Yellow zinc plating resource/shop? | FerrariChat

Yellow zinc plating resource/shop?

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by stevel48, Jan 20, 2012.

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  1. stevel48

    stevel48 Formula 3

    Jan 4, 2005
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    I had my local shop quote me $125 to replate 6 hose clamps. Does that sound right? This is my first time investigating plating and $125 for 5 clamps sounds nuts to me. Is there an online plating co. that you can send your parts to that is prety reasonable?
     
  2. Iain

    Iain F1 Rookie

    Jan 21, 2005
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    If I took 6 hose clamps to my local plater and asked him to plate them in yellow zinc I would guess it would cost around $10 equivalent (and then only so much because it was a small order -I imagine he would do 20 for about the same amount.

    Suggest find another plater!
     
  3. roalda

    roalda Formula Junior

    Oct 2, 2007
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    Or new clamps!
     
  4. stevel48

    stevel48 Formula 3

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    $60 for original replacement ones. Still kind of steep for clamps but I may bite it and buy em.
     
  5. andyww

    andyww F1 Rookie

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    What do you mean by "original replacement ones?" If you are spending that much you could get aircraft grade stainless steel ones instead.
     
  6. stevel48

    stevel48 Formula 3

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    I try and keep my car all original down to the cable ties the factory used on it. The clamps used for my car are impossible to find in the large size but I did find 12 of them that have been stripped and replated already for $60.
     
  7. andyww

    andyww F1 Rookie

    Feb 7, 2011
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    I am all in favor of keeping things original, for example I sourced the 9mm wide cable ties recently for replacement purposes, which are not easy to find, but what attributes does a hose clip need to have to be original? The same manufacturer? If you were to buy a new one from Ferrari, it would almost certainly not be the same manufacturer as used on the car originally, same with all other fasteners, they are just generic parts.
     
  8. fastradio

    fastradio F1 Rookie
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    Well, considering that the original clamps were plated in yellow cadmium...and that process is pretty much illegal in the US except for some very specific military applications, no, that price sounds cheap. However, today's closest plating that resembles cadmium is yellow zinc. Then we get into hydrogen embrittlement issues....and then liability, if the resultant fastener fails.

    Platers set up for large job runs. Unless they're doing the material you want, it will be expensive. As most DIY folks aren't aware of the potential risks of making seemingly innocent parts look pretty, some business may choose to defer the liability.

    As Paul Harvey says....and that's the rest of the story.
     
  9. pippo

    pippo Formula 3

    Sep 25, 2005
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    Good point on "originality" topic. I too agree, it only goes so far. new clamps I doubt would detract anyone wanting an orig ferrari/not modified.
     
  10. Speedmade

    Speedmade Formula Junior
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    Was that a flat fee or a batch charge?

    I regularly get parts anodized. The shop I use has a minimum batch charge of $150. Whether I bring in 3 little parts, or a milk crate full, it's the same price.
    I usually try to get a bunch of guys together and split the charge.
     
  11. andyww

    andyww F1 Rookie

    Feb 7, 2011
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    Another point about plating is the finish depends on how much time the plater spends on preparation. If the parts are rusty, they will need to remove the rust so they will bead-blast the parts. Even if they use the finest grade glass beads, this will result in a matt finish after plating which is not much like the original shiny finish.
    To get back to original they would need to polish the parts before plating, which is very time consuming. It may be the original high quoted cost was for this level of finish.
     
  12. Martin308GTB

    Martin308GTB F1 Rookie

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    #12 Martin308GTB, Jan 21, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Hello from Germany,

    seems, that zinc plating in the US has gotten incredibly expensive because of environment regulations.
    I fear we will get the same situation over here in the near future.
    I have just - three weeks ago - a bunch or carburettor parts yellow and white zinc plated.
    This cost me EUR 30,-- ( ~ $ 38,--).

    Best Regards from Germany

    Martin
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  13. stevel48

    stevel48 Formula 3

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    Found a co. That does yellow zinc only and for car parts specifically. $30 bucks with return shipping. Perfect.
     
  14. Cribbj

    Cribbj Formula 3
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    Steve, could you mention their name, or PM me contact details? I've been looking for a plater and the locals are stupidly expensive.
     
  15. Brian Harper

    Brian Harper F1 Rookie
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    #15 Brian Harper, Jan 21, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    I'm going to send my stuff to you next time! I just picked this up from the plater yesterday. This is what $200 plates in Silicon Valley.
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  16. stevel48

    stevel48 Formula 3

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    Happy to share.

    http://www.yellowzincplating.com/
     
  17. Cribbj

    Cribbj Formula 3
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    Many thanks!

    I'll wait to see how your job turns out before contacting them :)

    It would be really good if you could take before/after pics?
     
  18. bpu699

    bpu699 F1 World Champ
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    Subscribed...
     
