Your Children: Are You Pushing Them to Overachieve?

Holidays are a good thing........




























usually!

 

By not falling for it. We have friends that have their kids in every imaginable activity, and from outside looking in, it seems like it puts a lot of stress on their family. We have 3 kids now, and try not to get them involved in more than 1 thing at a time. Right now, the 6 year old is pushing for piano lessons, so we're looking into that. He's not too interested in sports, but did say he wanted to try golf next summer. The 3 (almost 4) y.o. saw go-karts running a couple of weeks ago and wants to try that.

I'd much rather that they try different things that they are interested in over time, rather than signing them up for soccer, t-ball, play group, gymnastics, etc., etc. Our kids are bright and curious, and we don't feel like we're depriving them of anything by being selective in what they do. We have dinner together most nights and feel like we have a pretty good handle on what's going on with them. Granted, that may change when they get older, but for now, that's our plan and we're sticking to it. Kids need downtime too.

 

Perspective from a kid (kinda) Growing up I was not pressured to do any extracurricular activities unless I whole heartedly wanted to. Only requirement by my parents for myself and my brother was to keep a 3.0 gpa. IMO let the kids motivate themselves, I took 2 ap classes my senior year (calc & physics) while most kids were slacking off. Never was overly involved in school functions though, I grew up racing motocross and dedicated every spare moment I had to it, sometimes against my parents wishes.

I think it all depends on the kids, some thrive on pushing themselves. Just so long as they aren't forced to fulfill their parents obsurd expectations, or the parents aren't living vicariously through their childrens success I see no harm.

 

Just my $.02 as someone who was a kid not too long ago, there are way too many organized events in kids lives nowadays; too much rec baseball, school soccer, etc. and not enough pickup games in the street. I played hockey a lot (year round, 4/5 days a week, camps in the summer, etc.) and I can say, without a doubt, my best memories are playing street hockey pickup games in someone's driveway, not organized games and practices on the ice. That's where I had the most fun, and isn't that the point of being a kid?

I'm also not sure all the academic pressure is necessary / accomplishes much of anything. My parents put nearly zero pressure on me (they didn't have to) and I got straight As from K to 12, graduated at the top of my class, etc. My next door neighbor (still my best friend) was a B student all through school. His parents could have put all the pressure in the world on him and that would have never changed his grades (they tried, it didn't work, so they backed off). This is besides my feelings that grades are probably the poorest representation of one's childhood. Am I a better person since I did better in school? Sure, I might have a few more job opportunities (arguable considering how much networking comes in to play), but what's the point? We all end up in the same place, enjoy the ride.

I continually get the feeling we're in some sort of backlash from the 60s and 70s. Everyone is becoming all mathematics and no philosophy. I just hate to see the imagination being systematically killed in our society.

I stumbled across "Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas" the other night, I wont have a chance to read it until the semester is over, but I definitely will do so in December. After reading a few pages, I get the feeling though that no one in my generation is going to turn out something like that.

 

The other effect is that too many kids lead such structured, organized activities that they are incapable of organizing anything for themselves.

When I was a kid, we played little league baseball but we also played a lot of pickup games ourselves with no adults around. Today's kids wouldn't know how to organize a pickup game by themselves because they are used to having adults do it for them.

When I went to college, I was dropped off, told to write or call once in a while and otherwise left on my own to get registered, buy crap for my dorm room, buy textbooks and everything else. Now we see parents spending up to a week at college doing all of that for their prodigies.

John

 

No. I want underachievers, so they can go on reality TV and be big celebrities. I'd be so proud if they were like the kids on Cattle Drive or whatever the he11 it is called. Or maybe like Bonad0uche.
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heres what i do with my down time, if you think im bad here , you should see in person...
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John, you have hit the nail on the head.

 

And on a COMPLETELY un-related note, prescriptions for Ritalin continue to skyrocket.

We think we're creating better adults by structuring the lives of our kids. We're terrified that, if they don't go to soccer 5 times/week, plus see a private coach in the off-season that they may not make the junior pre-teen alternate regional all-star team. Their self-confidence will be destroyed and, once again, good 'ol Biff and Marci (dotted with a heart)'s kids will rule the day, get into Harvard and lord over our children til the day they die, bringing to an end an over-worked, under-fulfilled American life. But it's OK. They'll most likely be able to sue somebody for ruining their lives. The important thing is, the entire time they were never forced into a situation whereby they had to make decisions.

 

Bingo: AMERICA

It's all about business & money. All these "programs" and extra-curicular activities are just more places offering more services and essentially more sales. Piano, dance, gym, tutoring, etc, etc....it's all about services & money.

