Winter storage tips

There are some in depth threads on this you might search for that have covered this in detail. Get a battery tender and leave the battery connected and drive it whenever the roads are clear. If you start it up leave it running at least 15 minutes.

 

Starting it every couple of weeks isn't doing the engine or transmission any favors.

If the engine isn't allowed to run long enough to get the oil up to operating temp you are going to do more harm than good because their won't be enough heat to burn off the condensation, to say nothing of the transmission.

Either take her out and drive her for a good 30 minutes or so, or let her sleep until Spring.

Personally, I try and find a nice rock salt free day once a month and go out for an hour or so. If I can't, no worries. 4 months of sitting with fuel stabilizer, fresh oil, and a battery tender is no big thing.

 

Yes, a number of threads about this very thing. Don't forget something to keep the rodents away. I just rousted a mouse out of my Motorcycle which is right by my F-car. I'm getting sticky mats tomorrow.

 

The advantage of living down south. We drive all year.

 

You don't need Stabil, you don't need to start it and you don't need to rotate the tyres.

Store it with a full tank of petrol, use a battery maintainer and, if you must, crank the engine a couple of times without starting it if you're worried about the timing belts taking a seat.

We're talking about short-term storage, maybe 6 months.

P.S. The problem of flat spots on tyres occurred with the old nylon corded tyres. It's not a problem with modern tyres. Also, as someone else stated, you'll do more harm than good by starting the engine every couple of weeks. Just let your car hibernate for the winter.

 

Huh?

Gasoline starts to go off pretty darn quickly. After just a couple of months, the gas in the tank is starting to deteriorate. Stabil slows the deterioration significantly. I sure as shiit wouldn't run six month old gas w/o some Stabil (or other gas preservative) through a CIS based system.

 

Cliff, you've been indoctrinated by hype.

Here's the deal; store your car for 6 months with a full tank of petrol and no Stabil and, come Spring, if your car fails to run because of the deterioration of petrol, I'll be happy to foot the bills for repair.

Documentation will be required from a reputable source, to verify that a problem was due to deterioration of petrol over a short period of time.

Documentation should also include pics and receipts of your storage procedure.

I'm serious!

Sparky

 

Ha! Thanks Sparky. You may well be right. Of course, you are right, products like Stabil need to validate themselves with some proper science, not just marketing hype. And, come to think about it, I've never seen any hard core science in support of Stabil. However, I have fired up a few cars after long 6+ month slumbers and had problems with poor fuel in FI cars where no fuel additive was used. And, on the flip side, fired up a few where an additive was used, and not had such problems. Whether it was random chance of the snake oil making a difference, I don't know for sure....am just guessing it's the snake oil.....

 

This is the best piece of advice Sparky could give, especially if you live in a cold, damp environment. Oxidation and condensate absorption are the two biggest problems with stored gas. You can alleviate (NOT eliminate) both by keeping the tank(s) full and minimizing air intrusion.

I saw test data (I think Popular Mechanics, early 90s, from a college in Maryland) where a half full 20 gal metal gas tank with a factory cap in place left outside but under a rain cover structure actually increased volume due to condensate at a rate of several ounces a week. So keeping your tank near full is just good advice even for a daily driver in cold, damp climes.

Stabil can't really hurt. But by their own admission, they only protect fresh gas for 15 months. So I'd not depend on it for really long term storage.

IMHO, I think running the car periodically to boil the condensate out of the motor and exhaust is a wise thing if you can get access to do so during the winter. But then you need to refill the tank. Running the car is also good for keeping seals wet too.

Rick

 

And by running periodically I'm sure you mean taking it out and driving it for 20 or more miles to work out all the condensation that the cold engine initially creates.

 

+1000

 

If at all possible, absolutely!
But I understand some of our brethren open their garage doors to mounds of white stuff and streets full of dark grey slush with skies to match... in which case extended runs stationary are better than nothing. (20-30 min, varying throttle, several cycles of cooling fans)

Rick

 

Here's some real data re condensation: http://www.yachtsurvey.com/myth_of_condensation_in_fuel_tanks.htm

Boat people do far more winter layup, with far more complicated systems than car people and worry about this stuff a lot more. Condensation in fuel is another one of those things that people want to sell you a fix for a problem that doesn't exist.

 

Some people recommend a fresh oil change before storagethe reasoning being that there will be less condensation and contaminants sitting in the motor. Many experts believe it is better if you can run it once a month but only if you can get it up to full operating temps which can take quite a while in a 308 in cooler temps. Otherwise it's better to just leave it.

