what happened to 0446 & 0424

0446 [#1] 735S sold or leased to Francois Piicard in 1954. Raced by Picard in 1954, raced by Paul Maret in 1955. Late 1955 returned to Ferrari by Picard and exchanged for 0556 500 Mondiale which was renumbered to 0446 for carnet reasons. This is now 0446 {#2]. Forza #31 states that 0446{#1] may have been rebuilt as a 750 from the 735, renumbered to 0502 and sold as new to Bill Doheney for Ernie McAfee to race in1955in America This puts this car in two places at the same time as 0446[#1]
was being raced by Maret in Europe in 1955. So what happened to 0446[#1]? Was it renumbered to 0556 and if so did it have 500, 735 or 750 engine or was it just "never built"
Now 0424 was also an exchaange for 0564 which was the #7th series II Mondiale. 0564 was renumbered at the factory to 0424 presumably for the same carnet reasons. So what happened to the original 0424? Lets hear from you Mondiale/Monza experts. tongascrew

 

We have owned the series II 500 Mondial, 0556(0446)MD since 1960. The convention for the renumbered cars is to put the sequential number first (i.e., the s/n the car SHOULD have received) followed by the parenthetical of the telaio number the factory actually gave the car. I will post a more complete history later tonight. Through no fault of your own, you have repeated the incorrrect statement that 0556 was "re-numbered" to 0446. This error comes from barchetta.cc although they were informed of this error (and other regarding the cars' histories) many years ago. 0556(0446)MD has never worn any other number other than "0446" - there is no evidence of re-stamping. By virtue of timing, Picard traded the 735 Sport that originally wore 0446 as the 500 Mondial was being prepared at the factory. It was stamped "0446" and handed over to Picard in May 1955.

The theory you describe from Forza 31 involving 0502M is incorrect - I'll have to go back and check that issue. The 735S that was originally 0446 and subsequently 0556, still wears 0556 today, living in France. It has always had and still has a 735 motor. This car has no relation to the 750 Monza 0502M.

I have a picture of the 735S 0446(0556) together in the same race w/ the 500 Mondial 0556(0446)MD. The race is the 1955 GP of Venezuela (November 55); the 735S is driven by DeGraffenreid and the 500 Mondial is driven by Castellotti. It caused a whole lot of head-scratching to figure out that one when we first started our serious research into these cars 25 years ago! I'll have to post it later - it is not on this computer.

Regarding 0424/0564. You are correct that this is a carnet/tax-driven renumbering by the factory. The whereabouts of the original 0424 - a Pininfarina-bodied Series I 500 Mondial -are unknown.

 

I do know that there is a 500 Mondial in Southern Italy that is owned by the Marchese Luigi di Francia... His doesn't appear on any of the databases... Of the 30ish built how many are AWOL? I know that he's had it for quite some time... I don't think it has run in ages--the gentleman is in his 90's...

I'll be back south next week and will take some pictures for you to confirm. (no worries I'll try to get a picture with a chassis number in there)

Best,
M

 

that would be fantastic, Max. You are correct - there were about 20 Series I Mondials (both PF-bodied and Scaglietti-bodied) and, in our opinion, 8 Series II cars.

 

maximillion, Yes please. The more photos the better. Any info you can get about the history of this car would be great. Even if you can't get a picture if the ID plate just a statement of the sn number will do.We wi;ll lookforward to you efforts. tongascrew

 

Thanks for you info. I have a small copy of your photo from Venezuela 1955 but it is hard to tell which car is which. Can you help. Thanks tongascrew

 

His car was the number 8...

 

this is the photo - I have posted it before on F-chat. The #8 car is the S. II 500 Mondial 0556(0446)MD. The car immediately behind it is the 735S 0446(0556). Eugenio Castellotti is at the wheel of #8; it is the only picture we have of him driving the car. Harry Schell started the race in the car but was relieved by EC.
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Hello Bryan, who do you think is sitting in the car in this pic? Harry? Please say hello to your father.
Best
Boudewijn
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Boudewijn,

That's cool! I haven't seen that picture before.

Regards,

Art S.

 

thanks, Boudewijn, I'll pass that on. My guess is that a Ferrari mechanic is driving in that shot, only because of the tell-tale khaki overalls that the Ferrari crews wore in that period. You can also clearly see the SF shield that was put on only for this race. Before this race, it was a privateer car owned and raced by Picard and then by Munaron - not as a works car, so no shields. This shot shows the staging area before the race; we have this shot and others that I believe were taken from a hotel balcony. It's amazing how dark blue the car is in that shot. We were fortunate enough to find areas of original, non-UV damaged French Racing Blue behind the bezels of the gauges - so we have been able to come up w/ an exact color match and not have to depend on the few color photographs of the period. Rubirosa bought the car right after the GP and painted it dark blue in time for the '56 12 Hours of Sebring where he and Jim Pauley drove it to first in class (#33).

