| Author | Message | ||
| allan fiedler (Allanlambo)
Member Username: Allanlambo Post Number: 700 Registered: 6-2002 |
Don, shouldnt you get back to playing Magnum PI? | ||
| "The Don" (The_don)
Senior Member Username: The_don Post Number: 5926 Registered: 8-2002 |
Allan
Far better? I guess the hoe's you see can spot a dickhead easier in a bling bling mobile | ||
| David Stoeppelwerth (Racerdj)
Member Username: Racerdj Post Number: 324 Registered: 1-2003 |
Anxiously awaiting the Ignor Member Setting as Alan you'll be my first. Back to the topic 360 gets 460 HP. | ||
| JRV (Jrvall)
Intermediate Member Username: Jrvall Post Number: 1942 Registered: 11-2002 |
>>While I wouldn't use the term "girlie" , I too think the 360 looks a little feminine. Kinda like a mandolin.<< Carl Lewis & Richard Simmons both love their 360's..maybe it's that mandolin look that caught their eye? ;-) | ||
| allan fiedler (Allanlambo)
Member Username: Allanlambo Post Number: 699 Registered: 6-2002 |
Clax, ill post a picture of me and my average at best appearance and my wife, and you post picture of yours. Hows that? I love how you guys post that a Ferrari picks up girls, i post that the Lambo does it far better, and all of a sudden I bought my car to make up for something. lol | ||
| "The Don" (The_don)
Senior Member Username: The_don Post Number: 5925 Registered: 8-2002 |
Pat, no...it's not aftershave....It's organic.... | ||
| Pat Pasqualini (Enzo)
Member Username: Enzo Post Number: 754 Registered: 2-2002 |
Sniff sniff sniff Hey Matt I think I smell it or maybe it is just Allan's aftershave | ||
| allan fiedler (Allanlambo)
Member Username: Allanlambo Post Number: 698 Registered: 6-2002 |
Haha, Irv David at Prestige Imports will tell anyone anything, in order to get a deposit out of you. Only a fool would list his name to get any credibility whatsoever. Irv only been arrested several times for numerous scams also. As for my height, im 6ft. As for why do i still have wanted cars, well im searching for a Murcielago now, but white is hard to get, and the Pagani is not legal here yet, but will be shortly. Yes, i did give up buying an F40 and bought a Diablo instead. The F40 is an awesome track car, but not roadcar, and the Diablo is much nicer to look at and drive on the street. | ||
| Clax (Clax)
Junior Member Username: Clax Post Number: 79 Registered: 10-2002 |
{Fellow F-Chat members, please allow me to regress with an infantile repsonse to Fiedler's continuous infantile behavior.} Allan, Who said I bought the 360 to get girls' attention? Maybe you are indirectly suggesting that you need your fancy exotic car to compensate for your average (at best) personal appearance? Personally, I find there are much more effective measures to get a girls attention than driving around in a car. Did you meet your wife while cruising? Wow, breast exposures? You da man! If I could only be Fiedler for a day, I might see some boobs. Wow. {Once again F-Chat members, my apologies.} | ||
| "The Don" (The_don)
Senior Member Username: The_don Post Number: 5924 Registered: 8-2002 |
David, You say that has if he cares. He's been smelling to much of what he is dishing. M | ||
| David Stoeppelwerth (Racerdj)
Member Username: Racerdj Post Number: 323 Registered: 1-2003 |
Alan like I stated beforer, the only girly thing about a 360 is all the women it attracts and in my case I does me no good. I enjoy the constructive comments made by others but when you name call others, I only wish your daycare had extended hours! Please go spend your time on Lambochat.com or whereever. One thing is for sure, you will not see any of us lowering to your level on that site. | ||
| "The Don" (The_don)
Senior Member Username: The_don Post Number: 5922 Registered: 8-2002 |
Allan, since you can afford all those cars, why do you have some listed on your wanted list? Does anyone else smell that?....kinda smells like bullshit? | ||
| Taek-Ho Kwon (Stickanddice)
Intermediate Member Username: Stickanddice Post Number: 1532 Registered: 11-2002 |
p8ge, Prestige Imports in FL? Yeah, a lot of credibility those guys have. They'll lie their asses off to get a sale. I have a list of people who've been burned by those guys. Cheers | ||
| Frank Parker (Parkerfe)
Advanced Member Username: Parkerfe Post Number: 2706 Registered: 9-2001 |
While I wouldn't use the term "girlie" , I too think the 360 looks a little feminine. Kinda like a mandolin. | ||
| "The Don" (The_don)
Senior Member Username: The_don Post Number: 5920 Registered: 8-2002 |
hubert, do you think allan's gold chains get caught in his back hair? Matt | ||
| RICK ROMERO (Tr90)
Junior Member Username: Tr90 Post Number: 198 Registered: 4-2001 |
Allan, you gave up an F40 for a Diablo SV? what ever you are smoking must be some good s..t! i need to hang out with you brother! | ||
| Hubert Otlik (Hugh)
Intermediate Member Username: Hugh Post Number: 1063 Registered: 1-2002 |
>>Go drive your girlie 360 Spider, and ill drive my Diablo next to you, then see which one gets the girls attention. This too unfortunately doesnt help me since i usually have my wife with me, but becomes worthwile during those sometime breast exposures i happen to see.<< says it all. | ||
| "The Don" (The_don)
Senior Member Username: The_don Post Number: 5919 Registered: 8-2002 |
Allan, How tall are you? | ||
| p8ge (P8ge)
