Challenge Stradale Prices Continue to Climb

An excellent post mate and many if not all of your observations are correct IMO. How good the 430 Scud actually is will determine whether 360CS prices rise any more, as you said over the last 2 years CS prices have held solid at £110k to £100k with one 280 mile example up for £138k ($280k ish!!!). I know of a fair few people who brought 430's, were ultimately dissapointed, and ended up buying Strads. The 430 Scud will be quicker, of that there is no doubt, but I feel if they have made a little more user friendly, slightly softer around the edges, as a package the 430 may not be as appealing to the smallish numbers of hard core CS drivers who will then seek their thrills elsewhere....back in a CS, again maintaining prices. If early indications are anything to go by, the first lot of Scuds will be selling at premiums up near £200k, are they REALLY going to be £100k BETTER than a CS?????

 

I have always lusted over a CS a great car no doubt, but eventually I yielded to the F430 just because technology moves on and the F430 was an advancement of the current crop, is it a better car than the CS is a debate that will go on for some time .
Like you said how good the 430S will be is What will determine whether CS prices fall or rise ,IMO fall or maintain value.
I cant honestly see the 430S being worse as a package certainly better but by how much who knows early indications suggests by a lot, and already quicker than an Enzo.
If CS owners jump ship that can only have a knock on effect regarding residual values and that must be on current owners minds for those that care.
worth a 100k more ? personally yes.

 

At some point I expect the CS prices to start sliding. The only thing that might make the CS resist the inevitable slide is the fact that it was a one year production only. I dont believe it is a limited production per se since Ferrari probably made as many as they could sell in one year. However the 12hundred and something CS' made will probably be a lot less than the 430 scuderia numbers since it seems the scuderia will have a longer run. However, I feel that when it comes to cars, newer is better (havent acquired a taste for vintage yet) and I believe the majority does too. The CS is now a thing of the past and I believe most people will start looking for newer and better cars. If given the opportunity, I would trade my CS for the scuderia in a hartbeat.

-Peter

 

The CS is FAR from being classified as vintage and its obviously subjective whether newer is better. Typically selling prices do eventually begin to drop with most standard models however, the CS falls into 'todays' limited category and with the expected premium on the 430 Scud I doubt you'll see much drop in the near future. IMO when the CS does reach vintage status you can be sure market value will far exceed today's by at least 50%.

 

I love my CS, but am on the list of 5 to get a 430S. I still wonder if once we see the 430S, if in all it's glory will it be worth (speed, design, better tech.) $150K more than the CS? I may be in a position when the 430 hits next year to own both. I do not want my CS to go down the road! I think if the 430S is as good as a car as we all hope it will only help the CS market in the long run. $200K for a CS or $325K-$350K for a 430S, some will buy its older brother then move up to the 430S on second market 1-2 years after the 430S hits the street. Demand will cause CS market to stay around $185K-$210K IMO.

 

All this talk of rising Stradale prices...

Next thing you know someone will be offering a life size painting of Schumy and a serialized hat, oh, wait a minute....

 

ah yes!! his red for 219!! the market is strong but not that strong. guys like me are realising the timless beauty and light racy spirit of a strad is worth keeping no matter how fast cars get... after all you can hardly exercise the full potential of a "slow" strad around Malibu, much less most of S CA

andy is getting 220 for low milers in LA right now [<3k], And as ever black then ti are strongest, then argento, and lowest prices for red.

stripe still adds 5k

life size shumy the cheater painting subtracts 15k and loss of face as well

 

It hasn't looked to me like they have been rising, but I would say they are holding steady. As has been said, it is a modern car, which means the newer is still better, so I think it will continue to go down (albeit slowly), particularly those that are driven. But it is just not the same car as the standard 360, and the prices will not follow the same curve. But lets face it, if the 430S is similarly light, similarly raw, shifts faster, has more torque, has better traction control, etc, it is going to devalue the CS, no way around it.



But the 430 S is still in the future, so for now the CS rules.

 

CS will alway be special, primarily because of its very special name. Ferrari will likely never again have a "Street Challenge" car. I heard the CS was built on extra Challenge cars/parts laying around. Does anyone know if that's a fact? It's been quoted several places, including an old CS special on TV.

In the future, the 430 Scuderia will be like the many other 355 and earlier variants. It's still a 430, not a "Challenge Stradale".

Also, there's only 300 or so CSs in the US, and that's not likely to increase. That's 6 in each state. I'd say there's more than 6 people in each state that might want a CS.

Also, kids know them well, expecially with the stripe, due to the media coverage. Those kids will be looking for CSs later.

 

i think you're right the high market prices and unfulfilled demand for the scuedria will keep the cs prices strongand maybe rise initially just like the regular 360 when the 430 just came out but then after the scuedria "cools down" there will be a big dip in market price

 

I can't wait tp see what the 430S market will be. If I had the money to blow I don't know if I would spend 350k on one. I think I would rather add that to a F40 or 288GTO fund. Plenty of money out there, look at the wine prices!!!!

Got to get home, Jason's doing the CTTS!!!

 

Technically they are not lying, there is however a heck of a lot of bending of the truth going on here. The only common part which the 360CS & Challenge cars are using are the bumper fixing/mounting brackets. I kid you not The brackets are lighter on the 360 Challenge cars than the heavier items used on the Modena. The CS used these as part of general weight reduction, nothing drastic but every little helped.

