
With modern technology (high pressure injection, and ultimately turbocharging), there is no power benefit for a higher number of cylinders; it's only about smoothness and nobility now, unfortunately. And on the other hand, there is a weight penalty.
The mid-rear engine layout makes sense for sportier models, and unfortunately V12 (or flat 12) pushes in the opposite direction because of the weight penalty. Going for mid-front engine layout for the V12 was a way to acknowledge that, the V12 cars claiming a more "GT" orientation now (which does not mean they are not fantastic cars).

 

Here is a pic of a V12 458 longditudanly placed and built by the factory

Regards Michael
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subscribed, this seems like a very interesting thread

 

I have pondered the this question as well. I wish F would make a reasonably priced V12 like the Aventador. Since they don't and we have 2 V8 F models, we will probably get an Aventador next.

 

The V12 engine is too long, and this makes the rear of the car out of proportion to the rest of the car.

 

I prefer 12's in the front, 8's in the back, but my first Ferrari loves were the 365GTB/4 Daytona and 365GTC/4 2+2. The Dino was #3 behind them.

That said, I'd pay a lot of money just do do a couple of laps in that V12 458 (It's not a 458 then though, right?

 

If you look at the posts above you will see that the v12 can be fitted in the v8 platform no extra length.....


Regards Michael

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Eliminate "because Heritage" from the reasons Ferrari should develop a new mid-engine v12, and it's difficult for me to find any other reason.

What is the modern V12 going to offer a driver that the modern V8 doesn't? More weight, more fuel consumption, bigger car, reduced handling, reduced storage, increased cost. It's not 1986 anymore. The 488 performance eclipses any non-hyper car V12 Ferrari ever made. Ferrari likely would not make a mass-produced V12 today, because there's simply no point nor real benefit.

As ugly and non-heritage as the Ferrari Station Wagon is, at least it offers a real, practical purpose.