Dave

 

The FAA would disagree with that statement... I'm sure we'll have a pilot or two chime in here. There is a reason why they have condensate traps and tank drains on the bottom of wing tanks and devices for determining water in fuel for airplanes. (water sinks in gas)

Oh, and that's not data, its calculations to substantiate a viewpoint. (the old lies, damn lies, statistics...)

And most boat people have to do winter layups because most small craft don't have closed loop cooling systems so there is no anti-freeze and their boats are in the most humid of the cold conditions.

Rick

 

I agree with this approach (and I just might use it this Winter) except, I would put in the Stabil. From bitter experience, I KNOW that my 2-cycle engine carbs will gum-up over the winter without Stabil. Of course my QV has FI, but FI has lots off small orifices and passageways too. I'll just go along with "CliffBeer" on the Stabil.

Hey,"Darolls": Want to make me that repair offer on my 2-cycle engines? "Dave's Mower Repair", Westland MI, would love the extra business, and I'm sure he would be more than happy to furnish the needed repair cost documentation. If you do take me up on this, I've also got a bridge to sell you in Brooklyn. (LOL)

 

Rick, virtually any boat with an inboard engine is just like an car engine - a coolant system with antifreeze in it and everything else. Pascoe is referring to those sort of boats, which face exactly the same conditions that a car - actually much more since there are also MANY other systems that must be winterized as well.

Re the FAA; I am not talking about airplanes and neither is Pascoe. Aircraft are exposed to dramatic, rapid, changes in temperature which CAN cause condensation. These conditions do not occur in cars/boats. Comparing the two applications is not valid. Try this test today - take a clean metal 5 gal can; put two gallons of gas in it. Leave it outside or in the garage for the winter. Open it up in the spring and see how much water is in the bottom of the can. Let us know.

I suspect it will be the same amount I found when I performed this test about 5 years ago...none. Yep, I believed the same thing then that you do now but a guy with a 12-car collection challenged me on it and suggested I prove it to myself since I didn't want to believe him. Since then I have also seen articles, like the Pascoe, addressing this issue.

Like everything else, folks should do whatever makes them feel best about storing. I no longer change oil for winter storage, or put chargers on batteries (just disconnect them), or add any fuel to whatever's in there. I have to admit I will still put some Stabil in prior to storage and run the car for 10-15 miles but that's it.

 

I just fill the tanks and put a tender on the battery. Sleeps all winter and never had a problem. A couple of months won't hurt anything. Years back I would try to run the car as often as possible. Not any more. I just don't like the cold starts. Tuff on the thing.

 

Bill Pollard is the only guy that will ever touch my car!!

 

you are correct about aircraft fuel samples is how we would check for water in the fuel, but where I come from very few pilots could tell me where ALL the sample ports are on the plane at because the Crew Chiefs are the ones taking the fuel samples haha

But the threat isnt from flying conditions our worst threat is the fuel source.

But we would take fuel samples every day long term storage on a aircraft would have dry fuel tanks.


On my 308 I filled the tanks and yes I threw in stabil for good measure maybe its snake oil but its the only one that I have ever used im not big on them but after restoring the fuel sytem on my car I really don't want to have to mess with it again this spring.

 

Most people think that bringing an engine up to operating temp means bringing the coolant temp to mid-range.......that's not the concern. Bringing the oil temp up to max operating range is the key, and it takes much longer than the coolant temp to reach that point. The idea is that you want to burn off contaminates that will collect in the oil, such as moisture. If oil temp is to come up to normal operating range required, you must drive the vehicle! Also, many other factors come into consideration, such as condensation in the exhaust system and other components. Letting a car idle in your driveway will just add to the deterioration of the systems due to lack of condensation burn-off.

As far as a trickle charger, you want a battery maintainer. Harbor Freight has one for(believe it or not) about 6 bucks! I've used them for years with no mishaps. To make installation easy, clip off the alligator clips and attach a cigarette lighter adaptor and plug it into your cig socket.

If you don't care about blowing money away, you can buy a maintainer for 40 to 100 bucks, and they don't work any better than the $6.00 unit!

Sparky

 

Agreed, checking for condensation in the fuel tank/s is a ritual of a pre-flight check list but, in the case of an automobile, we're not talking about an inflight catastrophic failure. You're trying to compare apples to oranges.

I'm an ex-private pilot(thanks to diabetes) that owned a twin Cessna 310, so I know what you're talking about.

 

No way Fred; I'm not stupid!