New member Username: P8ge Post Number: 17 Registered: 1-2003 |
JRV, 1 1/2 yr waiting list? com'on now! tell your friend to call David at Prestige Imports in Florida and he will have the two Gallardo's for him before the end of the year. I think that the Gallardo will be a great car to have but the 1 1/2 yr waiting list is just a hype. | ||
| allan fiedler (Allanlambo)
Member Username: Allanlambo Post Number: 696 Registered: 6-2002 |
Lets see, I could of bought an F40, but didnt Could of bought a 360 spider, but didnt Could of bought a 288 Gto, but didnt Could of bought a 550/575, but didnt I could of a bought a Diablo Sv, and gladly did. Go drive your girlie 360 Spider, and ill drive my Diablo next to you, then see which one gets the girls attention. This too unfortunately doesnt help me since i usually have my wife with me, but becomes worthwile during those sometime breast exposures i happen to see. | ||
| Hubert Otlik (Hugh)
Intermediate Member Username: Hugh Post Number: 1062 Registered: 1-2002 |
irrespective of all the potshots, i think we can make a few conclusions: 1). allen doesn't track his car, and unfortunatly this hinders his fundamental understanding of "performance." for example: I know that at 100 mph I'm traveling at 146' per second. this is important because i'm 200 feet from the next turn, and there's about 50' b/w me and the the guy i'm trying to pass. i need the better part of 150' to scrub off enought speed to make a clean pass, and to make the turn-in. after a while youre making these caluculations all day long. this puts you in touch with what your car is doing, always. how big it is, how far you dive into the braking zone, how much it'll understeer, now much you can rotate it, and how much your brakes have faded. i never get anywhere near my cars limit on the street simply b/c there's nowhere to do it without endangering others' lives, and my own. going fast on the street accounts for 10% of a cars overall "performance." 2). ferrari's and lambo are sometimes bought by differing and sometimes by the same demographic population(s). and each make, repsectivly, "caters" to theirs; however, for those that never intend to realize, or peek at, the cars true performance, the argument that they bought the car b/c it's got the "best" performance over any other, doesn't hold water. 3). ferraris and lambos have had equally poor build quality/service issues, and are inherantly expensive. in the face of the fact that you can get a 50k z06 w/ equivelent spec sheet numbers, how much you paid is irrelevent simply b/c you paid 100K for a car, and 100K is a shitload of money. anything above that just vanishes into the ether. 4). the new 360 will have 460 hp b/c ferrari has seen a rise in hp figures from its nearest competitors, and knows that many of their customers look at numbers (primarily), and the most looked at number is horsepower. they could lighten the car, add a lighter clucth and flywheel assembly, lose some of that cushy leather, etc. but if they didn't raise the horsepower, it wouldn't make an impact (to laymen eye) simply b/c that's what they've been trained to look at. in the exotic car segment it's always been about numbers. which is a pity b/c it dimishes the attention placed on more visceral elements on the car. but, that's how the ball rolls, i guess. | ||
| JRV (Jrvall)
Intermediate Member Username: Jrvall Post Number: 1941 Registered: 11-2002 |
>>JRV, you're starting to sound soft on the 5th wheel issue... ;']<< Yes I admit I'm a softee on that ...;-) I do think it is fun trying to goad Ferrari into stepping up to the plate with Lambo. After all I'm an American so my National Pride isn't at risk if one of them wins. ;-).. I did just recieve a call from a friend in response to the search for 2 Gallardos for clients...there is NOW a 1 1/2 Yr Waiting List with those at the front being offered $25K over sticker for their place in line. Seems deposits have been anted up for over 175 Gallardos here in the states so far. Maybe that 500HP has more appeal than some give it credit for? I wonder if Lambo Dealers will take 360 trade ins? ;-) | ||
| Richard Ward (Lomotpk)
New member Username: Lomotpk Post Number: 32 Registered: 5-2003 |
JRV, you're starting to sound soft on the 5th wheel issue... ;'] | ||
| KCCK (Kenneth)
Member Username: Kenneth Post Number: 454 Registered: 10-2002 |
Well said, JRV. | ||
| Ralph Koslin (Ralfabco)
Member Username: Ralfabco Post Number: 471 Registered: 3-2002 |
I think there is alot of generalizations here. Obviously people buy different types of cars for different reasons. Some people want to be seen and noticed. Others want the "same" type of car for their own thrill of driving something that is hi-performance for them. If an owner does not race or has no interest that does not automatically make the person someone that is a cruiser (poser) who is just looking for other motorists to drop their jaw when looking at their wheels. Some owners do not have the time to properly track a car. Owning a GT car does not obligate you to take the car to the track. It does not also leave you with the requirement of using the car to drag race a 69 SS 396 Camaro either. The car can be used and enjoyed as a GT street car driving hi-speed on back roads that have curves and sweepers. This does not make you a crazy person for using the car in a hi performance capacity out in the middle of nowhere. Remember that the speed limits are designed to take care of the abilites of all the cars on the roads. The road may have a speed limit of 35mph which probably is about the fastest you would go in your old pick-up truck that has drum brakes. But everyone here knows that any "sports" car can safely take that turn a (little) faster. - - - On paying alot of money over sticker for delivery of a car. I personally never understood why someone would pay alot more for a car to have the first one in town. For some people it is important. | ||