 

This is a terrific discussion, the very best part of FChat. Bravo all.

 

Max - I'm bumping this thread back to the top to see if you had a chance to see/photograph the Mondial.

 

A very nice article (and update) of the 500 Mondial #0424 from the carbuildindex.com.

?Preserved?, ?Patina?, ?Originality?- there, we used all the catch phrases! A 1955 Ferrari 500 Mondial bodied by Scaglietti | Car Build Index

And it goes for auction for about $5,000,000 - $6,500,000

1955 Ferrari 500 Mondial by Scaglietti | New York - Driven By Disruption 2015 | RM Sotheby's

I find it very, very beautiful. French racing blue looks really great.

 

I want to make certain that you know that this Series II 500 Mondial is 0564(0424)/MD and not the original 0424/MD (a Series I 500 Mondial). By using the label 0564(0424)/MD I indicate that it was 0564 in manufacturing sequence but stamped 0424 for various reasons.

Best regards,

 

I admit that this was unknown to me.

Thank you for the clarification.

 

You are welcome. I do wonder where the original 0424/MD is now.

Best regards,

 

Well, the factory in April 2011 has certified the blue car 0564 MD as 0424.

Marcel Massini
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Dear Marcel,

We should both now throw away our contrary files since the factory has spoken!

Best regards,

 

Hi Robert and Marcel,
There was a reason for that. The car is stamped as 424. This is the only number that can be read stamped ( as the number underneath while possibly visible with some advance technology,,) cannot be read with normal eyes.
But the car was sold as 424MD when sold by Ferrari to Du Montant ( this is actually the interesting part of the story, as Ferrari kept the car in lieu of payment of the work and finally sold it with the approval of Dupont for the price of work plus the price of 20 years of storage!) there is an official invoice to that effect, so the factory accepted the evidence ( of the invoice) and recognized it was 424MD and therefore avoided to decide which number it was before,,,

Robert I don't know if you certified your car, but I am sure that certifying cars which have been re stamped is a complex process as the factory will hesitate to confirm they did so and ask for proof which is obviously very difficult to find and show.
Incidentally and referring to another car in same sale, they are not the only ones, seem Mercedes has some difficulties to open its files for cars that seem to have been raced by the factory and then sold as new cars to other customers,,,for obvious reasons...if the story is correct.

 

This is also why I am using, sorry Admiral to contradict you, the reverse number logic and always used 424 (564) because when you change identity(?!?) or gender ( for those who did) your official identity is indeed the new one...I am sure the VIN number on the UK car is 424 MD and I am sure it was the identification on the previous German brief ( paper).
I think your car is registered, what is the VIN number for it?
Thanks

 

Interesting.

Thank you again.

 

Dear Pierre,

We will be forever stuck in the legal fiction of our two cars. We both know that your (former) 500 Mondial Series II was built and delivered a year after the original serial 0424/MD was first used on a 500 Mondial Series I car. We also know that my car was built a year after the original serial 0446/MD was used on a 735 Sport.

The current crop of civil servants in the motor vehicle departments go simplistically by the stamping on the chassis, so the legal fiction continues as your car was registered as 0424/MD and mine is registered as 0446/MD. This bureaucratic process does nothing to change the fact that your car was built sequentially as 0564/MD and mine as 0556/MD. Hence over the past many years, at least in the historians nomenclature, the cars are generally known for example as 0556(0446)/MD which reads “0556 stamped as 0446.” Gerald Roush suggested this format many years ago to also simplify his automated sequencing by serial numbers in his file.

I am really surprised that the factory now acknowledges the fact that they have sold new cars a year apart with the same serial numbers. One would have thought that their legal department would have had second thoughts about such an admission as I suspect that it was an illegal act. One wonders what the factory will do some day when the original 0424/MD surfaces and applies for certification.

Best regards,

PS Sorry dinner in Monterey did not work out, perhaps at Cavallino in January?

Robert

 

I for one have very hard time understanding this numbering system. There are so many different cases of renumbered cars that trying to use a standardized way of describing them all makes things very difficult. Some of the cases are so hard to follow that we really don't need a secret code to make things more complicated. In some of the cases we don't even necessarily know the original serial number...

 

Oh they did similar things still in the early 90ies, one of my 600 SEC Coupe was sold by them to me as 1995 model car according to the contract and their words, but as i later figured out is was built a couple of years earlier (1993)...

and yes my seller was not a small stealer-dealer, but the factory itself...

Ben