Portland Front Plate Tickets | Page 3 | FerrariChat

Portland Front Plate Tickets

Discussion in 'Northwest' started by donv, Apr 8, 2008.

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  1. Scotty

    Scotty F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Oct 31, 2003
    9,884
    Oregon
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    Scotty Ferrari
    The ordinance says: "R. That is required by law to display two registration plates if a plate is not displayed on the front and the rear of the vehicle."

    I'm not an attorney, but my guess is "front" is where they would get you, given that your plate was behind the position of the engine (which would make an interesting counter argument for V8 FCars). Or Front = first third, Middle = middle third, and so on.
     
  2. JCW Driver

    JCW Driver Formula Junior

    Oct 24, 2006
    393
    Portland, Oregon
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    Bronson G.
    Odd that on my ticket it said... "No plate on front bumper, no plate in window." Gotta love the consistency.
     
  3. donv

    donv Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Jan 5, 2002
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    That may be true, but clearly it does not say it has to be affixed to the bumper, as it states on the ticket. Furthermore, you could argue that "on the front" means visible from the front, which my plate on the dash is.

     
  4. Jonny Law

    Jonny Law F1 Rookie
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    May 6, 2008
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    Talking to a representative of the state of Washington recently, I mentioned the meter patrol issuing tickets for this "infraction". She was surprised they would be able to do this. The way she put it, "only law enforcement has the ability to write a citation for a vehicle not having proper tags" (in WA). Might want to challenge the state of Oregon on this. Where does it show they have the authority to issue anything beyond parking citations?
     
  5. donv

    donv Two Time F1 World Champ
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    There is a Portland City Ordinance (which I linked to above) which makes it illegal to park a car on city streets without meeting various criteria, including proper tags and displaying front and rear license plates.

    So they are citing me for violating the City Ordinance, not violating state law.

     
  6. dcghostrider

    dcghostrider Karting

    Jun 28, 2006
    169
    mirrors, bumpers, lights along with tons of other saftey infractions. Guess they know how to find the peolpe that will pay. (SCUMBAGS)
     
  7. Forexpreneur

    Forexpreneur Formula Junior

    May 11, 2009
    638
    Portland, OR
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    Alexander Everhart
    #57 Forexpreneur, May 23, 2009
    Last edited: May 23, 2009
    Oops. You can't take the tags off of matresses? ;)
     
  8. AMA328

    AMA328 F1 Rookie

    Nov 12, 2002
    2,518
    ABQ-67me68-OKC :)

    If this is the case, seems like the city ordinance would apply, in regards to not having to be mounted on the actual front bumper.
     
  9. donv

    donv Two Time F1 World Champ
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    The city ordinance is really just repeating the state law. Neither, as far as I can tell, defines "display."

     
  10. Wasco

    Wasco Formula Junior

    Dec 9, 2003
    486
    Salem
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    Randy
    I see that HB 2186 has been gut and stuffed and is as bad as ever. This will cost Oregonians millions.
     
  11. donv

    donv Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Jan 5, 2002
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    I went ahead and asked for a hearing. Based on my phone conversation with the parking tag office, the hearing will be sometime in August.

    My defenses are:

    1) That I did have a plate "displayed" as the ticket admits, and the law does not define "display" and certainly does not define it as "affixed to the front bumper" as the ticket states.

    2) The Oregon State Motor Vehicle code (Title 14), section 801.020(1)(D)(3) states: "The provisions described in this subsection shall be applicable and uniform throughout this state and in all political subdivisions and municipalities therein and on the ocean shore which has been or may hereafter be declared a state recreation area. This subsection applies to provisions of the vehicle code relating to abandoned vehicles, vehicle equipment, regulation of vehicle size, weight and load, the manner of operation of vehicles and use of roads by persons, animals and vehicles."

    The City of Portland imposing it's own fine for registration and license plate displays is not authorized in the state motor vehicle code, and by doing so is violating this section since it is not "applicable and uniform throughout this state."

    Any legal advice would be much appreciated!
     
  12. debriga

    debriga Karting

    Jul 31, 2008
    96
    washington
    Just wondering about this situation a bit, and thinking about some of the questions others have presented here, has piked my interest somewhat. If I remember my old history classes and contemporary world problems courses back in the ancient days that most of you are not old enough to remember, we were taught there is a hierarchy of the superiority of laws passed by various governmental bodies. The US federal laws superseded individual state laws, just the same as the state laws had priority over the county passed laws. Any government body can not pass an enforcable law that is less restrictive than the laws that govern it. For example, the City cannot pass a law that negates a law passed by the county, and so forth.
    Now, if I am not mistaken in the ways of the world in this day and age, it is still permissable for a lower form of goverment to pass and enforce laws and ordinances which are more stringent than a higher form of government has set minimum standards for. In other words, any government body seems to have the power to be more stringent than it's bigger brother, as long as it is not in direct conflict with the intent of it's bigger brother. If there is no conflict, then the lower form of government has the right to enforce that which resides whithin it's jurisdiction.
    I'm no expert, I'm not an attorney, I'm just a little guy trying to make some sense out of this present day and age. So, in my naivety, I can't find or see a legal leg to stand on to circumvent the requirement for a front plate, or to deny the legal authority of the municipal government to require it. UNLESS the city/municipal codes are in direct conflict with county/state/federal laws.
    It does not look good for your argument, I wish I could help, but it seems that this is going to be a done deal in favor of the city!
     
  13. donv

    donv Two Time F1 World Champ
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    I'm not trying to circumvent the requirement for a front plate. I was DISPLAYING a front plate (as was noted on the ticket and as required by both state law and city ordinance), but it was in the windshield and not "affixed to the bumper."

    Argument #2 is, IMO, the weaker of the two. That said, I do believe state law generally trumps municipal ordinance, at least in some areas. I don't think a city could pass a law banning state approved SUVs, for instance. And that's what the Oregon state statute that I cited basically says.

    I do think the odds of a municipal judge ruling in my favor and negating the ordinance are pretty darn slim. And since I'm not an attorney, they're probably even worse than I imagine. But it's worth a shot.

     
  14. F355 Spider

    F355 Spider Formula 3

    Jun 21, 2006
    2,204
    Portland, OR
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    Sonny

    Well, I guess next time I see you I owe you $5.00.....
     
  15. Forexpreneur

    Forexpreneur Formula Junior

    May 11, 2009
    638
    Portland, OR
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    Alexander Everhart
    I'm glad you are fighting it Don and sincerely hope you win. Too many people are just letting government roll them over and very few are fighting. I have always said "A democracy becomes a beuracracy when the people become complacent." People have become too complacent. Glad you are not.

    Best wishes.
     
  16. donv

    donv Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Jan 5, 2002
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    Anyone have an attorney they'd recommend for an hour or two of research on these topics?

    I can call my regular guy, but an attorney who is a car enthusiast might be more helpful.

    My court date is September 1.
     
  17. donv

    donv Two Time F1 World Champ
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    No luck at all. The judge was not sympathetic to front plate defenses-- although he offered pretty much everyone a "fix it" opportunity.

    I was surprised at the number of people who contested front plate tickets-- and every single one of them, without fail, protested that they had the plate on the windshield. More than half of the people at the hearing were there due to missing front plates.

    After I watched him shoot down the first batch of defendants (one guy said "the guy at the DMV told me it was okay to display it in the windshield"-- Judge: "The guy at the DMV was wrong!"), I gave up and changed my plea to guilty, as I could see nothing I could say would matter.

    Incidentally, in case you have any idea about arguing that placing the plate on the windshield means anything, read this recent case:

    http://www.publications.ojd.state.or.us/A133428.htm
     
  18. 2000 456M

    2000 456M F1 World Champ

    Sep 29, 2007
    12,600
    Portland, OR
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    Allan
    The case is the last word: completely dispositive of the issue, it's recent and, as it has not been taken up by the Supreme Court, it's the law of the land throughout the state. No wiggle room.
     

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