| JRV (Jrvall)
Intermediate Member Username: Jrvall Post Number: 1939 Registered: 11-2002 |
>>What is more, I could even brag about the car that my uncle (or my friend's uncle) is said to own<< or the one to be purchased for a wife...;-). I think it's common sense that paying $100K - $200K over sticker doesn't have much to do with "being smart" , and is simply an expression of excess because one can. Nothing wrong with the above if that's your thing, however, it has no relationship to "best", just as standing in line has no relationship to "best". And in the end it simply comes back to "bragging rights". Which is a fickle category in itself, as to win the game of 'bragging rights' one must choose their audience very carefully, or find oneself not getting the respect they thought they were buying. As Allan so visibly points out. ;-) | ||
| "The Don" (The_don)
Senior Member Username: The_don Post Number: 5915 Registered: 8-2002 |
Rob, I cannot agree more. I often hide the fact that I own them. | ||
| KCCK (Kenneth)
Member Username: Kenneth Post Number: 453 Registered: 10-2002 |
What is more, I could even brag about the car that my uncle (or my friend's uncle) is said to own.  | ||
| Rob Lay (Rob328gts)
Board Administrator Username: Rob328gts Post Number: 5599 Registered: 12-2000 |
Exactly JRV, some Lamborghini owners have the personalities to brag. I'm perfectly happy with no one knowing I have Ferraris or just how fast they are on a track. | ||
| JRV (Jrvall)
Intermediate Member Username: Jrvall Post Number: 1938 Registered: 11-2002 |
>>Absolutetly, it needs at least 500 BHP to compete, and it should up the ante and have at least 5 wheels.<< You guys need to face some facts. The single biggest "lure" of conspicous consumption is BRAGGING RIGHTS. The Gallardo will give Bragging Rights to all those that choose the Lambo, thus leaving the last generation of Conspicous Consumers wanting. ;-) | ||
| KCCK (Kenneth)
Member Username: Kenneth Post Number: 452 Registered: 10-2002 |
Wow, all these interesting posts whilst I was away for just a day. What a great crowd. | ||
| David Stoeppelwerth (Racerdj)
Member Username: Racerdj Post Number: 322 Registered: 1-2003 |
One thing further, currently owning a ZO6 and 360 at 3x the price, There is no comparison between the two! I will not however visit the ZO6.com website and bash, name call and insult the others. Personally I'm glad there is competition in the exotic car market. It improves your favorite car line. | ||
| David Stoeppelwerth (Racerdj)
Member Username: Racerdj Post Number: 321 Registered: 1-2003 |
"I could have bought a Murci. I didn't. I could have bought a Diablo. I didn't. I could have bought a 360 Spider. I gladly did. If I was solely concerned with performance, I would buy a Z06 or Viper, mod the heck out of it, and smoke any car, anytime, anywhere. Clax great statement. Alan like I stated beforer, the only girly thing about a 360 is all the women it attracts and in my case I does me no good. I enjoy the constructive comments made by others but when you name call others, I only wish your daycare had extended hours! Please go spend your time on Lambochat.com or whereever. One thing is for sure, you will not see any of us lowering to your level on that site. | ||
| Clax (Clax)
Junior Member Username: Clax Post Number: 77 Registered: 10-2002 |
Wmhart, Nice post. I agree. | ||
| Clax (Clax)
Junior Member Username: Clax Post Number: 76 Registered: 10-2002 |
Fiedler, Here's the bottom line: I could have bought a Murci. I didn't. I could have bought a Diablo. I didn't. I could have bought a 360 Spider. I gladly did. If I was solely concerned with performance, I would buy a Z06 or Viper, mod the heck out of it, and smoke any car, anytime, anywhere. Then I suppose if I had your attitude, I would come on this board (and other boards) and badger the members into believing that my car is supreme to all other vehicles. Give your head a shake. Sure, I wish my 360 had 500hp. Heck, I wish it had 750hp. But, regardless, I still prefer it over any other offering out there. You don't, and that really is no concern of mine. But here is my bio. I want to drive a car once or twice a week, in fair weather, top down, no drag races, and enjoy it for what it was intended to do. The car you call a girlie car is (in my opinion, and the opinion of many others) the most stunning automotive design in many, many years. Your 355 is a beautiful car, but I prefer the 360. You see where I am going with this? Your preference may not be my preference. The difference between us, however, and the reason why you annoy the h#ll out of everyone on this board, is that you feel that it is necessary to impose your preferences and interests on others, and cannot accept the fact that we may not agree with you. Quit acting like a child, and you will get some respect here. | ||
