355 CHECK THOSE FUEL INJECTOR/PUMP RELAYS

After thirteen challenging years of owning my Euro delivered, 23,000 mile 1995 355 Spider, thirty-one years of total Ferrari ownership, I find myself constantly tested. After my "rockstar" mechanic of over twenty-five years, Brian Crall, left me for "greener pastures" in Texas five years ago, I find myself on my own yet to strike up a relationship with a new mechanic. Always my best to Brian but finding a new Ferrari mechanic is like looking for a new pediatrician for your kid or a doctor for yourself. Trust is the most important factor and at my age, my doctor knows far too much about me. Think about it. Forgive me as I digress, but point being, I am currently my Ferrari mechanic and have no advanced diagnostic tools.

I am sure I am not the only 355 owner to have their car start throwing warning lights and going into "limp" mode after running perfectly. It's happened to me a handful of times. Usually the problem fixes itself for some unknown reason or needs a little "nudge" with a simple MAF cleaning. Those of us running oil bathed air filters know that it is common for the intake to draw some of that oil into the MAF sensor and foul it. Simple fix but alarming if you find yourself on the road. The other day, after two weeks in the garage, I started the car to find it throwing a "5-8" warning and running on four cylinders. Cleaning the MAF didn't get me there this time. Now I'm in a panic as I am here in California, I am two months from my registration and I need a "SMOG" to get it. While two months sound like a long time, in the world of Ferrari, sorting this problem is like having ten seconds to get it done. Especially with no mechanic and not wanting this chariot on the "hook."

I immediately consulted the FerrariChat archives and found a wealth of helpful hints from other owners. I first checked the Cat ECUs and swapped them side to side to see if I could change the warning lights from 5-8 to 1-4. No change. This is good because this little box is quite expensive, there are two, and I usually change both parts. Apparently, they are both working. If you don't already do this, any electrical connections you open should be cleaned and coated with dielectric grease because these cars hate moisture.

Next up were the thermocouples. Disconnecting them did nothing to the warning lights. Same goes for the Ox sensors.

Now the plan was just to order two thermocouples and two Ox sensors from my "go to guy" through the years, Daniel at Ricambi. Suddenly, a light bulb went off and I thought maybe I should check the fuse box. No way it could be that simple. Pulled all the appropriate fuses only to find them all intact. I decided to play with the many fuel relays and when I swapped the fuel injector relays, the warning lights changed banks. What have I stumbled on? Now after turning the ignition key on, the lights began cycling properly. I fired the car and backed it out of the garage and ran it for fifteen minutes to reboot the computer and it runs perfectly again. Only problem is, it is running with the same relays I started with meaning there is an intermittent problem that could resurface. Is it any wonder that the joys of owning and driving these cars is tempered with the fear that something will go wrong? Anyway, I contacted Daniel and ordered a handful of relays and will replace most of them when the parts arrive. For all I know, tomorrow the car might act up again but I am going to fire it up and get it to the smog station before it slaps me in the face again.

Fellow Ferrari owners, I am sure this problem is not exclusive to the 355, check those relays first when you start throwing warning lights. You might find the problem is far more simple than you feared. Hope I've helped someone as many other owners have certainly helped me.

 

I actually had this exact problem about a week ago. Car sat for a few weeks. Started it up, and it was stumbling / missing on Bank 1-4. Very odd as my car is usually rock solid and reliable. A quick restart cleared it up and fixed the problem, but after reading this, im swapping out the relays just to be safe

Good thing I keep extra Relays / Fuses in the tool kit

 

I don't know how you guys own those things.

I replaced every single relay in the passenger foot well panel and the front panel. Things on these care are old so it pays to go through and replace everything that is a problem, temp sensors, crank sensors, relays, switches, thermoplastic, thermostores, fans, thermostat, rebuild alternator, everythnig. Never understood wait till you beak down, they are all going to have issues MOSTLY because of consumable parts that in aircraft world would be called high time components, meaning replace BEFORE failure.

Yes it costs but so does breaking down 200 miles from home. Multiple times.