Back "in my day" a birthday party was at someones house. We pinned the tail on the donkey, maybe some dumb art-project and ate some cake. No "party favors" or any crap like that. Today any kid has to have their birthday at some fancy gym or activity center OR if you have it at your home you have to import some talent/show to entertain the kids. And you have to offer "party favors", etc.

We all just want to do what we can for our kids, it's a fine line between providing a nurturing household and spoiling them rotten. How will our kids learn to fish when we toss endless supplies of seemingly free fish in front of them?

How are we to give them the same drive & thinking we have, yet let them see our homes, Ferrari's and other luxuries that they can't help but take for granted?

I sure as heck don't know!

 

I guess I could fit into the sterotypical overacheiving kid growing up... but not really

I was the first in my family born in the US (NJ to be exact)... parents, sister all came from New Delhi. Growing up, the only thing that my parents expected was

1) Good marks in school
2) Have manners, be respectful, etc
3) Be well cultured (Indian and American society, etc)

Other than that I was pretty free. They did make me play the piano for 10 yrs, and I gotta say I was not a fan of practicing. I did keep it up that long because every July there was a major piano competition in NJ each year, and I loved getting a gold medal in it everytime (during this time frame, I loved to practice).

During this time, I also played lots of sports. During the fall it was soccer, winter was basketball, spring was swimming, summer just ride bikes with friends or go roam around in the woods... but all of it was because I wanted to do it.

In highschool I played football, did track, got a 2nd degree blackbelt in tae kwon do, and eventually did stop playing the piano. But like I said, parents never demanded that I do this do that other than stick to items #1, 2 and 3.


As far as keeping good grades up at all times... from my first day of school all the way through highschool, my dad would sit down with me, eview my day's work with me, and make sure my homework was correct. Being that his background was in EE, I too became fond of being an EE, and studied that for undergrad and grad. As a result, I was able to have my dad help me out alot when I was in a jam working on homework or even studying for finals whenever I would ask. But essentially after highschool his usual advice to me was study hard, have fun, and don't get into trouble.

Now that I'm in the process of moving out of technical work and hopefully into a financial related field, I still have his full support.


Same held true for my sister, though she kept up the piano for a long time, plus dabbled in painting and sculpting. She also did her undergrad in EE and finishing up her phd too.


now going back to the original question...

Am I (Would I) pushing my kids to overachieve?
well since I don't have kids, at this point I'd say... I'd try to raise them the same way my parents raised me. My dad was able to go from being a farm boy to a senior director of a fortune 500 company, brought me from being a tall goofy kid to a tall goofy adult ... so hopefully my raising will help them have an even better life/lifestyle than I have or will have.


Oh ya, in hind site, I do miss playing the piano.

 

When I was growing up, getting good grades wasn't an option. It was a demand. Thus, I spent plenty of time studying. In High School, I had the hardest courseload of anybody in my class.

On top of all that, were the extracirriculars. At various times growing up I:
-played piano (my main activity, for 10 years)
-took karate
-played soccer
-played baseball
-art lessons
-swimming lessons
-Beachsports
-music camp
-computer camp
-church choir
-plays

And then looking at high school:
-piano (still)
-Model UN (huge time requirement...travelling all over the country and to Europe and stuff)
-water polo team
-swim team
-Republican Club (VP)
-Snowsports Club (Co-founder)
-Culinary Arts Club (Treasurer)
-tutoring people

Now I'm in college. I have no doubt that doing all those things helped get me where I am. But, just the past few days, I realize I've hit a wall on what is humanly possible for me to do. I have:
-5 Courses (Intermediate Microeconomics, Statistics for Economists, International Relations in Theory and Practice, History of American Law until 1877, and Law and Politics in International Business)
-Model UN (Operations Director for one of our conferences)

It's just too much. I spent 7 hours today working on our conference website, and I haven't even been able to start studying for an Econ midterm I have on Wednesday.

My solution? I'm dropping my IR minor. I still have my Econ major and Legal Studies minor, and I'm still graduating in 3 years. So what's the point in suffering trying to cram in another minor instead of taking some easy, fun classes? I didn't get to leave my room the whole weekend (literally, not at all) because I had so much work. Is that how I want to remember my college years? Nope.

I think you have to look at the marginal benefit of adding yet another activity/program. When you're young, doing those activities have social and developmental benefits, so I think they're worth it. But what will "yet another minor" get me? Very little, I think. It isn't worth the negative short-term impact it has had on my life (I've been at a near-breakdown state of stress the past few days).

So, what will I have my kids do? I'll push them when they're young, until they get to the point where they learn to make the right decisions to balance their lives on their own.