| Richard Ward (Lomotpk)
New member Username: Lomotpk Post Number: 31 Registered: 5-2003 |
Absolutetly, it needs at least 500 BHP to compete, and it should up the ante and have at least 5 wheels. If all the other cars have 'settled' for 4 wheels, the 460 will need five to keep pushing the envelope. | ||
| J R K (Kenyon)
Member Username: Kenyon Post Number: 520 Registered: 10-2002 |
The 360 needs 500 BHP to be a proper contender with lambo etc... | ||
| Richard Ward (Lomotpk)
New member Username: Lomotpk Post Number: 30 Registered: 5-2003 |
Hubert, a kindred spirit! I took all mats, sound proofing and carpets out of my 930 as well, the better to savour the essence! Ah Esprit de Corp! | ||
| PSk (Psk)
Member Username: Psk Post Number: 717 Registered: 11-2002 |
Actually that it is not true. A car that is fast on the road and works well on bumpy, crappy public roads and for all weather conditions does NOT necessarily work well on a super smooth race track. A car that is setup for very high top speed ... will not be fast on a tight and twisty track, or almost any track for that matter, because power and acceleration out of a corner is what matters, not top speed. This is why the quoted 200 million miles per hour top speed of most supercars are irrelevant as they might take 2 days to get there. Compare a F40 to a F550 ... similar top speeds but the F40 would be able to stop and have a cup of tea before the F550 got to that speed. So no almost completely different requirements. Pete ps: Top speed is as irrelevant as arguing over whose •••• is the longest ... as it is the person that pleases his partner the most that actual has the goods ... | ||
| James Lee (Aventino)
New member Username: Aventino Post Number: 20 Registered: 6-2003 |
Pete, the supercar that performs well on the road should perform well on the track shouldn't it? So if you can give Alan a run for his money on say, the Targa Tasmania, then you should also be able to give him a run for his money on the track. A supercar should be something you drive to the track and give a good thrashing to and then drive home again. And I think people do care whats fastest and offers superior overall performance, although it's not easy to quantify. Right now this is where the competition has set the bar and it's up to Ferrari to meet the challenge. People said the same things about superbikes 10 years ago and look how the competition there keeps pushing things along. If Ferrari did anything else they would be resting on their laurels. | ||
| PSk (Psk)
Member Username: Psk Post Number: 715 Registered: 11-2002 |
Hmmm,
Not quite true, many went on about the performance indicating that the Boxer and TR struggled to out pace a Daytona ... but your point is taken. Hmmm, thinking about this more, when Ferrari started it took them over 10 years to make a road car better than their parent company, Alfa Romeo. The 8c2900B made in 1939 had a supercharged straight 8 twin cam, with all independent suspension, including a transaxle, and could do around 140+mph ... the McLaren on its day. Ferrari sportscars until atleast the 250GTO still had beam rear axles and front mounted gearboxes ... thus it may have been the 275GTB that finally upped the technology of the road Ferrari, close to 30 years after the 8c2900B Unfortunately it is not this simple anymore. When Ferrari was founded the goals were simple, because the technology was just starting to develop. Now it is pretty damn good and you can buy 4 door saloon cars that are faster than a 250 GTO. BTW, Ferrari BEFORE the Daytona never really cared whether they were the fastest on the road, as long as they were fastest on the track that is all that matter. Thus you can blame FIAT for moving Ferraris focus and this stupid argument about which car is the fastest road car ... like who f**ken cares! Thus does it make sense for Ferrari to keep making road cars that forever go faster than the one before ... personally NO LONGER. As we have reached road cars that are can go way faster enough. Now I believe Ferrari should concentrate on the other areas not just speed, like Lotus has always and complete the package. I personally could not give a hoot whether Allan's Lambo could piss all over my dream Ferrari on the road ... as long as I can kick his arse on the track, then I am happy. That is what Ferrari is about, not supercars! Pete | ||
| wm hart (Whart)
Intermediate Member Username: Whart Post Number: 1452 Registered: 12-2001 |
'Tis, James Lee, but that of course opened up the philosophical can of worms about where ferrari and its competition are going, where they have been, the meaning of fast cars and exotica italian style, etc. I am with you on making the cars hardcore and would love to see a "decontented" 12 that is all about performance, not luxury touring. As to whether ferrari spa sees the world my way, that's simply above my pay grade. | ||
| James Lee (Aventino)
New member Username: Aventino Post Number: 16 Registered: 6-2003 |
I thought this thread was about the 360 replacement and what Ferrari need to do with it? | ||
| Tenney (Tenney)
Member Username: Tenney Post Number: 421 Registered: 2-2001 |
Jeez, wm, nice job breaking down the "logic" in this one. My flat-footed angle on it has Allan "Big Daddy" Fiedler as the Dino Frank of Lambos. | ||
| David R. (Rodsky)