  19. mwr4440

    mwr4440 Five Time F1 World Champ
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    #19 mwr4440, Jan 23, 2012
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2012

    Dave,

    I posted up awhile back with examples about a process DaveH developed with platting, chemical and metal engineers in the Mile-High area.

    He gets the EXACT same color(s) as OEM thru a multi-step process WITHOUT the embrittlement issues previllent in the conventional process used by most platers.


    If I would replate anything and I have, it ALWAYS goes to DaveH. But, time cannot be a factor without bigger bucks. Speed just costs, but I am patient (READ: CHEAP SOB).


    Anyone desiring plating has three choices:

    You can go DaveH's route (Call him first),

    Use the convetional process and plate your parts potentially into the consistancy of china, or

    Paint them.
     
  20. fastradio

    fastradio F1 Rookie
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    Mark,
    So do we...This (process) is well documented in most material manuals and near common knowledge by most MEs. As you know, the plating stuff that SRI does not inexpensive. Unfortunately, the mindset of this post is "how cheap can I have it done" without hearing any of the known stated risks. It is unfortunate that many posts go this route.
     
  21. mwr4440

    mwr4440 Five Time F1 World Champ
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    Dave,

    Sorry. :eek: I'll certainly give you billing too along with Dave in any future posts on the subject. I have adopted Dave primarily as my Ferrari Pap Bear since he lives just a few miles from my parents house in Denver.

    I am not a metallurgist, or any kind of an enginner of any sorts, but I do read a fair amount about select subjects that do interest me. I had run into VERY little on this process so assumed it was something relatively new. Maybe my "google" is broken ...... :eek:


    I started out like most seeing how cheap I could get things done. But over time I learned there is A right way to do things and MANY WRONG ways. I am no longer a cheap SOB because cheap is almpost ALWAYS the WRONG thing to do. Doing nothing is often times the better route. I wasted $thousands on "Cheap" that I duely wish I could get back.


    I just hate seeing well intentioned guys spending their hard earned nickels (just like I did in the beginning) actually doing more harm, in some cases much more harm to the point of potentially catistrophic consequences, than any possible good.



    I'll crawl back under my "Dunce Cap" and sit in the corner now ......... :eek:
     
  22. stevel48

    stevel48 Formula 3

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    #22 stevel48, Jan 23, 2012
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2012
    I have to defend myself on this one David. Most of us non-ME's wouldn't know a thing about hydrogen enbrittlement or that such a thing exists. To the average Joe plating is plating and it's a service. You even said it yourself in the beginning of my thread
    We leave it to the platers to figure out how to do it and address the potential problems. This post isn't about price. At it's root it's about education re: plating and whether or not a newb (me) is getting a raw deal. Different service providers have different fees so why pay more for the same service? I'll save a buck if I can save a buck on something like this. I won't skimp and buy a poor part to save $. I could just go buy $.50 clamps to do that. I am trying to keep the car original at the expense of $60 hose clamps. Don't lump me in with a cheap-o who damages their car because they are to cheap to buy the right parts for it or service it when it needs it. No way.

    As a ME and great Ferrari tech you know I look to you for your advice and guidance on subjects. I recognize your expertise and that's why I sent you a personal PM asking about plating.

    I had to go pour over PDF's to learn a bit about HE and I have some questions for you. In my case with hose clamps, would they not be affected because they are not subject to high temperatures? The steel used in the clamps must not contain a lot of carbon. It seems low enough on the Rockwell hardness scale that it would not be too susceptible to HE. Yes/No? Would a 4 hr bake at 400 after plating eliminate most of the H in the metal?

    I can definitely see HE being a concern when replacing block studs, main cap studs and the like.

    Does Dave's/your process use mechanical plating to mitigate the HE risk? Who are the right platers to use?


    my resources

    http://www.uni-saarland.de/fak8/wwm/research/phd_barnoush/hydrogen.pdf
    http://mechanicalplating.com/hydrogen.htm
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrogen_embrittlement
    http://www.materialsengineer.com/CA-hydrogen.htm
    http://www.artisticplating.net/Hydrogen-Embrittlement-Baking.php
    http://events.nace.org/library/corrosion/Forms/embrittlement.asp
     
  23. andyww

    andyww F1 Rookie

    Feb 7, 2011
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    Are we still discussing hose clips here? These are not made from hardened steel, no issue. Suspension bolts maybe, hose clips no.
     
  24. stevel48

    stevel48 Formula 3

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    #24 stevel48, Jan 23, 2012
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2012
    Yes. It was always about hose clamps. I am glad I learned of HE though.

    last year I was cleaning them using a CLR bath and it stripped the plating right off the clamps. Luckily most every other part in my engine bay still has its original plating on it.
     
  25. stevel48

    stevel48 Formula 3

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    Can you post that link here?
     

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