 

I have a dog.

 

I have 2 kids, age 6 and 2. They each do activities but we do limit it.

My wife and I have discussed the "how" and "what" about giving our kids the best possible childhood from all perspectives and fostering the best possible family experience for all of us. This is after all the most important thing in our lives.

We plan on taking at least 1 and perhaps as much as 3 years off work when my son is 12 and daughter is 8. We will either sell or rent our home and purchase a nice 50' or so cruising sailboat. We plan to live aboard, homeschool the kids and cruise the east coast of the US, the caribbean islands and perhaps across the Atlantic to the Med if we decided to extend the time.

I have no question that the home schooling and first hand experiences would be a lifetime gift for my kids as would the discipline and skill obtained from lving aboard and helping to sail the boat. One of my biggest objectives in this will be to teach first hand responsibility and to ingrain them a deeper understanding of "The World" than they would get in a classroom and from TV.

My only worry is we may decide to never come back.



Terry

 

You wanna adopt a 10 year old kid trapped in a 26 yo body?

Do it, Terry, that would be an awesome experience for you and the kids.

 

Exactly! I'm afraid that us baby boomer parents are gonna go down in history as one of the worst group of parents ever. Talk about being over protective.

When I was a kid during the summer, I would be out the door in the morning, and I wouldn't be back until after dark. My parents didn't have a clue where I was (no cell phones.)

By the time I turned 16, many of my buddies had pretty much left home. (I never did though.) They spent more and more crashing at at an older sibling or buddy's place until they hardly went home at all. The funny thing is that their parents didn't miss em!

I'm afraid that we have stolen our children's youth. To try and make up, I have recommended to my over achieving 21-year old daughter that she take at least a year off after she graduates from Dartmouth doing, well, doing nothing. Imagine that.

Dale

 

Great idea, Terry. Speaking from experience, whatever you do, do it BEFORE they hit puberty. Those hormones will turn them into raving lunatics who will want to have nuthin to do with you and your wife.

In my case, I did spend the better part of the year when my son turned 12 trying to teach him one lesson -- Namely, if you beat your head against the wall, it hurts. Therefore, nitwit, don't beat your head against the wall. It is far better to go with the flow than to be "James Dean" type head case.

You see, nobody told me this when I was a kid. It took me many, many years to figure this out.

Now that my son is 18, I pleased to see that he did learn his lesson. In fact, the biggest problem is that he might have learned it too well. Talk about a sweet-talking con!

Dale

 

Dale,

I totally agree regarding the age thing and we will be going on our extended trip no later than age 12 for my son. Later than that, he wont even want to talk to us much less share a small sailboat!

I also agree about the over protective thing. I fight my wife a bit on this all the time. I recently bought my 6 year old son a BB gun with a nifty scope. Age 6 is old enough to start learning how to shoot. At first my wife was a bit concerned but when she saw how seriously he was taking it and he was really focusing on what he was doing she was pretty amazed. He still cannot hit squat, but he is learning!

I grew up living on a large lake. At age 8, I had a 14' john boat with a 15hp outboard. CRAZY overpowered, that thing would prop walk at about 35mph! I would often vanish out onto the lake at dawn and not return until after dark.... gone fishing.

The sailing trip is something we will definitely do. The wife is 100% on board with it and I view it as the best thing we could ever do for our children. We are currently getting ASA certifications and will be chartering bare boats for the next several years in preparation.


Terry

 

Tom Yang (of 330 America fame) is doing a land-based version of that, leaving around the first of the year with his family to tour Australia for 6-12 months.

I think that it is great to do something like that, especially if you are concentrating in the U.S. My daughters are in 6th grade and they are studying all sorts of foreign cultures in "social studies". This is a wonderful thing to do but the problem is that they have never spent any appreciable time learning about our country, its history, its people and its economic system. Seeing and learning about the good ol' USA should be a prerequisite to world history.

Now don't get me started about the social studies teacher who thinks that the New York Times is a credible source of news information.

Anyway, the learning that you and your family experience, not only about everything that you see, but also about each other as a family, will be immeasurable.

John

 

And that's the generation that dropped out, drugged out, free-loved, protested, etc. The more radical the youth, the more reactionary the old age apparently.

It's not just the parents, the entire system contributes. We tried to get our daughter to cut back in HS courseload (8 AP courses and a 2 junior college courses in her last two years of HS, not counting varsity water polo - at least we convinced her to take ceramics for some relaxation) , but she was determined to keep up with her classmates and refused to drop any.

 

*Eats popcorn*

 

When I have kids I'll do what my parents did, let them pick their own hobby and help them if I can.