Window Motor replacement pictorials?

Check the archives. I think there's a discussion on that very subject. In the short run there's a crank that can be used to wind the window up.

There's several problems with old 308 windows. 1. The electrics go out. Starting with the switches, they get old and corroded. Clean them out and that may help. 2. The grease on the window mechanisms get old and cruddy. take the door panel off and clean them. Re grease them and try it out. At the time you can test the motor with a set of leads. Also check out the wire for the cranking system. If they're worn, then you may as well replace them. 3. The window groves that allow it to stay in place when you're moving it up and down may get worn. Check them out and see if your window is getting caught on them. 4. your fuse panel may be the cause of your problems. Birdman has a fuse panel that is suppose to work great.

By this time, you'll be an expert on 308 window cranking mechanisms and will be able to show the rest of us how to fix windows. ( g r i n )

I plan to do this to my windows this summer.

Good luck.

Bob Wassam

 

Pull out the window switch. It just pops into the hole, so use some benign object and carefully push it up from both ends. There are 5 wires, and six connections. Two are the actual motor leads. These could be either yellow with a black stripe, or grey. The two yellow wires are the power leads. Black is ground. Using jumpers from a battery, or a battery charger, connect the leads from the motor briefly to see if it wants to go. Make brief intermittant contacts and you should see it either move, draw power and not move, or do nothing. My guess is it wants to go. Reversing the wires polarity from + to - will reverse the motor.

I just spent the last three days swapping passenger doors. After its all said and done, I should have probably just left well enough alone. It really is a hand built car, as the other door will never line up right without serious body work. Later I will probably fix up the correct door and put it back on. I have had both window winder mechanisms out and played with the cables. After trial and error I found you need four wraps of cable on the drum. Draw a picture of the cable routing BEFORE you take it out, or you will spend time trying to remember.

I do not feel the grease in those winders is any real issue. Its heavy, but its a worm gear, that thing has a giant amount of torque, enough to warp the inner door panel when it gets to the end. I found the cable pulleys can use some lube, and the cable shoudnt be really tight unless its at either end. Running off a battey charger, it would draw about 10 amps either on the work bench doing nothing, or lifting the window. So I would assume that most of the problems associated with windows being slow, would be wiring connections as many others have explained over the years.

If I take it apart again, I will route the ground wire from inside the door, out with the other wires and ground to the chassis directly. As it is now, they ground inside the door and power would have to pass through greasy and or rusty door hinges.

 

The dedicated ground wire is really the most common answer, component failure excepted....


Man, Artvonne I wished you had called me about swapping those doors I'd have told you "forget it" and saved you three days! I have done two of them and you are correct, the openings will not match a unit from another car...the old site had a picture of the extensive lead used on the quarter panel side of the rear gap from the Factory.

Not many body shops want to mess with it......

A new repair skin I think would be the answer. Why were you swapping? Corrosion or ???? I noticed FerrariUK had a few doors in the rack, later 328s most likely.....

 

I must quibble. Every time I've cleaned the old grease out & re-lubed everything the difference in window speed was dramatic, and the voltage dropped between the battery & the window motor was also dramaticly decreased.

Spraying the channels the glass slides in with silicone also helps quite a bit.

The dedicated ground wire is a good idea tho, haven't tried it, but it can't hurt.

 

SOP at the F-car Indy garages for slow windows is the clean out all the old gummed up grease in the motor....helps alot but I have been told these windows were not breaking any speed records when the were new at the dealer...

 

Extra ground wires are always good, especially of Ferrari's, but (I may be wrong) doesn't the +/- of the window motor change with the direction of the window, causing the ground to have to go all the back to the window switch, which adds to our slow windows?

I think this guy from the 348 page is on the right track...

http://www.btinternet.com/~frazer.smith1/ferrari/ferrariwindow.html

 

I agree with Verell. Both the 308 and Mondial had grease that had dried to something between glue and cured epoxy. Cleaning it all out (scraping it mostly) and then re-lubing with lithium grease made a HUGE difference.

Birdman

 

Well, I maybe just got lucky. Both winders had grease that resembled a semi clear wheel bearing grease, only slightly thicker. One was yellowy, the other that kind of green color. Maybe its been replaced somewhere along the last 30 years? The one was obviously apart at some time as it had common screws holding it together instead of phillips screws like the other.

Regarding the question of the ground wire versus the motor wires, you are correct, the wires switch polarity. But there is only one hot lead to the switch, the polarity is reversed in the switch and the ground goes into the door, through the greasey rusty hinge pins, through the screws holding the door hinge to the chassis, past the paint, and finally to the battery. It probably grounds okay, but still.

Big T, I swapped the doors because the one had what looked like a rust hole near the key lock. It was small, but looked bad. After it was off I realised it was only a small dent that had been repaired poorly, and body filler had come out from under the paint. Kind of odd. But the doors are actually different lengths, by about a 1/8th to as much as a 1/4 inch. Also, the curve of the front of the door does not match the line in the fender. So I will repair the original door, and undo everything I did. Not only doesnt the door itself match well, even the door panels and arm rests are custom fitted.

Not to get to far off subject, but each of my doors had numbers stamped in them. The early car door was stamped 277, and the later car door was stamped 311. While both cars have manufacturing dates of March and February of '77, many peices of the car, such as engine casting marks, gearbox, or like the parking brake bracket on the rear frame, have date codes of 1976. Is it possible the doors are consecutively numbered?

Skews, just take it apart and draw pictures and write notes before you undo anything. Then put your notes and pictures in a good place where you will never find them, and spend a whole day trying to figure out how to make that cable make your window go up and down properly. It will fully enhance the ownership experience and you will be able to raise your greasy bandaid coverd thumb with pride. Many have wondered why Ferrari would use something so rediculous to raise the glass, I would remind all of you that MB used the same thing in the 300E. I doubt the whole apparatus weighs more than 2 or 3 pounds.

 

Just purchased my first Ferrari -an '81 308GTSi

Thanks
Tim Williams


Congrats on your new 81 308 GTS

 

hi paul,

I don't understand how that could work. The window motor just has a single winding...basically two wires. You have to swap 12V and ground between both to get the motor to turn one way or the other.
The window switches do that, and two wires from the switches must directly connect to the two wires on the window motor.

According to the schematic, ferrari bizarrely used the same wire color for the two wires going to each motor. For the passenger side switch, the two yellow wires on pins 1 and 5 go to the motor. The switch grounds one yellow wire, and sticks 12V on the other...swap to make the window go the other way.

The drivers side is the same, except the wires are green.

If there was no electrical connection through the door hinges, the window should still work. Other stuff like power door locks, power mirrors, or lights in the door may not, though.

If you take off the door panel and pull the two connectors to the motor, you can disconnect and jumper 12V/ground directly to the motor winding at the connectors. That'll give you the max speed of the motor to see if it's other issues. Then reconnect the motor wires and jumper 12V/ground to the switch connector pins 1&5. If the speed is much different, either there is a wire issue or there is a problem in the connector between the dash and door.

I'd have to agree that the #1 issue is dried grease, and #2 is dirty contacts in the window switches which reduce the current to the motor. The switches are pretty undersized for the current already, so additional resistance in them is a problem.