Junior Member Username: Rodsky Post Number: 125 Registered: 3-2003 |
Mr Hart says - "So, what's your point? That you are driving an exotic Italian which has the potential to go really fast, and for that reason, those of us here who like to drive ferraris on the street or track are losers? I don't think so, but since you won't put yourself or your car where your mouth is, i don't think you have as much credibility here as you think." That is absolutely brilliant and about somes it up - synonymous with poser? | ||
| James Lee (Aventino)
New member Username: Aventino Post Number: 15 Registered: 6-2003 |
Man, this thread has got so pathetic it's got me gagging. I totally agree with James G, the P3/P4 are stunning, achingly beautful, always have and always will be. And they sound glorious and they go. That's what a Ferrari should be, that's what the company's built on. When the Testarossa first appeared in my neighbourhood in '84 it pulled a crowd of like about 50 everywhere it parked and it had the numbers back then, around the corners too, to go with it. Now I read this tripe about "Ferrari's don't have to be about performance" and "I like that it doesn't draw attention". Horsesh*t. The company was built on performance and style and beauty. The thread asks what's the new Modena going to do, well give it what's necessary and make it take on the Gallardo and anybody else. If 60 hp and a few pounds saved here and there aren't enough then go back to the drawing board. My local dealer tells me the 360 is eating into 575 sales so take me back to '84 and give me a top dog Ferrari replacement for the 575m, something as stunning today that gives the Murce a run for its money. It's going to have to be pretty special to give it daylight over a new Gallardo bashing Modena, so do it. If you want a car for big distance cruising then buy a 456 or it's replacement. THAT'S why it has GT after it's name. Don't soften up the 575M, make it harder, wilder, take it closer to the Enzo instead. When's Luca resigning for crissakes, I'm sending in my CV. | ||
| Ralph Koslin (Ralfabco)
Member Username: Ralfabco Post Number: 464 Registered: 3-2002 |
Scotty their are plenty of Vipers / Ego Jets / F-16C's in Phoenix. | ||
| Taek-Ho Kwon (Stickanddice)
Intermediate Member Username: Stickanddice Post Number: 1523 Registered: 11-2002 |
Ernesto, I'm with you on that one. When a car attracts attention, the attention is usually not good. Cheers | ||
| allan fiedler (Allanlambo)
Member Username: Allanlambo Post Number: 692 Registered: 6-2002 |
As of now, i resort to doing high speed runs by myself to Sedona and back. Thats my fun. All i can find out here to do, other than the occasional highway race. | ||
| Ernesto (T88power)
Intermediate Member Username: T88power Post Number: 1591 Registered: 2-2001 |
Who cares how much attention a car attracts? For me, the less attention the better. Ernesto | ||
| Taek-Ho Kwon (Stickanddice)
Intermediate Member Username: Stickanddice Post Number: 1520 Registered: 11-2002 |
Scotty, I've seen a 360 Modena attract less attention than a 512TR when parked side by side. The car is definitely understated considering what it is. Cheers | ||
| Scotty (Pzerowaster)
Junior Member Username: Pzerowaster Post Number: 101 Registered: 10-2002 |
Allan F., If a RED 360 modena doesn't draw the attention of the other doctor's cars... I can only ask one question... WHAT THE F#CK ARE THE THE OTHER DOCTORS DRIVING TO WORK!?!?! Dude, I gotta know! That statment made me laugh out loud. That's gotta be a crazy freakin' parking lot where he works. Are there some F-16's parked there? LOFL! Sorry for the expletives. Man, this thread has been a real fry! | ||
| "The Don" (The_don)
Senior Member Username: The_don Post Number: 5911 Registered: 8-2002 |
Pete
That will never be acceptable to Allan | ||
| wm hart (Whart)
Intermediate Member Username: Whart Post Number: 1449 Registered: 12-2001 |
Man, i get the impression people enjoy the argument here so much that the real points simply get missed. Allan: you were called out because you are always pissing over everybody about how ferrari is outdone by Lambo. And even those here that like Lambos have a hard time supporting you because you won't relent, even when people agree with you. Nobody said your car would lose at the track because its too fast. The car is big, and probably a little unwieldy on tight corners, but that doesn't take away from what the car can do. There are folks out on the west coast that run Lambos in Death Valley and my impression is they go for top speeds in grueling conditions which is another form of testing the car and the driver. I will always bet on the driver over the car unless the cars are so totally mismatched as to make it impossible. But, if you aren't tracking it (i don't have much track time either, but am looking for more, in the right car), and you aren't driving it at speed out in the middle of nowhere, what are you doing with it other than good ole american drag racing? And, for that, i have motorheads down at the Amoco here who could bury you in a Camaro. So, what's your point? That you are driving an exotic Italian which has the potential to go really fast, and for that reason, those of us here who like to drive ferraris on the street or track are losers? I don't think so, but since you won't put yourself or your car where your mouth is, i don't think you have as much credibility here as you think. While i'm sure you can come back with some smart-assed retort, what is it that you are defending? The honor of Lambo? That, at least to me and several others here, was not in doubt in the first place. I find your posts interesting and provocative, to a point.But, once it is reduced to "i can kick your ass" (or, as you usually post, my car can kick your car's ass)you better have the stuff to back it up; or, simply stop jabbing people here for the pleasure of it, and pretend to be a gentleman. Sometimes, practiced behavior can even become second nature. | ||
| PSk (Psk)
Member Username: Psk Post Number: 714 Registered: 11-2002 |
Yes, that Porsche would take some taming. Like you say best to walk before you run ... I started racing in a MGB, thus I crawled for my first season, but in hindsight was a good way to learn what it is all about. Unfortunately these threads are always going to end up with a challenge. Maybe we should just accept that Ferraris are bought by people who prefer Ferraris, and Lamborginis are bought by people who prefer Lamborginis. They are both exciting cars ... Pete | ||
| allan fiedler (Allanlambo)
Member Username: Allanlambo Post Number: 690 Registered: 6-2002 |
Psk, im not worried about the dangers of tracking a car, its just that out here in Arizona, there really havent been any track events to go to. I have spoken to a few of the guys in the Ferrari club here about organizing an event, and no one seemed to interested. Now im moving to Maui, and i dont know if there even is a track out there. From what i hear there is a dragstrip though. Id love to take my car out the track events. Just in the past in Florida, the ones they have had have never coincided with my work schedule, and when i did get to go, it was in my Porsche, which was way to fast for a novice like me, 2490pds wet, 714rwhp. | ||
| PSk (Psk)
Member Username: Psk Post Number: 713 Registered: 11-2002 |
Gee James, That must have been terrible. September 11 2001 was my daughters first birthday. We woke up not knowing what had happened and turned the TV on for the kids programs, only to see planes flying into buildings. Her first birthday did not happen. I feel for all those involved, and it deeply affected my family over here and I was not even directly involved. God bless them all, and bravo for all New Yorkers and Americans for getting on with the job ... Pete | ||
| James Glickenhaus (Napolis)
Intermediate Member Username: Napolis Post Number: 2053 Registered: 10-2002 |
Pete On sept. 11 my partner was on the phone to his son when the plane hit. The only thing that's really dangerous is not enjoying the very short time we have. | ||
| PSk (Psk)
Member Username: Psk Post Number: 709 Registered: 11-2002 |
James, Sort these (some of them) bunch of pussies out about the dangers of tracking a car. You have lapped many tracks and they may listen to you. Why they think that driving around a near empty piece of ashfelt with no opposing traffic, no traffic lights, no stop signs, no worries about using indicators, no pedestrians, far better quality road, no resent diesel spill from a truck that is falling to bits ... is dangerous is beyong me. I have had to dodge 3 or 4 potential head on accidents in my 20 years driving ... one of those was an idiot racing on the road, probably thought tracking a car was dangerous! Frustrated Pete | ||
| James Glickenhaus (Napolis)
Intermediate Member Username: Napolis Post Number: 2050 Registered: 10-2002 |
Allan I am one the few people who have actually raced against a Lambo on a track. (A hillclimb). The Goodwood Festival of speed. I was in my MK-IV. Eddie Irvine in an F1 Ferrari did about a 50 sec run. I was slower about a minute 10 sec. The Diablo GTR was only 30 seconds slower than me. Must have been the driver... | ||
| PSk (Psk)
Member Username: Psk Post Number: 707 Registered: 11-2002 |
Crashing on the track and hurting yourself is because you DID NOT listen to ALL the advice before jumping in and letting the blood flow to your head. There is absolutely nothing dangerous about tracking your car ... especially if you are on the track by yourself. What is the difference between driving on the road? Absolutely nothing! The MOST IMPORTANT THING TO REMEMBER is to drive at YOUR own ability levels, and control your excitment. You do have control of yourself don't you!! People that crash and are not racing for a championship are idiots (unless mechanical failure, etc.). You can lift off and go slower you know. These people are so insecure about their abilities that they let themselves get talked into driving above themselves and put themselves and other track users in danger. So Alan, track your car. So you lose in the lap time department, but in all straight line tests you probably will win (you have plenty of experience here ... ie. 1/4 mile time) and you will not hurt your car ... if you remember that crashing your car is not worth it ... after all it is just your ego up for grabs. I have raced cars in my younger years for around 9 years, and yes I have had accidents, but I was RACING in a championship so it was worth the extra risk to go that bit harder to ME. But I have done many, many thousands of perfectly safe track laps and had a blast, because I never drive above MY level as I want to take the car home and drive to work on Monday ... but if it was my race car, well if it gets bent who cares ... that is what it is for. So for God sake stop preaching BS and saying that tracking a car is dangerous ... FAR safer than hooning around on any public road, where a child might step out and get in the way, etc. You are incontrol of the accelerator ... aren't you. Adrian, I suggest you buy an oxygen tent and never go outside. Wake up and smell the roses, mate. Most track days allow beginner to have the track to themselves, or atleast with large gaps between the cars ... why do you think this is dangerous?. Living is dangerous man ... even having sex is dangerous, can cause blood vessels to pop in your eyes or atleast raise your blood pressure ... it is called living! Pete | ||
| Hubert Otlik (Hugh)
Intermediate Member Username: Hugh Post Number: 1060 Registered: 1-2002 |
james: i have a picture of the virgin mary. never know when your times up. ps: james, when you gonna be at the historics? email me offline: [email protected] if you get a minute. | ||
| James Glickenhaus (Napolis)
Intermediate Member Username: Napolis Post Number: 2049 Registered: 10-2002 |
Hugh Real cars are like yours. No carpets, no floor mats. My P4 has a piece of sandpaper glued to the floor but that's ok right? WM Betting on Hugh is like betting that the sun's gonna rise. | ||
| allan fiedler (Allanlambo)
Member Username: Allanlambo Post Number: 689 Registered: 6-2002 |
So what you guys are really saying is that the Lambo is really way to fast to be driven on a track, while since the Ferrari is slow, it is far more suited to the track! I can live with that. As for racing on the track, thats a great comparison, me race William, who has tons of track time, in a modified 512 setup for track racing. Hmmm even i can concede that he would beat me. Thats me though, not someone with experience on the track. I will tell you this, i will wipe the floor with his car in 0-60 and 1/4 mph, 0-150 or 0-200mph acceleration. I dont know if Ferrari will ever read any of our posts, but i just looked at the new issue of FHM magazine, where they do a report on the new Gallardo, and it seems they owe me money for using my quotes " With 500hp, the Gallardo will wipe the girlie Ferrari 360 into oblivion" Lol, couldnt of said it better myself! As for the back of the new SRT, nah, i like the orignal clownshoe mutch better. | ||
| Hubert Otlik (Hugh)
Intermediate Member Username: Hugh Post Number: 1059 Registered: 1-2002 |
mike: you're right. different car. different people. and, different means. however, when someone (anyone) goes atop the podium and starts going on and on about performance without really having a pragmatic understanding of what "performance" is, then they need to stop. it's fine if you like cars, fast cars even, but don't pretend to know what the car can do. bench racing is bench racing, and people like to talk until it's not funny. like the 5'5" guy that weighs 125 telling you he's gonna bench 415; it's funny, until he tries it. my point is: no car is a monolith of perfection, and since that's the case, there will never be a "best" car, ever. i like zymol and shades of neutral to adorn my liscense plate frame, anyone? beuller? | ||
| Martin - Cavallino Motors (Miami348ts)
Senior Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 5153 Registered: 5-2001 |
My guess is that Audi is starting to use the Lambo brand to implement some of their racing knowledge from the LM series into the new Lambos and eventually make a step forward to a racing competitive Lambo for the LM series GTS or GT as a factory team. This may take a few more years but that would be my goal if I would be the CEO of Audi. With that said Ferrari will start to get a good competitor. With lambo being helped by thier parent Audi Ferrari will have a hard time getting money from their parent Fiat to keep up. | ||
| Martin - Cavallino Motors (Miami348ts)
Senior Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 5152 Registered: 5-2001 |
Adrian, and here is my point.... If you crash and hurt the car and yourself you can not drive properly. So you have all this HP and all you are capable off is running it into the tire barrier. If you do proper driving classes and respect your car and start leaning from your car you can go on a track give 9/10 and be safe and have a great time. The problem most people have is Testosterone overflow. Guys on the track driving to impress others instead of improving their own skills. You can see it on any club event or driving day at your local race way. It is not a Ferrari or Lambo specific problem but has to do with engines and the male species. | ||
| Hubert Otlik (Hugh)
Intermediate Member Username: Hugh Post Number: 1058 Registered: 1-2002 |
richard: i'm unable to comment, as i've been getting in touch with my femminine side lately ( i was born to be a diva, i just know it) however, it seems that my car's lacking any carpeting, and is sans floor mats. bareback, if you will. the bare metal underside has a brilliant luster, though. thoughts? | ||
| Mike Clark (Vipersrt)
Junior Member Username: Vipersrt Post Number: 117 Registered: 10-2002 |
I think we should get the fiddler man out there so we can hand it too him. You like the rear end of the new SRT? ---- In all fairness, there are different cars for different people and different people value different things (HP, 0-60, track, etc.). So go be yourself and drive what you want. Trash talking is kind of fun though. | ||
| Martin - Cavallino Motors (Miami348ts)
Senior Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 5151 Registered: 5-2001 |
I love Lambos, Allan knows that. Love the Diablo over the Muci any day. It is an incredible machine and has awesome power. Of all the Lambo owners I know (and that is quite a bit) I know only one that can manage this car to close to its capability. They are very hard to drive on the track. Have great sprint speed but lack corner handling and easily break out on you if you can not handle your throttle good. All said most Lambo owners will not be able to handle their cars so what is the point of having 500+HP. And yes that same comment holds true to the Ferrari owners that have never seen a track in their life. Not that there is anything wrong with that. I personally think though that those people that can not put the power down should refraim from making comments about this is better than that. As for a comparison between an Enzo and a Muci: Yes you can indeed compare them. Ferrari has to recover their engineering investment within 400 units. This is where most of the money is going when producing cars. The material of the Enzo is worth a few bucks, the man hours is with a few thousand but the engineering is a killer here. So compare now Lambo producing 400 uits a year and running the same production for 10 years. That is a total of 4000 cars and yet the engineering is done only once. If Ferrari would have elected to run the Enzo as a side production car with 400 units per year for 5 years they could have dropped the price down to $ 300,000 and compete with the Lambo. Same with Corvettes. They produce hundreds of thousands of the same Corvette and recouperate percetages over those numbers not 4000 units like the Lambo or 400 units like the Enzo. This is where the price difference between these equal cars comes into play. | ||
| Richard Ward (Lomotpk)
New member Username: Lomotpk Post Number: 28 Registered: 5-2003 |
Hubert, it seems the debate is hotly contested between those that feel virgin wool is the only "manly" type of floor mat, and those that prefer a dacron/mylar blend for its 'performance'. I'd be interested in your thoughts on the matter... | ||
| adrian low (Audionut)
Member Username: Audionut Post Number: 277 Registered: 4-2003 |
Rob, it's cool. I know you have passion, and I truly appreciate all the work that you put in to this site. I really enjoy visiting it! I've often wondered about taking driving lessons at achools, but I cannot justify the potential for things to go wrong. In the last 3 years, I have heard from my friend that a few Porsches, 2 Ferrari 355s, and others I cannot remember were damaged beyond simple repair. In one case, the doctor/driver broke his leg and had to take a lot of time off. His "boss" no longer allows him to go to the track. I could not afford, neither financially nor the pressure at home, to get into that mess. And so, "Monday" quarterbacking is as much as I can do now. Plus, it IS a lot of fun, talking about what "should" and "could" be, don't you agree? Funny how different cars speak to us. I LOVE my Dino 246, but feel a lot differently about the 328. As a matter of fact, the dealer called me today. Seems that there is a real need for cars and is wondering if I want to sell the 328... I've only had it for 1 month! Should I do it? Would LOVE to get a Testa, but hardly any NICE ones available at reasonable prices in Canada. Most are either storied or less than mint and WAAAY to much $. What do you think, guys? | ||
| Pat Pasqualini (Enzo)
Member Username: Enzo Post Number: 752 Registered: 2-2002 |
Love that truck Martin!! Is that the Ferrari driving club's pace car? | ||
| Martin - Cavallino Motors (Miami348ts)
Senior Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 5150 Registered: 5-2001 |
My comment was not directed at Allan. He is included in this but not directed at him. It is to all those newspaper-comparers-but-never-try-to-see-those-numbers-in-person specialists. Those numbers mean squad if you can not use them. After that it all becomes "I like the car and drive it for looks" in which case you might as well be driving this:  | ||
| Hubert Otlik (Hugh)
Intermediate Member Username: Hugh Post Number: 1057 Registered: 1-2002 |
>>Allan won't drive on the track and he admits that.<< Alright, I give up. Anyone under this credo that even begins to talk about performance should just stop themselves. Bill: Thank you very much for the vote of confidence. Anyway, if you boys wanna play, let's do it. Buttonwillow here in CA is 5000 total for an 8 hour day (cornerworkers, ambulance, race gas pump, tire shop, the whole nine yards) that's ONE 30k service on an fcar. if you wanna play, let's go. there's a skid pad, a slalom course, and even a long enough straight for 1/4 mile and 0-60 runs. and a big ole track. pick the tires, brake fluid, and pads and lets do it. i'll even try to get some sponsors to comp some supplies, and maybe even some magazine coverage. otherwise, all those talking, unwilling to put it down, should just stop commenting unless of course it's on build quality and other "tactile" nuances that jagovs like me don't care about. so, how's the wax, fish emblem, liscense plate frame, and floor mat debate going? |