 

Pull the fuse box out and check the connections on the back, they get super wonly after time. Done a few of them

 

Appreciated Ferrarium's 'Replace Before Failure' post. Has anyone compiled an Anticipated Component Life - Preventive Maintenance Schedule? I understand different driving styles, mileage, climates etc. affect component life. Never-the-less it would be helpful to know Anticipated Component Life Expectancies for parts from relays to radiators. Forewarned being forearmed.

 

Not sure but 20+ years is beyond most specs I'm sure, climate affects it too. Like I have said before this forum is FILLED with "help" and "cel xxx problem" and "strange problem" other problems as such and they are all common consumable parts that cause it. Spend time analyzing it and you quickly come up with "problem prone" parts. My current list is below but I may be more anal that others but I hate CEL's and want to drive far and often with confidence so my list is long. Shrug. 355's have other issues not on my list I have a 348.
https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/posts/146759476/

 

Good to see that you solved your problem.....Try not to use dielectric grease. Cause more problems than it prevents.

 

All the electrical connections on the 355 are important but the injector connections are embarrassingly coated with dielectric grease from the factory. The boots are also in very bad shape on many 355s thus letting in water and the dielectric grease holds it causing intermittent problems and loss of power. One should have all the injector pins and boots replaced now that they are very old. Check out the pics of one I worked on this past winter. Notice how bad the boots are. The new ones are more silicon like that the OEM plastic like crap. The water tight fit of the new boots is a must.
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In many cases the clamping force is almost none existent on some connection.....Check the gap on the right injector pin in the top pic.

 

No offence, Gerry, but when I see misleading posts like the two above I have to wonder who the #@$% is maintaining these cars. I just pulled one of my 25 yr old injector connectors off my car and snapped this. Dry, clean, and despite the apparent "gap" they go on tight. Never had any problems with the injectors. I also see you took a sip of the golden cool aid.

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We have worked on thousands of Ferraris and the factory used dielectric grease in some connections and none in others. It varies on even the same models. They also used gold to tin in some connections in some cars and not in anothers of the same model and connection. Its weird the way the factory did and still does some things. We have changed all the pins in many 355s going back to over 10 years now and not a problem in any of them and all of them showed an increase in performance and less CELs. The clamping force of many of the pins in these cars is very minimal and causing some of the gremlins in these cars. If you prefer to have a gap in your pins or have old cracked boots then that's up to you. All I go by is the results I have seen.

 

How does one tighten the gap? Use a pick and try and bend it down? Does that then bend the opposing pin the other way? Do you extract them the reinsert them?

Regardless it would be good to get a link to the pin extractor for those connectors incase one cracks. They can get brittle I imagine. Thanks!

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You can if careful enough bend them but they still have lost their clamping force. The best thing to do is replace the pins and the boots. There have been long drawn out discussions on this site about replacing them with "gold" pins and I have had no problem with them and I don't really want to start that debate again. You can buy replacement pins on line but one needs to make sure that they are of good quality or you may just be wasting your time. The "gold connector kit" sold by Dave Helms in the Denver area are expensive but they are good. Comes with tools, brushes and boots etc. He tested the clamping force and they were good for over 110 disconnects and re-connects where as the OEM pins Ive heard are only good for about 10 - 20. The last 355 I worked on, I replaced well over 100 pins. The main harness (5.2) is the most challenging as there are over 60 pins there alone. Here is one almost completed.
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Ferrari used gold in the connectors where the male counter part had gold pins. From hanging around here for 9 years I would say the majority of CELs discussed here are 5.2 down stream O2 sensor or SDL related, often on cars with modified exhaust. I don't see a lot of MAF, TPS, Idle control valve, injector, crank sensor, cam position sensor, knock sensor related CELs. And the O2 sensors don't even used the same type of connector. The old, much ballyhooed "gremlins" line just doesn't hold up. As for clamping force, have you measured it? Do you know what is required? Is more actually better? Or are you just repeating an old BS line that has been passed down to you? Same for performance. How did you measure it? I've never seen any such claims substantiated with data. Just hearsay. Back in the 60's I just knew my Z28 ran better after I washed and waxed it.

Replace the pins with the appropriate type.