From a road car design point of view the big problem with using challenge race car parts is that they are 100% focused for the best performance on a smooth race track with money no object, maintenance no object design goals. The no compromise approach means replacement of race car parts is done to a completely different schedule than on a road car, something just not acceptable for consumers - e.g. Would you like to have to replace your suspension parts every 12 months? or perhaps a new engine every year? Thought not. For example some challenge parts longevity is much less than is acceptable for a road car, items such as bushes in suspension, engine parts, etc.. Also regulations are much stricter on things like emissions on road cars. Most race car parts are specifically optimisated for the specific applications, for example, to smooth race track courses, suspension settings that would be unsuitable for typical everyday roads. They also require setup for a given track. Road cars suspension is typically setup once for all conditions (i.e. compromised), just like the tyres, etc. need to work in basically all weather conditions. E.g. Racing Slicks are not legal on the road.

It must be said however some of the approaches used in Challenge car production where re-used on the 360cs. For instance Ferrari adopted Resin Transfer Molding (RTM) technology for producing the front and rear bumpers which saved some weight (and sped up the manufacture) from the standard fiber glass approach used to make the Modena bumpers, this RTM approach was used to save weight when making the original Challenge bumpers. Also some more blue-printing of the engine was done, notably polishing of the ports and selection of pistons (weight) to be as close to design specs as possible, etc. but all this was really just extra polish, slight refinements and nothing else. There is no getting away from the fact that the design goal was 20% track usage, 80% road usage with the CS so the engineers have done the best they could with compromises they have to work with - i.e. within their specified design parameters. Still its a great car, there is no denying that. In my opinion Ferrari's should always lean a little more towards peformance/track bias than pure luxury anyway.

Whats interesting about the CS is that Ferrari concentrated much more on the psychology of the racing car and modelled the interior, the sensations, the noises on those feelings. The CS is designed to feel like a lot like a racer but in truth the car would get destroyed on a track by a properly set up, focused 360 challenge car. Thats not the point of these cars however, its how it makes the driver feel, etc. They do a great job at pushing all the right buttons, making you feel special and a hero all at the push of a 'race' button A very special car for years to come. It will be interesting to see how fair history will be to them in the longer term because look at cars like the 348 GTC, also very special cars but not silly money compared to their more common 348 counterparts...

 

Great info, thanks.

 

It is clear that the CS will always command a premium over the bog standard 360 modena and spider models. However, it is also pretty clear that prices will be affected (slowly) by the availability of the 430S and the fact that CS's are now starting to fall out of warranty coverage meaning big bills for their (future) owners...

However, there will not be a sudden 'collapse' of prices, and the CS will be a more highly regarded model than other 360s. It is not an 'investment' model yet - but that time may come in 10 - 15 years time.

All IMHO ofcourse!

 

Even if the price declines in the near future, the facts are:
- the car total production was less than 400
- the car is and will remain an icon
- any decent collection of Ferrari will have one
In time it will therefore regain its value and more...

 

The claim that the CS would be "destroyed" on a track by a properly set up, focused 360 challenge car, may sound extreme, but its very likely true. I saw this general principle demonstrated at a recent track event that included a modified Ford GT (650HP), a Carrera GT, a 430, and a rather uninspiring looking NASCAR american vehicle (don't even know what make. The Nascar type vehicle beat them all.

 

Don't understand the comparison between a production street car to dedicated track car and what relevance any of this has to the current and future value of the CS.

 

Drew, Your right, the subject went off topic a bit.

To be fair, this whole 'future value' thing is a bit like trying to guess the weather from looking into a crystal ball. Just a few pieces of information isnt enough, we will all just be adding personal opinions and speculation but we wont have all the correct information required to be very accurate. Even if we did have perfect information (hyperthetically) it would still be too complicated to add into a meaniful model that could accurately predict the prices anyway It costs millions to just work out the weather for just 12 hours from now What I am trying to say is nobody can really ever guess with any certainty because there are just too many variables, the economy and interest rates included.

The fact we know some things like rarity of the model helps enomously but looking at this information in isolation doesnt really help us all that much. When we bring in understanding of exactly what the car brings, understanding the appeal of the model, well I would then argue thats highly relevant to this thread and how we individually (and collectively) percieve its future value against other newer models such as the 430 Scuderia. Thats probably more relevant than we all yet understand. Who knows, let the future roll on.

 

This is the peak of driving season right now.

Wait until the fall, there will be tons of ads for them again.

 

Maybe where you live....peak driving (and Ferrari selling) season here is November - March when the weather is glorious and snowbirds return.

 

Prices will be directly correlated to the rate at which those who own them decide to part with them. Just ask most any CS owner if they plan on selling their cars in the future. Most I've spoken with are intent on keeping the CS for an extended period / love them. Also, I suspect that value will also be driven by uniqueness of color. Lot's of Reds and Reds with stripes. Black, TDFs and other non-traditional colors may actually command a slight premium. I would be surprised to see the market flooded with CS's due to the existence of the 430S. Both the 430 and the 430S (as well as the 430 Spyder) are all better performing and more refined cars; but as stated earlier, the limited run of the CS's combined with the fact that the CS is far more aggressive and appealing than the 360 and 360 Spyder make the uniqueness of the CS all that more majestic. Anyone thinking that they are going to be getting a deal on the CS due to the 430S is probably in for a shock. If anything, the 430S is only bring more attention to the CS.

What remains to be seen is whether the 430S is limited in any way or if it is just a configurable option? This is certainly a question I would like addressed before making an investment in the 430S.

disclaimer: all of this is my opinion.

 

Sometimes it is fun to look back and se how wrong these posts are.
Who could have predicted the economic climate would change so violently

 

I absolutely agree.

 

Let's keep those thoughts close at hand to see how close they are to reality. Prices have tank 25% since you wrote that.
Marty's already dumping his CS and there are a lot on the market.