Body bar on late 308’s | FerrariChat

Body bar on late 308’s

Discussion in '308/328' started by Alex N, Mar 29, 2021.

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  1. Alex N

    Alex N Karting

    Mar 29, 2021
    184
    Full Name:
    Vincent Napoliello
    I have been trying to educate myself on the 308 and have spent days on the car as I am interested in one but I can’t figure out some late 308’s have a black bar behind the rear window going across on the outside of the body and some don’t , I like the look without it , but what is it ? why is it there ? when did they start to put it there? etc. etc. what do you guys know about it , thank you in advance
     
  2. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Jan 11, 2001
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    30°30'40" N 97°35'41" W (Texas)
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    Steve Magnusson
    Ferrari calls it a "Spoiler":

    https://www.ferrariparts.co.uk/diagram/ferrari/308-quattrovalvole/101-body-shell-outer-elements (#57 on this page)

    I believe it's something that can be retrofitted to earlier 308B/S so, like wheels, nothing is fixed in stone. In the F spare parts manuals, it first appears in the 308QV and 208 Turbo documentation (don't know which of those came first). I'm sure F had some psuedo-technical BS to justify why you absolutely need one, but I'd wager a lot of the reason was (just fresh) styling ;).
     
  3. Vinsanity

    Vinsanity Karting

    Sep 9, 2013
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    #3 Vinsanity, Mar 29, 2021
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2021
    At first glance, its easy to say that it serves no real aerodynamic function, but I actually think that at speed, the wing (it's actually a wing, and not a spoiler, because air can flow on both sides) helps extract hot air from the engine decklid vents by producing a low-pressure, high velocity region between the buttresses. Without it, I'll bet you get a much larger stagnant zone behind the window.

    I suppose I could test that theory with a bunch of strands of yarn, some painters tape and a Go-Pro... Maybe when I get my motor back in...
     
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  4. Alex N

    Alex N Karting

    Mar 29, 2021
    184
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    Vincent Napoliello
    Thanks how does it attach, are there holes in the upper panel and cars without the spoiler/wing don’t have holes for mounting?
     
  5. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Jan 11, 2001
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    Yes -- but I believe you could add holes to an older 308B/S to mount the spoiler, or fill the holes on a later 308B/S to remove it.
     
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  6. nerofer

    nerofer F1 World Champ

    Mar 26, 2011
    11,990
    FRANCE
    It has already been discussed at length on this forum in a few threads.
    The roof spoiler appeared on the 365 BB, when it became obvious that there was a boundary layer problem above the engine hood vents: hot air remained stagnant in the engine compartment; so, to help extract it, a spoiler was added on all BBs. All BBs were delivered with it.

    On 308s, and 328s, the spoiler has no other purpose than aesthetics; proof is that it always remained an option in Europe: should you want your car with it, you had to pay extra. Euro 3x8s are often seen without the spoiler; my '89 328 GTB was ordered without one, my '89 GTS with one. The are no difference in engine temperatures between the two, by the way, at least on the gauges...

    In the US, most cars were delivered "all options included": for instance, Air Conditioning remained an option in Europe until the very last 328: you wanted A:C, you had to pay extra for it. ABS, which appeared in February 1988 on 328s in Europe also remained an option until the end of production (my '89 GTB has it, my '89 GTS does not) whereas in the US all "88 1/2" were delivered without it, all MY 89 were delivered with it.
    I know of only a very small number of 328s delivered without the spoiler in the US, when the customer specifically asked for the car to be delivered so. Otherwise, they were all delivered with it.

    The spiler has two protruding bolts each side; on my '89 GTB, ordered without spoiler, the holes for it are already drilled in the inside sheet metal of the engine hood, but not on the outside
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  7. Alex N

    Alex N Karting

    Mar 29, 2021
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    Vincent Napoliello
    Thanks for that info. If it really has no real world of fact I prefer the look of the cars without it
     
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  8. Alex N

    Alex N Karting

    Mar 29, 2021
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    Vincent Napoliello
    No real world effect, I meant. Autocorrect
     
  9. miketuason

    miketuason F1 World Champ
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    Was there a wind tunnel test and proof of this?
     
  10. AZDoug

    AZDoug Formula 3

    Jun 17, 2009
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    I don't need no steeking wind tunnel.

    I don't have a vid, but if I did, it would show that the factory 308 aero is "most' excellent for sucking air from under neath the car and up out of the vents.
    How do i know this?
    They were doing some road work and the construction people left a ~!1/4' thick layer of very fine powdery talc like material on about 50 feet of the road road.

    At 35 MPH, the plume of white dust sucked off the road, over the engine and out the vent extended almost 4 feet above the car.

    It looked like an old coal burning locomotive plume according to a friend behind me. Made a mess on the engine, deck lid and vents.

    Doug
     
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  11. miketuason

    miketuason F1 World Champ
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    Sounds great i guess that will do plus I think Vinsanity is right about the rear spoiler does create some kind of air turbulance that helps sucks some of that hot air out from the engine compartment.
     
  12. thorn

    thorn F1 Rookie
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    Aug 7, 2012
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    Tallahassee, FL
    My Euro doesn't have the spoiler. I kind of like the look of it, so I bought a nice used one (from Mitchell, I believe?) and intended to drill the car and install it. But over time, I'm used to the car without it.

    So now I have a spoiler sitting on a shelf.
     
  13. Alex N

    Alex N Karting

    Mar 29, 2021
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    Vincent Napoliello
    I think they look way better without it and you’d have to be nuts to drill the holes
     
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  14. Dr Tommy Cosgrove

    Dr Tommy Cosgrove Three Time F1 World Champ
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    It is decoration only option beginning on the QV's in 83.

    As far as "cooling effect", think about that for a moment.

    QV's *sometimes* run hot in stop and go traffic. This is a known well documented long standing issue since they were new. Depending on the climate - or some other yet to be identified factor - some do just fine. Others. like MINE will max out the water temp if I get stuck in traffic. There is nothing I haven't "fixed" on my cooling system in the past 24 years to solve this challenge. We can bat this ball back and forth in another discussion.

    BUT my point is this; QV's get hot sitting still, not moving. So if that thing does anything it does it when you are moving and don't need the help.

    In other words, your water temp needle isn't going to swing right on the highway if you don't have one.
     
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  15. Dr Tommy Cosgrove

    Dr Tommy Cosgrove Three Time F1 World Champ
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    I do too.

    But to each his own.
     
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  16. Albert-LP

    Albert-LP F1 Veteran
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    Sep 1, 2010
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    It was an option, very likely much more aesthetic than functional. Looks good (imho) if coupled with 308 QV deep front spoiler (an option as well).

    The only cars that had both as standard were the 308 Millechiodi (a 1977 prototype, an early GTO) and the Italian market only 208 Turbo (1982)

    ciao
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