B-17 and P-63 lost at Dallas CAF show

Midair collision, reports and photos indicate no survivors. Video is disturbing.

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Really sad to see. My condolences to all sides of accident. Wonder what happened in the P63

 

https://youtube.com/shorts/RUWTrppgmSU?feature=share

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Blind spot and bad turning radius would be my guess.

 

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only about 10(?) airworthy examples left.

at least 2 on this list are no more and the first listed is grounded(?)
https://johnweeks.com/b17active/index.html

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Bell P-63 Kingcobra
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bell_P-63_Kingcobra

3(?) left airworthy



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blind spot got him, so does this make 1 flying b-17 left?

 

The P-63 has a bubble type of canopy and the view of the B-17 was above and to the left of the P-63 pilot. His turn was too tight and closing on the B-17 instead of clearing it. As far as I can determine, it was a gross maneuvering error. A B-17 is a big airplane and the P-63 pilot knew where it was. Why make a close , turning pass like that?. Inexcusable.

 

I think you're right Bob. He just made a bad turn at too high a closing speed and misjudged his flight path in the turn.

 

Hot Dog'n it killed everyone.
And I would venture to guess the NTSB investigation will make the same call after the facts come in.

 

If you look at this angle, I believe he didn't see the B17 at the point of impact. But he should have clearly seen it as he was approaching it. Its hard to tell but it looks like he was dropping in altitude.

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Wow Sad!

https://www.tmz.com/2022/11/12/two-planes-collide-crash-wings-over-dallas-airshow-executive-airport/?adid=social-tmzlikeshop

 

Bad day.
RIP
Usually a bad call results in a bit of 'pucker factor' followed by a sigh of relief then, usually, a chewing out. Unfortunately, this wasn't one of those times.
My condolences to all involved, including the machines.
Sincerely,
Art S.

 

I suspect you are right - although it would initially seem unlikely due to the canopy visibility, because of the P-63's blind spot, your explanation would be the simplest and thus the likely explanation of why the P-63 didn't make further changes in the last seconds.

My understanding is the fighters and bombers were flying two separate patterns, which would suggest the P-63 was out of position. The P-63's pilot might have been going wide (off course) and saw the B-17, realized his mistake and pulled in tight and up to get back on course (putting the B-17 in the P-63's blind spot) the inputs weren't aggressive enough causing the P-63 to turn into the B-17 rather than avoiding. If so, a series of bad calls.

Either way; its all speculation at this point.

 

Truly horrible.

 

I think that you are correct , Rob. At first it appeared to me that the P-63 hit the lower fuselage but after exercising some pauses and closer looks in the video, it appears that he hit the upper fuselage. It doesn't matter really because he knew that the B-17 was there and he came in hot , fast, and obviously out of position, and in a tight turn toward the B-17 . I don't understand that part if it was, as they said, "It was a well rehearsed show." Off hand right now I can think of six airplanes that the CAF has destroyed, maybe more.
Seeing the severed tail section of the B-17 immediately brought back memories of my squadron mate, Joe Frank Jones, whose airplane, "Mr. Lucky" was cut in half at the same spot as the "Texas Raider" and Joe Jones, the tail gunner, had to ride it down 13,000 ft. and survived.
I won't count all the airshows that I have flown in but the big Bicentennial air show at Abottsford had a huge flyby of airplanes from WW1, between wars, WW2, and after. We flew all at once in several concentric orbits, (race tracks) with the older and slower machines in the inner tracks and the bigger faster types in the outer tracks. The rules and instructions were carefully gone over at the morning pilot's meeting where spacing and timing was specified and emergency procedures were addressed. There were perhaps 25 to 30 airplanes involved. After assembly and circling the field three times , the landings took place with the little and old stuff in the infield grass and succeeding big stuff in line on the runway. There was not one glitch in the three days that we performed. If you deviated from your time and position , you were grounded. I don't know if the military could have done it any better.

 

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Bob and Rob, I have watched and re-watched the brief video of this event not fewer than fifty times and my take is very different. Bob wrote:

"It doesn't matter really because he knew that the B-17 was there and he came in hot , fast, and obviously out of position, and in a tight turn toward the B-17 . I don't understand that part if it was, as they said, It was a well rehearsed show."

Although we will never know unless the P-39 pilot left a note, but I believe that this was a deliberate suicide attack.