wtb 348tb or ts, please help | FerrariChat

wtb 348tb or ts, please help

Discussion in '348/355' started by Bee Jay, Feb 13, 2007.

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  1. Bee Jay

    Bee Jay Formula Junior

    Apr 14, 2004
    751
    Lompoc, Ca.
    Full Name:
    Bernard E. Jones
    Hi. I'm new here, but I have been lurking for a while. My friends call me Bee Jay. I turn 50 this August, and I'm ready to make a lifelong dream come true. My goal is to drive my own car to the Concours Italiano this year. My budget is $45 to $55k, depending on condition and the need for belts and clutches. My color preference is red or yellow with tan interior. I thought I wanted a Testa Rossa, but I spent some time at Bolboli's? in San Diego this weekend and they had a TR next to a 348 and I got to do some side by side seating comparisons. I am 6 feet/220lbs. I like the 348 better, I think it looks better, seats better, and it is more affordable to me. I also visited Chris (vtc4198) in LA and looked at his red tb thats for sale. He explained a lot of things about these cars, but I have lots of questions and I need some help. I saw a near perfect white 348ts at Prestige Motors in San Diego, but I just could not fall in love with white. Chris explained the benefits of the coupe, but I like being able to remove my t-tops off of my Vette, and the targa top off of my Porsche. I should also mention that I built the engine in my Corvette, my Porsche, my Fiero, and my Harley, and I've had the trans out and done clutch work on my Porsche so much, I could do it in my sleep. I have a lift and a fairly well equiped three car garage, so I think I can handle minor surgery if a car needs it. I have tons of questions, but the biggest ones I have for now is;
    1. How many miles is a well maintained 348 engine good for? Is a 30k mile motor with a recent belt/clutch service going to give me another 70k miles? 50k miles? 40kmiles?
    2. when shopping for TR, everyone said get an 88 1/2 or later. Is there a majic year that Ferrari had all minor problems fixed. I've been told to avoid 89s and earlier.
    3. When looking at a car, what kind of things can I look for to eliminate the car immediately. I will have an inspection done before I buy, but what kind of things makes a car really undesirable. I know lack of maintenance records is one.
    My wife fell in love with Chris' car, but it's a little out of my price range. His car is beautiful, but it's one of the first I've looked at seriously. Maybe it is the one.
    I'm sorry for the long post. Thanks in advance for any help. And I'm really looking forward to becoming a 348 owner with you all. .
     
  2. plugzit

    plugzit F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 1, 2004
    7,784
    Redondo Beach, CA
    Full Name:
    Bruce Bogart
    Congrats on your decision to buy a 348. You'll love it. In answer to your question 1, the motor on the 348 is good for at least 100k, as I've seen a couple with that many on them. Mine has 60k+, no problem. The early trannies can have problems at around 40k. Just have some of the fluid drained and look for metal. No metal, no problem. Visit www.the348.com for a buyer's guide on the 348. I've found the 348 owners to be helpful and generous with their knowledge. The 348 brotherhood is strong!
     
  3. No Doubt

    No Doubt Seven Time F1 World Champ

    May 21, 2005
    72,740
    Vegas+Alabama
    Full Name:
    Mr. Sideways
    Ha! You're now dealing with Italian cars...each car is unique...each year is unique...just like Italian wine.

    1989 model 348's have conventional seat belts (later models have electric mouse-motor seat belts), metal cam belt covers, and dual disk clutches (great for racing or just handling added horsepower).

    Later 348's have the better Motronic 2.7 fuel ignition system, updated/stronger hub bearings/design, a wider stance, better exhaust, and a better bearing inside the tranny (if you go with an early model 348 then you may want this updated on your vehicle).

    Each year has advantages and disadvantages. You pays your money and you takes your chance.


    You'll want to replace the tranny fluid with Red Line's 75w90NS (the "NS" designation *is* important). You'll want to coat your electrical connections with Stabilant 22a. And you'll want to check/replace old or corroded (externally) relays.

    One component that will fail if you don't coat it in silicon is the exhaust ecu (well, there are 2, actually, 1 on each side of the engine behind the rear shock towers). Easy to get to by removing the rear wheels and inner fender liners.

    Add an automatic fire extinguisher (because you care about your wife and want her to know that you are safe driving around a 15+ year old high performance volatile-gasoline-burning exotic) to your engine bay (West Marine can get you a Fire Foe unit for $130), and add a pocketknife or other seatbelt cutter inside the driver cockpit.

    Check your fluids (oil is checked only when the motor is hot, coolant is checked only when the motor is cold, brake fluid anytime) and you should be good to go.

    These cars are a BLAST to drive! Lots of fun on the road...lots of fun getting comments from bystanders while parked...and lots of fun getting them valet parked, too.

    They are *easy* to work on. The 348 was the last Ferrari to be hand welded. Everything on the car bolts/unbolts or screws/unscrews. You don't even need an engine hoist...you jack the car with 2 floor jacks and the entire rear sub-frame comes out to pull the engine...from below!

    You can adjust the ride height overall and at each corner (springs/shocks hand-screw in your adjustments)...so you've got total control for your handling, looks, etc.

    Oh, since you are about my height, you may want a steering wheel spacer. 6 little allen bolts and your steering wheel is off, pop the spacer on, steering wheel back on, then screw back on those 6 allens and you've just won yourself a more comfortable driving position for less than $50 and 50 minutes of your time.

    You are going to have a lot of fun. Get a compression test on your potential purchase. Take Plugzit's advice on draining a bit of the tranny and engine oil to check for metal. Verify that your seller has a valid license plate (correct year, correct state). Do an autocheck or carfax and buy the $50 title insurance (for peace of mind, just in case the car has been "cloned" or stolen or wrecked), and you'll be fine. Don't get too hung up about "records" for the car. What you need documented will be everything from the *last* major service to date...plus any service campaign fixes (e.g. tranny bearing update, mouse motor recall, etc.). Any records beyond that is a plus...but not a show-stopping deal-breaker.

    Take your potential 348's for test drives. You're going to love the way they drive!
     
  4. Sven-F

    Sven-F Rookie

    Jul 4, 2006
    13
    Denmark
    Full Name:
    Sven Peter Jorgensen
    In Denmark we said: Turn 50, then it's time to buy a Ferrari. I bought my Ferrari 348 when I was 50!!!
    Maybe 93' is bettter than 92' and 92' better than 91', but in the end it depends on the car you are standing in front.
    A coupé is faster in curves than a ts, but we are talking about 1/100 sec. You will never notice.
    With a ts, you have 2 cars. One to drive fast and one to enjoy the sun. Driving a ts in rain, you maybe will see water dripping into the cabin, - it's an italian car!
    Until now I have had 8 smiling years with my 348 ts.
     
  5. Dcup

    Dcup F1 Veteran

    Jan 3, 2005
    8,645
    Between 2 Implants
    Full Name:
    Claude Balls
    i have owned a 348 ts in the past, i liked the car alot. the few things i hated was the damn top !!! leaked bad !! other guys i know who had them experienced the same problem. the a/c never blew cold and the damn windows always went up and down slow.....
     
  6. BT

    BT F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Mar 21, 2005
    15,291
    FL / GA
    Full Name:
    Bill Tracy
    He said it all. Oh, and get a 1989 ts, they are my favorite.
    ;)
    BT
     
  7. speedy_sam

    speedy_sam F1 Veteran

    Jul 13, 2004
    5,559
    TX
    Full Name:
    Sameer
    Excellent post No Doubt.
     
  8. Bee Jay

    Bee Jay Formula Junior

    Apr 14, 2004
    751
    Lompoc, Ca.
    Full Name:
    Bernard E. Jones
    It never rains in California, so leaks are not a problem. I won't drive it in the rain on purpose anyways. I will prolly have the top off most of the time, laying in the garage, because at 6 feet, I can't scoot the seat up to stow the top. Maybe a tb is in my best interest. I won't need ac except when I drive it to Vegas, but I prolly won't do that in the summer. Hey, is the 348 AC use old Freon R12 or the new stuff?
     
  9. vvassallo

    vvassallo F1 Veteran

    Aug 4, 2006
    8,329
    Palos Verdes
    Full Name:
    Vince V
    Don't be too fussy on a tb or ts. Just getting a good car should be your no. 1 priority. Also, make sure the car is somewhat waterproof and the wipers work. If you are going to drive to Monterey, u never know what ur gonna run into. There was a beautiful early model car on EBay with all sorts of updates and mods - that's what u should look for as well. Tubi, rear wheel spacers, hyperflows, 355 wheels - all these represent huge additions in cost that u can get for pennies on the dollar when buying a car.
     
  10. tamf328

    tamf328 Formula Junior

    Mar 9, 2005
    477
    have a 348 it leaks.
    had a 238 it leaked.
    have friends with Ferraris,,, their car leaks.
    haven't seen one that doesn't yet.
     
  11. Dcup

    Dcup F1 Veteran

    Jan 3, 2005
    8,645
    Between 2 Implants
    Full Name:
    Claude Balls
    not sure about the R 12. im 6'4 and could never store the top behind the seat either. whichever you decide- good luck !! p.s. get a PPI before hand ..
     
  12. Bee Jay

    Bee Jay Formula Junior

    Apr 14, 2004
    751
    Lompoc, Ca.
    Full Name:
    Bernard E. Jones
    Did that car sell? Is it still available? Do you know what it sold for? I've heard so many horror stories about evil bay. I really would like to find a car here in California so I can go take a look at it, and from a dealer or private owner. Ebay scares me.
     
  13. No Doubt

    No Doubt Seven Time F1 World Champ

    May 21, 2005
    72,740
    Vegas+Alabama
    Full Name:
    Mr. Sideways

    eBay should scare you.
     
  14. Samy

    Samy Formula Junior

    Dec 2, 2005
    603
    Whats the problem with the leaks? When i got the my car from the previous owner it leaked everywhere. Then i just adjust everything and now all is leak proof. I don't know how the previous owner could life with that situation and doesn't repair it.
     
  15. PAP 348

    PAP 348 Ten Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Dec 10, 2005
    100,224
    Mount Isa, Australia
    Full Name:
    Pap
    Weclome to Ferrarichat Bee Jay. Good luck on finding a 348 buddy. :):)
     
  16. No Doubt

    No Doubt Seven Time F1 World Champ

    May 21, 2005
    72,740
    Vegas+Alabama
    Full Name:
    Mr. Sideways
    +1. When I bought my 348 Spider there were two visible openings in between the seals where the rear of the windows meet the convertible top. Some silicon sealant, elbow grease, and a little trial/error and I soon had a leak-proof Spider.
     
  17. vvassallo

    vvassallo F1 Veteran

    Aug 4, 2006
    8,329
    Palos Verdes
    Full Name:
    Vince V
    Don't be so negative. I bought 2 cars off EBay and have been really satisfied. The trick is not to change any of your background checking etc. just because it's EBay. I only buy cars I can personally inspect. Meet your seller personally. If u need to take expertise with you. I use plugzit. :D I get them checked out professionally, however, cuz plugz ain't perfect and everyone can have an off day. :p

    Do not do anything if it doesn't feel right. I will research the car I was talking about. If it did not sell, it might return to EBay.
     
  18. plugzit

    plugzit F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 1, 2004
    7,784
    Redondo Beach, CA
    Full Name:
    Bruce Bogart
    Bought my car on ebay 1000 miles away. Guy had good feedback and it was better than represented. Got a good deal too-no reserve, guy just selling car at market. Scammers usually give you a queasy feeling and are resistant to your requests for info and inspection.
     
  19. BT

    BT F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Mar 21, 2005
    15,291
    FL / GA
    Full Name:
    Bill Tracy
    Yes, the 348 originally came with R12 (at least in 1989 it did). Some people convert them to R134a, but mechanics I spoke with don't recommend that. Sounds like a 348ts is your best bet, driving with the top off is great fun when the weather is good.
    :)
    BT
     
  20. tamf328

    tamf328 Formula Junior

    Mar 9, 2005
    477
    I have a 90 ts using R12, it actually works pretty good...
     
  21. sf348s

    sf348s Karting

    Oct 8, 2003
    168
    Lazio, Italy & UK
    Full Name:
    Steve Holden
    I have a TS..... wish i'd bought a TB ! Leaks you can live with but over bumpy surfaces (remember where I live!) the scuttle shake is really annoying. But then if the roof is out most of the time and you have good quality roads you won't notice it so much. You'll just have to try them both first.
     
  22. PAP 348

    PAP 348 Ten Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Dec 10, 2005
    100,224
    Mount Isa, Australia
    Full Name:
    Pap


    Is that factory R12 gas from 1990? :)
     
  23. gothspeed

    gothspeed F1 World Champ

    May 26, 2006
    10,244
    U.S.A.
    Full Name:
    goth
    If/when I get a 348 it will have to be a "B"!!! :) In Silver!!! So if you see one you know I'll be looking!
     
  24. tamf328

    tamf328 Formula Junior

    Mar 9, 2005
    477
    you're right about the shake... :))
    they do on rough roads. I still like the cars that you can take the top off.
    wished I would have bought a 348 spider.

    and of course the R-12 isn't from 1990 I suspect that leaked out long before
    I ever bought the car :))
    the system if far better than that 328 I had.
    it was like getting blown on through a straw with luke cool air.
     
  25. Bee Jay

    Bee Jay Formula Junior

    Apr 14, 2004
    751
    Lompoc, Ca.
    Full Name:
    Bernard E. Jones
    I'd buy a spider, but I don't like the way it looks with the top up, and you know if the wife just had her hair done.....the tops gotta go up.
    The guy at Bobilef said that a red spyder with tan interior would look good with a tan top, but Ferrari only does black tops.

    Hey, I've got another probably stupid question, just tell me it's stupid if it is.
    I've had a number of belt driven camshaft cars, and most are good for 60k miles. Why is a Ferrari belt only good for 30k miles, or 5 years, whichever comes first? Can't any aftermarket companies offer a belt that is good for longer? I see even Ferrari finally switched to chain drive on the 430. It seems that I can buy a car with recent belt and clutch service, and enjoy for five years, or I can save a little money buying a car in need of belts and clutch service, and have it done after I replinish my cookie jar money.
    What happens if you go past 30k miles or 5 years. The belt breaks? Or does it slip? I assume the engine is zero tolerance and you tag the pistons with 32 valves. Has anyone gone more than 30k miles and lived to tell about it? Is this just Ferrari being overly cautous?
     

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