Will the 12 Cilindri really be the last of a long line of Ferrari V12 masterpieces?

There's just no chance of further V12 enhancement, Ferrari publicly quit that business with the firing of Michael Leiters and no one replaced him (only a 'project manager' Fulgenzi), and I also think there will be no further Icona featuring a V12, however, if there is, it will also use the same engine as either the 812VS or SP3.

To get the current V12 to 10,000 rpm is never going to happen, if they had it in them they would of not used a 3-year old engine straight from the 812VS in the "cilindri" (no masterstroke to that name, more like pranking their customer base, in contrast, the F8 Tributo was a masterful name that said it all as was the 458 Speciale, both the end of the series for their respective engines, the 'cilindri' in comparison is unremarkable and without any meaning or purpose, a joke and, to me, further evidence Ferrari does not care about the V12 in any endearing way)

 

I agree. The name is so mundanely self referential that it feels like a gas light.

I really do think it’s Ferrari saying ‘You like a 12 cylinder? Here it is. Get it while you can cuz …’

 

You speak the truth. Let’s hope Ferrari heads it. Why are Lamborghini and Aston Martin going full throttle on V12s and Ferrari pulls back from its soul.

 

It's interesting, as Ferrari's message is the V12 is the core of the brands DNA, and it's the heritage, so part of me feels like the V12 isn't going anywhere, but it's not going to be vastly improved at this point either. Perhaps it will be something only in the rare releases after the 12 Cilindri. Either way, it's will be interesting as always to see what plays out.

 

That's an easy one...John Elkann

https://www.autoblog.com/2021/08/02/ferrari-john-elkann-electric-cars/

https://sg.style.yahoo.com/finance/news/sustainable-mobility-become-central-ferrari-082735311.html

too bad the sweater is no longer around to guide the clueless:

https://www.ansa.it/english/news/business/2024/04/11/ferrari-electrification-will-be-true-to-its-heritage-elkann_6769842a-899f-43d2-801a-88da4ee0152d.html

 

Seems an intervention is needed before Elkann destroys the brand entirely. Just look how quickly Mercedes-Benz and BMW have managed to destroy themselves, in just a few years they've transformed from making a full lineup of desirable cars to hardly making a single car between the two of them that I'd pay my own money for. It doesn't take long at all to blow up a company.

Then again, I am speaking from a Western perspective. I'm sure there's almost nothing any of these companies could do that would turn away customers in India, China, etc. As long as the badge is attached, almost anything is permissible....

 

I don't know why you lumped these two together. BMW are doing better than ever, ever since their new (controversial) designs. BMW M cars aren't for you or me, they are for those who want upmarket looks and performance for less money. They have achieved that with the latest designs as opposed to their older M cars not being very distinguishable from the regular cars to the average person.

MB's newer designs look bad even to those who don't know or care about cars, and they're interiors have never been cheaper with plastics everywhere, even on the premium models like the S and G class. They are truly on a downward spiral. Everyone just seems to forget about MB's existence nowadays.

 

I really don’t car to have a TTv12. Hybrid fine, but no turbos.

 

The good thing is truly epic V12s are being made elsewhere and personally, I thinK leave the current Ferrari V12 in the shade:

 

Circling back to the question 'Will the 12cilindri be the last NA V-12 Ferrari?'

In certain markets 2030 will be the year that only Zero Emissions new cars are allowed to be sold.

So unless Ferrari can meet that rather slim window of opportunity--Yes the 12cylindri will be the end of the NA V-12 for certain markets

 

I would think Ferrari will still be building V12 engines for street cars in 2030. It's just too important to the brand. Maybe it will be a small %, but it will exist. JMHO.

 

I share the same sentiment.

 

A few differences...
Ferrari sacrifices its goals on uniformity of design, lowest common denominator, Ferrari has no interest in engine/emissions variations depending on the consumption market, it is that way to save costs, it is more expensive to target different markets with variations.

I do not closely follow Ferrari's V8 development, but, it looks like maybe that team has been disbanded/re-purposed to V6 development, the SF90 XX thernal engine only has +17hp over the 5 year old SF90, and that's probably just tweaking of the ECU and nothing really internal to the engine.

And, adding to that, the Portofino went to 612hp in MY2021 and that's the same power as the MY2024 Roma Spider, again, Ferrari is coasting on its laurels...

Seems the only V6 engine team remains actively working at Ferrari...499P, new hypercar, etc

Ok, that said, the new Temerario (Huracan successor) engine is a clean sheet design, probably been in development for the past 5 years, but, it only has 789hp vs 786hp for the SF90XX, I say "so what", other than the 'additional revs' that enhance emotion (in GPF-free designs), it makes no more power...actually less, the Ferrari has 593ft/lb torque vs 538ft/lb for the Temerario

So, really, the 'biggest issue' is this new Temerario engine is a flat-plane crank, so, will it sound like a Ferrari??? That would be pretty terrible for the Lamborghini fans! But, Corvette already did that so why not, right? Poke fun at Ferrari for abandoning its best V8 and forcing GPF everywhere even where not required by regulation.

And, recall Ferrari produces a single drivetrain per model, no variations, so, all will have GPF...and EU 'noise regulations' taking the shriek away..so, 6000RPM sounds like 10,000 RPM as all those higher shrill notes of 10,000+ RPM simply never arrive at your ears, at least outside the cabin (refer to Ferrari hot-tubes for in-cabin auditory enhancement)....

Lamborghini, will not have GPF and EU muzzled emissions for non-EU markets...so, in that sense, 10,000 rpm is definitely going to make an impact unlike what Ferrari will do...

So, in summary, Lamborghini essentially copied the SF90XX 4L engine, GDI (gasoline direct injection), flat-plane crank, similar horsepower...so, if Ferrari decides to enhance its V8 (doubtful, but, hey, there's always tomorrow) I am sure it will move the game up a few levels...

Ferrari seems to be on this V6 kick and it is the 296 that compares to the Temerario, so I am sure Ferrari has a lot more potential in that 2.9L block, including increasing the RPM..but, GPF/EU noise regs spoil the sounds, so, do not count on that happening...just no point unless needed to raise thermal engine power...but, may not matter either..electric motors, bah!

 

Same here. I was glad Huracan replacement was hybrid as I have a STO, until I read the replacement rev at 10k. WTF!

 

There are plenty of hardware changes.

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I don't know how this rumour started, but it's simply not true.


Regarding the new Lamborghini, let's reserve judgement till it's out.

 

I am a very proud 812 GTS owner and absolutely love it! I have been told that I will be offered an allotment for a 12Cilindi Spider when the VIP's have been accommodated. The base price of the final examples of the 812 GTS was $466K. I have seen several examples of the 12Cilindri in person and have not been stimulated to write a huge check. The situation is further complicated by a "pending" ?25% tariff on imports from Europe. That tariff would would definitely prevent me from going through with the purchase of a vehicle without significant performance improvements over an 812 GTS and which is not a limited production vehicle. I would rather invest in an extended warranty on my 812 GTS before it expires! I have driven both the 812 Comp and the 812 Comp A. IMO the performance difference can be only be truly appreciated on the track. These limited production examples were a great investment if purchased at MSRP!!! On the other hand , I wonder what my return on investment would be if I paid $3.5M for a GTS Comp A whose MSRP was $900K -$1M. I am feeling better about my 812 GTS every day!

 

Ferrari would love to make V12s forever but Europe regulation is a mess.

After 12Ci: I am thinking v12 + some sort of hybrid. There is no other way. Hybrid is here to stay.
On the other hand full EV: that's a different story. There is no way any country will be ready for full EV in 2030/2035. Most likely 2050 and beyond.

 

USA has tossed out all planned regulations on gas mileage, sound, pollution, etc. which were already insignificant compared to EU. If Ferrari wanted to sell NA V12's, this market would support it no problem. The deciding factor is not tech or regulations. It's more the nature of the company.

 

Yup, thanks to Trump: regulations out the window.
But European manufacturers won't make cars for few countries or only for US (e.g., v12 NA). Way more expensive for them.

 

I for one would welcome greater allocations of NA V8 and V12 ICE in the USA market!

Delete GPF.

And no insane and unattainable mileage standards which lead to the early demise of the bearings and engine.

Even non sports cars are experiencing early engine failure due to these crazy standards.

We can also get rid of the 1 page single spaced essay screen which one has to dismiss every time we start the car.

Also don’t sew the ugly airbag warnings seen into the leather interior on the visor or other places. How rude!

I’ve got a much better place to put all of these regulations

In a paper envelope in the glove box.

And allow me to set the Start Stop mode to default OFF. If I’m stuck in traffic I will decide if I should use it.


I’d like to see some standards place on all electric vehicles

Weight limitations

Batteries which don’t catch on fire and if they do are easy to extinguish the fire

Greater electrical efficient for charging
Only allow charging once every ten days.
Next only once a month

And battery weight of no more than 60 pounds

Able to be charged using a standard wall socket in about an hour.

And then let’s have tons of warning stickers on every length of electrical
Cable in the vehicle

And then there needs to be warning stickers about EMf dangers