No need to buy a pin extractor. Easily made. And if you insist on gold, buy them from DigiKey or Mouser for about $0.30 to $0.60 each.


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Digi-Key Part Number A107009CT-ND
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I was more concerned about replacing boots or housings not replacing with gold.

I know in my MAF and TPS etc it's the male pins that corrode in my case only slightly. I used deoxit with brush let it set and used ultra light scotchbrite briefly next day and cleaned with terminal spray. Little stabilant and back tofether. They are as good as new, not sure the gold will help unless in a harsh environment or you do both sides?



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Automotive manufactures do not mix metals in the electrical system, Gold on gold, tin on tin, etc. All connector manufactures tell you not to mix metals. A number of manufactures have issued recalls to correct such mistakes including BMW and Jaguar. As with Gerry, I really don't want to rehash the issue other than to say it is in a harsh environment where mixed metals would be worse, not better. I don't know if it's true on the 348, but on my 95 355 all the connectors are tin because the pins on what they connect to are tin, except for one, the TPS. The TPS has gold pins so Ferrari, knowing what they are doing, put gold contacts in the connector.

Re: Boots, the correct accordion type are harder to find but they are around. Check Ebay. You may have to buy a complete connector kit, but they are pretty cheap if you buy an 8 pack.
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32842759189.html?scm=1007.22893.141295.0&pvid=551ef9da-5594-4d06-8dc8-13ff70a76e17&onelink_page_from=ITEM_DETAIL&onelink_item_to=32842759189&onelink_duration=1.321481&onelink_status=noneresult&onelink_item_from=32842759189&onelink_page_to=ITEM_DETAIL&dp=35359-10469.7212832&aff_platform=api&cpt=1568063975964&sk=NmLGYQNa&aff_trace_key=c83c402aeed5404a83f4632cd054dbdf-1568063975964-09807-NmLGYQNa&terminal_id=35c4dbe13d12480c83f72c03dcf7bf03

And note that the boots are not to keep water out. They are for strain relief and to keep dirt out. Water proof connector have rubber grommets that slide over each wire and press into the back of the connector, as the one in thelink.

 

Actually on some of the 355s I've worked on...the male end was not gold while the clamping pin(female) was gold. No the O2 sensors dont use the same type of connector but we change them anyway. As for clamping force.....My own 355 has had the new pins in for over 10 years and they are still nice and tight. Common sense would tell you that tight connections are better than the one you show from your car. All I know is the cars Ive changed the pins in are running better by far. My car was the first one I did and its still running like a swiss watch. No more gremlins that were very hard to trace and believe me, I have the best tech around at the shop.

 

I wonder if new non gold was used If results would be the same? That is the benefit was replacement not the material?

On cars who knows maybe benifts are there with 1/2 gold maybe not. I do know in the military it's called dis-similar metal corrosion. A no no on aircraft.

Either way lots of info in the post so thanks for the effort and taking time to share.


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Looking at the effort required and potential risks involved in repinning, I'm kind of glad I had the whole engine harness replaced on my car during my last major service. If you mess up the crimp on one pin/socket, you have to cut the pin off the wire which shortens the wire. This adds extra strain on the wire.

 

In most cases, there is plenty of wire. If you've done many pins, you won't make mistakes. Take pictures of all pins and wires before cutting. If you do all the pins and nothing else to your car, you will see a huge difference in performance. Its not just the clamping force in the pins...some of the wires are corroded back where they are clamped to the pin.

 

Most of us don't crimp many wires of course. Ian gave me an idea, a used harness then try re-crimping new connection on that then installing that if it works out.

 

IF there is a problem, new connectors of the correct type will correct it. IF.

There is a guy on here who doesn't post much who drank the cool aid and installed the gold connectors and made a real mess of his car. Fortunately for him some of the more experienced guys stepped in and straightened the car out for him.

But this is another example of if it ain't broke, don't fix it.

 

There are also many owners in here who dont ever see the full potential of their car simply because.

 

Aside from crimping there are other pitfalls. The wires have to be properly stripped. If not done properly there is a chance of nicking several strains of wire which can lead to breakage.

 

Hell, I'm going to buy new OEM harness's for both sides and put them in next major. :shrug: