does anybody other than me miss Pininfarina?

I totally agree with you. Pininfarina's design was/is very beautiful. Those Ferraris are great!

Agree with you. A little bit of Corvette..

 

LOL, they really seemed to get some major details way wrong with the 812. The FF love it or hate it at least had that PF organic elegant lines and the GTC4Lusso though it may be more immediately gratifying and maybe reconciled some of the rear proportions of the FF it simply looks like a regular car. Change the tail lights and it could be a Mercedes. There is no magic.

 

+1

812 is what happens when primitive 'Americans' are put in charge of something.

 

The lead designer of Ferrari design is Italian.

 

Im referring to American as someone who believes in Americanism as an ideology since it isn't an authentic ethnic/cultural group.

American culture took over at Ferrari since the IPO even though it was already creeping in with mass commercialization earlier. The end result is monstrosities like the 812(which is already compared to a mix of vette/viper). What is American culture? Accounting and reducing everything to a 'profitable sale'. Tradition is seen as a barrier to the market.

 

F12 was designed in house too.

 

I think 95% of all modern car design is inferior to previous generations.

 

F12 is a nice design I agree...( although if being picky, the nose is a little too "chunky")

 

Pininfarina were in financial difficulties for 10 years and in 2015 the Mahindra Group, owner of Indian automobile company Mahindra & Mahindra agreed to buy them in a deal worth about 168 million euros ($185 million). In addition to buying stock, Mahindra invested 20 million euros in Pininfarina and provide a guarantee to creditors of 114.5 million euros.

This has little to do with design but is probably explains why Ferrari decided to set up an in-house design group during a period of major uncertainty. There seemed a real risk that their favoured carozzeria would go out of business.

Other factors are manufacturing methods - current cars built in large numbers must be compatible with automated machinery, aerodynamics and legislative constraints.

Sadly, the shapes produced by hand by Pierro or his mates using wooden formers are long gone. That is not an excuse for blandness or is some cases ugliness but whoever designs the new cars has to work within constraints unimagined by Enzo and Battista when they talked about new designs over a cappuccino!

 

+1 as a general matter. Slightly off-topic, but at least previously cars looked distinct. Now most cars look like one another.

 

Haha, last time I took my 360 out for a spin an LP560-4 pulled up next to me and asked what model my car was followed by the year of make. When I said 2004, his eye balls almost popped out.

The only thing bland about the 360s styling are its starfish wheels. They look fantastic on anything BUT the 360.

Yes I miss Pininfarina.

 

I did wonder if the when i saw the Pininfarina Fittipaldi EF7 if it was a study that may have developed into being the "LaFerrari"....

I'm a big fan of the Pininfarina Fittipaldi's stance, front, side and top view ( not a big fan of the rear)

https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/motor-shows-geneva-motor-show/600bhp-pininfarina-fittipaldi-ef7-track-car-revealed


FITTIPALDI EF7 VISION GRAN TURISMO BY PININFARINA < Pininfarina

 

Cars and women are supposed to have curves. Nuff said.

 

The reason why classic design was so much more creative was

1) fewer people involved on every level (the Jag E type is a perfect example)
2) less or even almost no regulations
3) costs were figured out later after the design
4) real craftsman molded the shapes with the designers understanding and adjusting. Panel beating is sculpting (as is clay modeling). Good designers worked in 3d.
5) cars were simpler to construct with ordinary tools
6) quality control and reliability were not high on the priority list
7) budgets were LOW -- changes are expensive.
8) no sales people trying to make products for the 99 percentile. Try to be 6 foot 2 and get in 246 Dino GT. Part of the Dino's charm is its rather small size.
9) no marketing geniuses who think you have to "retro" every car because they think consumers can be scared of "new" (makes you wonder if anyone today could come up with the 64 Mustang and get it produced).
10) the requirement for lavish and even outrageous customization for maximum profit.


Today its all computers and calculations. Engineers put in mythical "aero" simulations and change shapes for "efficiency". Next they put in off the shelf auto parts from various suppliers to keep costs down. Regulations tell them what they can and cannot do. Sales people say you need the latest electronic gadget to make consumers happy. Everyone has a piece in the pie. Do you know why 3 pedal cars are on the way out? In many cars (particularly small ones), the 3rd pedal won't pass the crash test.

What you get is something a lot of people sort of like but no one really loves.

And, a LOT of these change in the way exotic cars were made are from the early 80's to today. We aren't just talking about the 1960's here.

Did Pininfarina have a stronger say so at Ferrari than their inhouse designers do now? Probably. But there's a lot of technical factors. It's a different business and its still changing.

 

Avenatador; The 4th variation of the Countach
Fisker: Maserati Grandturismo which has a very 60's retro flair -- based on the Maserati Birdcage show car which looked like 60's show cars
DB 11: the 26th version of the DB4
Alfa 8c and 4c: Also very retro inspired including the Stradale (maybe the best of the 60's)
Huyara: We are only talking about GOOD looking cars. That car is a mess
Mustang: The 8th version from 1963
Viper: Retro Shelby AC cobra


Where is today's ALFA STRADALE?

 

Really? Curious why the current PF site shows a great image of the F12 on their automotive page with the following detail:
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

I didn't say these cars were ugly. I said they were not inspiring. Marketing people just want to reinvent the wheel. Designers DON'T!

When the Aventador came down I'm sure the marketing department said "make it look like a new Countach".

My god... how many times can Aston Martin recycle the same ol' thing????

Designers are not the problem. Marketing people are. THEY make the final decisions. Not the designers.

 

I suppose it's relative. When the 308, TR, 355, etc. came out, I'm sure many were longing for the "old days" of the 275, Daytona, etc. I personally agree that Ferrari's latest cars are not as aesthetically pleasing as the Pininfarina cars, but that is my opinion. A lot of kids today find the LaFerrari the most appealing of the five supercars, and kids ten years ago might think the Enzo is; personally, I don't think the Enzo or the LaF is truly beautiful (striking, yes). I find few new cars on the market today to be truly attractive. I liked the Murcielago more than the Aventador too.

Ten years from now, I'm sure some people will compare the then new Ferraris to the dated 488s/812s; it's all subjective, but yes, I agree with the OP - I miss Pininfarina design.

 

Many people forget that Bertone came up with the shape for The Golf.

Even today almost every hatchback (especially VW's) copy from it all those years later.

 

I miss bold designs.

 

12 trs and j50 look really good imo.
And Pinin's proposal for the laferrari was really meh imo so I'm not complaining. Let's see the 488 replacement before judging

 

Pininfarina started to lose their way IMO from 1995 to 2006. They seemed to be getting back on track 2008+. I really started to look forward to seeing their new designs again with the 458 Italia, F12 and Speciale.

 

A very clear and helpful post. Agree completely.